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Crime & Punishment

 
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Who Gets All The Freighter Ganking Loot?
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Angelique Duchemin
Team Evil
#141 - 2014-10-19 07:54:25 UTC  |  Edited by: Angelique Duchemin
Veers Belvar wrote:
to appropriately deal with the way bumping is used by gankers.


Problem solved. Double EHP

The very sun of heaven seemed distorted when viewed through the polarising miasma welling out from this sea-soaked perversion, and twisted menace and suspense lurked leeringly in those crazily elusive angles of carven rock where a second glance shewed concavity after the first shewed convexity.

Anal Canal
The Conference Elite
Safety.
#142 - 2014-10-19 08:19:50 UTC
Veers Belvar wrote:
My impression is that the individual gankers get to keep the freighter loot, that is the incentive for participating in the gank fleets. As far as being a company, CODE should be in Chapter 7 liquidation, as it endlessly bleeds money with no hope of ever making a profit. The "shareholders" are mostly incredibly bored nullsec folks looking for "tears," as their own area of the game is painfully stagnant and miserable.

In the end, the solution to stopping CODE isn't AG fleets or lame player driven attempts to regulate highsec, as the current mechanics make that effectively impossible. The solution is longer aggression timers for -10 sec status gankers and a crackdown on bumping.



Technically you just describe a 501(c)-3.

The Artist Formerly Known As AC. 

The terminal end of the digestive system. 

The Best CSM Candidate
Anal Canal
The Conference Elite
Safety.
#143 - 2014-10-19 08:21:54 UTC
Veers Belvar wrote:
Iain Cariaba wrote:
Veers Belvar wrote:
My impression is that the individual gankers get to keep the freighter loot, that is the incentive for participating in the gank fleets. As far as being a company, CODE should be in Chapter 7 liquidation, as it endlessly bleeds money with no hope of ever making a profit. The "shareholders" are mostly incredibly bored nullsec folks looking for "tears," as their own area of the game is painfully stagnant and miserable.

In the end, the solution to stopping CODE isn't AG fleets or lame player driven attempts to regulate highsec, as the current mechanics make that effectively impossible. The solution is longer aggression timers for -10 sec status gankers and a crackdown on bumping.

Ah yes, typical Veers logic. Highsec ganking will never be nerfed enough for Veers until he can fully bot his incursions, risk free from any kind of negative player interaction. Nerfs for all that may threaten the mighty killmail *****, Veers Belvar!!!!

No matter how you nerf ganking and bumping, it will always remain. The gankers will always adapt. Carebears like Veers will always whine for more nerfs. After all, it seems to be the nature of the carebear to simply stick his fingers in his ears and start screeching for nerfs any time the ganker tries to tell him how to not get ganked.


That was such a delusional post that I can only assume it was a failed troll attempt. Let's try some facts, for a change:

1. Incursions cannot be botted. Between moving, shooting, broadcasting, switching sites, contests, FC orders, etc.... it is completely impossible to bot them. Find a new talking point.

2. Incursion running is already pretty gank proof. Between competent pilots, logis on grid, and boosts, the gankers don't even bother. It's the miners and haulers, who cannot shoot back, that they target. And it is for them that I express my sympathies.

3. Nerfs to achieve appropriate balance are laudable. The goal isn't to stop all ganking, rather the goal is to provide for appropriate punishments for criminal activity, and to appropriately deal with the way bumping is used by gankers.

Please do try a bit harder next time, the quality of the CODE posters here has been in something of a tailspin of late.



How about this fleet running incursions?

I just became moistened watching that FYI.

The Artist Formerly Known As AC. 

The terminal end of the digestive system. 

The Best CSM Candidate
Veers Belvar
Swordmasters of New Eden
#144 - 2014-10-19 08:37:35 UTC
CALDARI CITIZEN 14330909 wrote:
Veers Belvar wrote:
My impression is that the individual gankers get to keep the freighter loot, that is the incentive for participating in the gank fleets. As far as being a company, CODE should be in Chapter 7 liquidation, as it endlessly bleeds money with no hope of ever making a profit. The "shareholders" are mostly incredibly bored nullsec folks looking for "tears," as their own area of the game is painfully stagnant and miserable.

In the end, the solution to stopping CODE isn't AG fleets or lame player driven attempts to regulate highsec, as the current mechanics make that effectively impossible. The solution is longer aggression timers for -10 sec status gankers and a crackdown on bumping.



Technically you just describe a 501(c)-3.


