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What are your skill tolerances?
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Xanato Kaso
Frozen Flames
#1 - 2014-10-26 07:31:40 UTC
So when training skills when do you decide getting a skill from IV to V is not worth it? And I mean skills that level V is not required for a another skill. At what point do you say, I am not wasting that much time for level V.

For me, if it takes more than a week I will probably not train a skill to V unless it is needed or does something special. Like as much as I love my Paladin, I will probably never Get marauders V. Or the Tracking enhancing skill that takes 13 days to train.
Velarra
#2 - 2014-10-26 15:15:40 UTC
Rationally, - a V isn't worth it if it's the only V you're considering in a category and its gains vs. time to acquire are extremely marginal. For instance weapon specialization skills that add 2% to the spec.

Later, when for whatever reason, you start running out of skills to train, - I'd suggest that again, single V's don't really matter particularly those that add only a tiny margin of improvement. However, at that point in time, skilling up pockets of focused and acutely related V's that alone offer marginal increase might be seen as worth it if you skill the full, complimentary set.

One might also apply the latter to an acutely focused alt (eg. ship-type/class alt, ) to squeeze the most out of its SP. Particularly if it will permanently stop training once its skilling for its intended role is complete.
Xanato Kaso
Frozen Flames
#3 - 2014-10-27 01:57:25 UTC
Velarra wrote:
Rationally, - a V isn't worth it if it's the only V you're considering in a category and its gains vs. time to acquire are extremely marginal. For instance weapon specialization skills that add 2% to the spec.

Later, when for whatever reason, you start running out of skills to train, - I'd suggest that again, single V's don't really matter particularly those that add only a tiny margin of improvement. However, at that point in time, skilling up pockets of focused and acutely related V's that alone offer marginal increase might be seen as worth it if you skill the full, complimentary set.

One might also apply the latter to an acutely focused alt (eg. ship-type/class alt, ) to squeeze the most out of its SP. Particularly if it will permanently stop training once its skilling for its intended role is complete.



You seemed to miss the point of the post. I wasnt looking for advice, or a how to be a cookie cutter. I was looking to create an anecdotal thread of when you just throw your hands up and say "F**K it Im not waiting that long for a skill"
Ria Nieyli
Nieyli Enterprises
When Fleets Collide
#4 - 2014-10-27 07:27:18 UTC
Xanato Kaso wrote:
Velarra wrote:
Rationally, - a V isn't worth it if it's the only V you're considering in a category and its gains vs. time to acquire are extremely marginal. For instance weapon specialization skills that add 2% to the spec.

Later, when for whatever reason, you start running out of skills to train, - I'd suggest that again, single V's don't really matter particularly those that add only a tiny margin of improvement. However, at that point in time, skilling up pockets of focused and acutely related V's that alone offer marginal increase might be seen as worth it if you skill the full, complimentary set.

One might also apply the latter to an acutely focused alt (eg. ship-type/class alt, ) to squeeze the most out of its SP. Particularly if it will permanently stop training once its skilling for its intended role is complete.



You seemed to miss the point of the post. I wasnt looking for advice, or a how to be a cookie cutter. I was looking to create an anecdotal thread of when you just throw your hands up and say "F**K it Im not waiting that long for a skill"


"Do I need another skill more than I need this?"

If yes, train the other skill. If no, train the skill I'm debating. It can get a bit wonky when you've put together a 5-year skillplan as some of the choices are not immediately obvious unless you take the whole plan into account, but the basic principle is there.
Sexy Cakes
Have A Seat
#5 - 2014-10-27 13:05:24 UTC
Usually for me it comes down to how many ships said skill applies to. If it applies to all ships then I don't mind how long it takes.

Not today spaghetti.
Dominique Vasilkovsky
#6 - 2014-10-27 17:06:31 UTC
Xanato Kaso wrote:
So when training skills when do you decide getting a skill from IV to V is not worth it? And I mean skills that level V is not required for a another skill. At what point do you say, I am not wasting that much time for level V.