501 (c)(3)'s are not pitched as "investment opportunities," nor do they entertain the payment of dividends. CODE is a massive ponzi scheme with no hope of ever turning a profit. James 315, who already ran one such scheme in the past, is doing it yet again. It's like putting Bernie Madoff in charge of the Fed.
Veers Belvar
Swordmasters of New Eden
#145 - 2014-10-19 08:38:41 UTC
Angelique Duchemin wrote:
Veers Belvar wrote:
to appropriately deal with the way bumping is used by gankers.


Problem solved. Double EHP


Good catch. Because max tanked freighters and JFs haven't been dying in Uedama. Less Goon rhetoric and more facts, please. Or at least spice it up with a 300 mil scam offer to join Goonwaffe or something.
Anal Canal
The Conference Elite
Safety.
#146 - 2014-10-19 08:46:35 UTC
Veers Belvar wrote:
CALDARI CITIZEN 14330909 wrote:
Veers Belvar wrote:
My impression is that the individual gankers get to keep the freighter loot, that is the incentive for participating in the gank fleets. As far as being a company, CODE should be in Chapter 7 liquidation, as it endlessly bleeds money with no hope of ever making a profit. The "shareholders" are mostly incredibly bored nullsec folks looking for "tears," as their own area of the game is painfully stagnant and miserable.

In the end, the solution to stopping CODE isn't AG fleets or lame player driven attempts to regulate highsec, as the current mechanics make that effectively impossible. The solution is longer aggression timers for -10 sec status gankers and a crackdown on bumping.



Technically you just describe a 501(c)-3.


501 (c)(3)'s are not pitched as "investment opportunities," nor do they entertain the payment of dividends. CODE is a massive ponzi scheme with no hope of ever turning a profit. James 315, who already ran one such scheme in the past, is doing it yet again. It's like putting Bernie Madoff in charge of the Fed.



James 315 has stated multiple times that shares do not pay dividends.

The Artist Formerly Known As AC. 

The terminal end of the digestive system. 

The Best CSM Candidate
Angelique Duchemin
Team Evil
#147 - 2014-10-19 08:48:30 UTC  |  Edited by: Angelique Duchemin
Veers Belvar wrote:
Angelique Duchemin wrote:
Veers Belvar wrote:
to appropriately deal with the way bumping is used by gankers.


Problem solved. Double EHP


Good catch. Because max tanked freighters and JFs haven't been dying in Uedama. Less Goon rhetoric and more facts, please. Or at least spice it up with a 300 mil scam offer to join Goonwaffe or something.


Link the kill.


And you could never join GoonWaffe. Your frail human frame would never survive the transformation.

The very sun of heaven seemed distorted when viewed through the polarising miasma welling out from this sea-soaked perversion, and twisted menace and suspense lurked leeringly in those crazily elusive angles of carven rock where a second glance shewed concavity after the first shewed convexity.

Black Pedro
Mine.
#148 - 2014-10-19 08:56:42 UTC  |  Edited by: Black Pedro
Veers Belvar wrote:

501 (c)(3)'s are not pitched as "investment opportunities," nor do they entertain the payment of dividends. CODE is a massive ponzi scheme with no hope of ever turning a profit. James 315, who already ran one such scheme in the past, is doing it yet again. It's like putting Bernie Madoff in charge of the Fed.


Come now, it is not a Ponzi scheme if everyone participating knows there will be no monetary return on the investment. It's more like a charity, or perhaps more accurately a non-profit, by which the return takes the form of social change in highsec, with a serving of entertainment on the side (www.minerbumping.com).

The SRP has had in the past much more ISK than the 30B or so currently in the fund and the Saviour didn't "cash out". If this is all an elaborate scam by James 315 for ISK, then he is playing the really long game, and to be honest, earning it through the countless hours he must devote to managing the Catalyst replacement fund and the near-daily minerbumping posts that has, in part, kept the New Order going for two years now. But even then, the New Order has already delivered more than the promised value to the shareholders.

The 8 Golden Rules of Eve

Why Do They Gank?
Dmitri Dracov
Flames Of Chaos
Great Wildlands Conservation Society
#149 - 2014-10-19 11:06:15 UTC
It's not a ponzi scheme, it's a few industrious individuals making a lot of isk by rounding up bored F1 monkey pressers and providing them with 'tears', 'content' and a nice killmail to whore on.

Why bother getting lots of Isoboxer accounts when there are plenty of idiots willing to loan you their accounts for free?
Veers Belvar
Swordmasters of New Eden
#150 - 2014-10-19 11:13:39 UTC
Angelique Duchemin wrote:
Veers Belvar wrote:
Angelique Duchemin wrote:
Veers Belvar wrote:
to appropriately deal with the way bumping is used by gankers.


Problem solved. Double EHP


Good catch. Because max tanked freighters and JFs haven't been dying in Uedama. Less Goon rhetoric and more facts, please. Or at least spice it up with a 300 mil scam offer to join Goonwaffe or something.


Link the kill.


And you could never join GoonWaffe. Your frail human frame would never survive the transformation.


Oh come on sherlock, go look at their JF kills. Au fortiori to a max tanked freighter. And I already have 5 standing offers to join your third rate corp, the lowest for 400 million isk. The only thing worse than being a two bit scammer is being an incompetent two bit scammer. You will never graduate from the Waffes like this.
Ima Wreckyou
The Conference Elite
Safety.
#151 - 2014-10-19 11:35:38 UTC
Dmitri Dracov wrote:
It's not a ponzi scheme, it's a few industrious individuals making a lot of isk by rounding up bored F1 monkey pressers and providing them with 'tears', 'content' and a nice killmail to ***** on.

Why bother getting lots of Isoboxer accounts when there are plenty of idiots willing to loan you their accounts for free?

I play this game to have fun and not as a job. I don't have to earn space money to feed my children or something. If someone provides free ship and entertainment I wouldn't even ask for ISK compensation as it is their investment and I got already what I started the EVE client for.

Now if you can only enjoy this game if you can amass ISK to whatever silly end this is simply your loss. I realized a long time ago that a game that only revolves around grinding virtual assets and money isn't actually fun but rather frustrating. Yet the human nature as a collector gives one a really hard time to step away from this silly practice.

Oh and if you think this is just silly propaganda. Try to remember what games used to be like before it was just about ISK and asset grinding.

Evil RatKid
Black Pedro
Mine.
#152 - 2014-10-19 11:54:20 UTC
Dmitri Dracov wrote:
It's not a ponzi scheme, it's a few industrious individuals making a lot of isk by rounding up bored F1 monkey pressers and providing them with 'tears', 'content' and a nice killmail to ***** on.

Why bother getting lots of Isoboxer accounts when there are plenty of idiots willing to loan you their accounts for free?


As has been explained to you many times in this thread, there is no evidence that "a lot of isk" has been made by anyone.

Your exact same argument applies to line members of the nullsec alliances and coalitions. Do you think the average grunt of CFC or Pandemic Legion is an "idiot" for contributing to something that is controlled by their leadership? Eve is an MMORPG explicitly designed to encourage the formation of player organizations that will compete for space and resources, and to shape New Eden to their will. It was not designed to be played as some sort of solo resource gathering game like you and your carebear friends seem to think it is.

I actually pity you, siting there by yourself in space, rubbing your grubby little hands together thinking you have "won Eve" every time your ISK balance ticks up another digit, and being deathly afraid to participate in anything greater than yourself because you aren't getting directly compensated in the only thing you understand: ISK.

The 8 Golden Rules of Eve

Why Do They Gank?
Angelique Duchemin
Team Evil
#153 - 2014-10-19 11:58:20 UTC
Veers Belvar wrote:
Oh come on sherlock, go look at their JF kills. Au fortiori to a max tanked freighter.


Link one then if they are so plentiful.

Veers Belvar wrote:
And I already have 5 standing offers to join your third rate corp


I already told you that you're not welcome to join. Are the other 5 offers imagined just like you imagine mine?

The very sun of heaven seemed distorted when viewed through the polarising miasma welling out from this sea-soaked perversion, and twisted menace and suspense lurked leeringly in those crazily elusive angles of carven rock where a second glance shewed concavity after the first shewed convexity.

Veers Belvar
Swordmasters of New Eden
#154 - 2014-10-19 13:26:31 UTC
Angelique Duchemin wrote:
Veers Belvar wrote:
Oh come on sherlock, go look at their JF kills. Au fortiori to a max tanked freighter.


Link one then if they are so plentiful.

Veers Belvar wrote:
And I already have 5 standing offers to join your third rate corp


I already told you that you're not welcome to join. Are the other 5 offers imagined just like you imagine mine?


Not allowed to link killboards. Go check out www.minerbumping.com for yourself. And while you are at it check goonfleet.net to comprehend what kind of scam outfit you work for, and you will understand the multiple offers I've received to join Goonwaffe, for a fee of course.
Angelique Duchemin
Team Evil
#155 - 2014-10-19 13:47:51 UTC
Veers Belvar wrote:
Not allowed to link killboards. Go check out www.minerbumping.com for yourself. And while you are at it check goonfleet.net to comprehend what kind of scam outfit you work for, and you will understand the multiple offers I've received to join Goonwaffe, for a fee of course.