For me, if it takes more than a week I will probably not train a skill to V unless it is needed or does something special. Like as much as I love my Paladin, I will probably never Get marauders V. Or the Tracking enhancing skill that takes 13 days to train.

I just train up all non capital skills matching my current attributes to 5. The new unlimited skill queue will come in very handy for this.
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
#7 - 2014-10-28 07:15:54 UTC  |  Edited by: Tau Cabalander
Ask yourself, "Will another skill benefit me more NOW than this one?"

Only train level 5 if:
* It is a skill you personally consider indispensable.
* It is a prerequisite for something you really want, and will affect your current gameplay (not future gameplay).
* You want to specialize, at the price of less versatility.
* You have nothing else to train.

Example: I trained Launcher Rigging 5 for a fit that I really wanted to use. It is the only rigging skill I have at level 5. I won't bother to train the others until I need them, or run-out of other more important skills to train. Oh, and I no longer use that fit. Roll

Xanato Kaso wrote:
You seemed to miss the point of the post. I wasnt looking for advice, or a how to be a cookie cutter. I was looking to create an anecdotal thread of when you just throw your hands up and say "F**K it Im not waiting that long for a skill"

I don't find any skill I want, or need, and am ready for, to be too long to train. If you do, that's a hint you shouldn't be training it yet. Blink
Jacob Holland
Weyland-Vulcan Industries
#8 - 2014-10-28 08:06:30 UTC
I would say that, in general terms, it's probably 1-2% of the character's age.
Obviously there are other considerations:
What else is there to train?
What else needs to be trained?
What is the remap suited to?
How much playtime will benefit from the investment?
Mining [5] doesn't unlock anything of real benefit to most younger characters - however someone who sees themselves as a miner is likely to train it reasonably early because it effects a very high proportion of their playtime.
(and of course)
Might I have won that fight if..?
Jur Tissant
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#9 - 2014-10-28 13:19:40 UTC
I almost never train V unless it's necessary for a much better module, a ship, or another skill. The exception is in PI where I train CCU/IC to V for obvious reasons.
RavenPaine
RaVeN Alliance
#10 - 2014-10-28 15:41:04 UTC
I still have a lot of skills at level 3. Sometimes, I'd rather train a skill I use to V, than train 2 or 3 shorter skills to IV.

If I use the ship, or use the skill on a regular basis, I want all the relevant the skills at V.
When I make my decision on 'what's next', it generally revolves around, 'what am I flying next week'.
Jeremy Kamira
#11 - 2014-10-28 18:19:27 UTC
I am quite new, so my opinion won't be worth as much as other's, but this is how i see it.

Training a skill from 1-4 means you get 80% of the bonus, and it takes 25% of the total time to train it to V.
Training a skill from 4-5 means you get 20% of the bonus, and it takes 75% of the total time to train it to V.
(these are just rough estimates)

I personally feel like training all the skills to 80% is good enough, and that you need to focus training all of your other relevant skills to IV first before you consider any V's (Not including any pre-requisite items)


TLDR: Train everything relevant to IV before considering training it to V
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
#12 - 2014-10-28 21:11:21 UTC
Jeremy Kamira wrote:
Training a skill from 1-4 means you get 80% of the bonus, and it takes 25% of the total time to train it to V.
Training a skill from 4-5 means you get 20% of the bonus, and it takes 75% of the total time to train it to V.
(these are just rough estimates)

Exact numbers (because I'm OCD).

Level 4: 45255 skill points * rank
Level 5: 256000 skill points * rank

Level 4 vs. Level 5: 45255 / 256000 = 17.67% of the training time.

So level 4 is 80% of the benefit for 17.67% of the training time.
Hippinse
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#13 - 2014-11-02 03:18:28 UTC
Tau Cabalander wrote:
Jeremy Kamira wrote:
Training a skill from 1-4 means you get 80% of the bonus, and it takes 25% of the total time to train it to V.
Training a skill from 4-5 means you get 20% of the bonus, and it takes 75% of the total time to train it to V.
(these are just rough estimates)

Exact numbers (because I'm OCD).

Level 4: 45255 skill points * rank
Level 5: 256000 skill points * rank

Level 4 vs. Level 5: 45255 / 256000 = 17.67% of the training time.

So level 4 is 80% of the benefit for 17.67% of the training time.



Pfft. Then explain what happened to the missing 2.33%, Professor?!?
Anthar Peva
Doomheim
#14 - 2014-11-02 03:35:02 UTC
Hippinse wrote:
Tau Cabalander wrote:
Jeremy Kamira wrote:
Training a skill from 1-4 means you get 80% of the bonus, and it takes 25% of the total time to train it to V.
Training a skill from 4-5 means you get 20% of the bonus, and it takes 75% of the total time to train it to V.
(these are just rough estimates)

Exact numbers (because I'm OCD).

Level 4: 45255 skill points * rank
Level 5: 256000 skill points * rank

Level 4 vs. Level 5: 45255 / 256000 = 17.67% of the training time.

So level 4 is 80% of the benefit for 17.67% of the training time.



Pfft. Then explain what happened to the missing 2.33%, Professor?!?
O.o
Unless this was sarcasm (which I can't detect).. Are you an idiot? The 80% and the 17.67% are 2 different stats. 80% is the % of the benefit that you get and 17.67% is the % of the training time it takes to get 80%
GordonO
BURN EDEN
#15 - 2014-11-02 22:21:58 UTC
depends on what you plan to fly and spend most of youre time in. ie, if you plan to spend a lot of time recon ships, then level 5 is very handy, best to check ship bonus's.

... What next ??
Casey Fisher
Happy Unicorn Gank Squad
#16 - 2014-11-04 22:29:52 UTC
Hippinse wrote:
Tau Cabalander wrote:
Jeremy Kamira wrote:
Training a skill from 1-4 means you get 80% of the bonus, and it takes 25% of the total time to train it to V.
Training a skill from 4-5 means you get 20% of the bonus, and it takes 75% of the total time to train it to V.
(these are just rough estimates)

Exact numbers (because I'm OCD).

Level 4: 45255 skill points * rank
Level 5: 256000 skill points * rank

Level 4 vs. Level 5: 45255 / 256000 = 17.67% of the training time.

So level 4 is 80% of the benefit for 17.67% of the training time.



Pfft. Then explain what happened to the missing 2.33%, Professor?!?


lol Biomass yourself. Professor!!
NeCrox
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#17 - 2014-11-06 00:18:54 UTC
I personally train all the skills to 5 why you ask because 1 I may need it 5 for something else or 2 that bonus just might save your butt in a fight . in the end it all works out
ggodhsup
relocation LLC.
#18 - 2014-11-14 21:54:46 UTC
i only train to 5 if i need every bit of benefit possible, ie. , weapon and drone skills and ship skills like racial cruiser and relating t2 skills.

actually on my main right now its pretty much all lvl 5 training....little more gratification but it takes forever sometimes.

im really disliking only getting one or two skills in a sub period.

oh yeah and casey fisher, your avatar is awesome.
Awesome MILF
Doomheim
#19 - 2014-11-14 23:00:34 UTC
From my experience level 5 makes a big difference, although the theoretical numbers seem small, every bit counts.

In example sometimes you improve a 2% damage here, or a 3% rate of fire there, and suddenly the rats get killed 25% faster. Not sure if you share this feeling.
Dir Zen
Tax Haven 5.0
#20 - 2014-11-18 04:52:02 UTC  |  Edited by: Dir Zen
Awesome MILF wrote:
From my experience level 5 makes a big difference, although the theoretical numbers seem small, every bit counts.

In example sometimes you improve a 2% damage here, or a 3% rate of fire there, and suddenly the rats get killed 25% faster. Not sure if you share this feeling.


Yeah I feel you. It has to do with the quicker breaking of the target's tank which means less active/passive repairs can be done, which in turn speeds up the kill much more than say a flat 2 or 5% increase. This took a while for me to realize, at least. So level 5's are a major increase in your combat performance, even if it doesn't look like much.
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