And without a single kill to present you remain standing with your argument limp in your hand.

The very sun of heaven seemed distorted when viewed through the polarising miasma welling out from this sea-soaked perversion, and twisted menace and suspense lurked leeringly in those crazily elusive angles of carven rock where a second glance shewed concavity after the first shewed convexity.

Princess Bride
SharkNado
#156 - 2014-10-19 13:49:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Princess Bride
CALDARI CITIZEN 14330909 wrote:
Veers Belvar wrote:
My impression is that the individual gankers get to keep the freighter loot, that is the incentive for participating in the gank fleets. As far as being a company, CODE should be in Chapter 7 liquidation, as it endlessly bleeds money with no hope of ever making a profit. The "shareholders" are mostly incredibly bored nullsec folks looking for "tears," as their own area of the game is painfully stagnant and miserable.

In the end, the solution to stopping CODE isn't AG fleets or lame player driven attempts to regulate highsec, as the current mechanics make that effectively impossible. The solution is longer aggression timers for -10 sec status gankers and a crackdown on bumping.



Technically you just describe a 501(c)-3.


Technically, you don't understand how a 501(c)(3) works. If you did, you would know that most "non-profits" make quite a large profit (as in, more money coming in than going out, as a rule). Those that bleed money as a rule don't stay in business long. The only difference between a non-profit and a for-profit corporation is that for-profit corps have shareholders. Shareholders own the company and expect dividends. You should take a close look here if you are still having trouble with this concept. Hint: Look at the red bars and the blue bars.

Wait, weren't you the one recommending large unwieldy economics books?

http://eveprincessbride.wordpress.com/
Angelique Duchemin
Team Evil
#157 - 2014-10-19 14:07:38 UTC
Princess Bride wrote:
CALDARI CITIZEN 14330909 wrote:
Veers Belvar wrote:
My impression is that the individual gankers get to keep the freighter loot, that is the incentive for participating in the gank fleets. As far as being a company, CODE should be in Chapter 7 liquidation, as it endlessly bleeds money with no hope of ever making a profit. The "shareholders" are mostly incredibly bored nullsec folks looking for "tears," as their own area of the game is painfully stagnant and miserable.

In the end, the solution to stopping CODE isn't AG fleets or lame player driven attempts to regulate highsec, as the current mechanics make that effectively impossible. The solution is longer aggression timers for -10 sec status gankers and a crackdown on bumping.



Technically you just describe a 501(c)-3.


Technically, you don't understand how a 501(c)(3) works. If you did, you would know that most "non-profits" make quite a large profit (as in, more money coming in than going out, as a rule). Those that bleed money as a rule don't stay in business long. The only difference between a non-profit and a for-profit corporation is that for-profit corps have shareholders. Shareholders own the company and expect dividends. You should take a close look here if you are still having trouble with this concept. Hint: Look at the red bars and the blue bars.

Wait, weren't you the one recommending large unwieldy economics books?



What are we even arguing about here?

People give The New Order isk so they can spend it on ganking in high sec and that's exactly what they do.

The very sun of heaven seemed distorted when viewed through the polarising miasma welling out from this sea-soaked perversion, and twisted menace and suspense lurked leeringly in those crazily elusive angles of carven rock where a second glance shewed concavity after the first shewed convexity.

La Nariz
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#158 - 2014-10-19 14:16:46 UTC  |  Edited by: La Nariz
Angelique Duchemin wrote:
Veers Belvar wrote:

... you will understand the multiple offers I've received to join Goonwaffe, for a fee of course.
I already told you that you're not welcome to join. Are the other 5 offers imagined just like you imagine mine?


Seconding this, we have enough horrible pubbies we don't need you.

E: This is the only forum you are allowed to post killmails in too so **** or get off the pot.

This post was loving crafted by a member of the Official GoonWaffe recruitment team. Improve the forums, support this idea: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&find=unread&t=345133
Ima Wreckyou
The Conference Elite
Safety.
#159 - 2014-10-19 14:51:36 UTC
Angelique Duchemin wrote:
What are we even arguing about here?

People give The New Order isk so they can spend it on ganking in high sec and that's exactly what they do.

Exactly. It's a bit like a mercenary contract, but not against an individual or an organisation. We get payed to kill the bot-aspirants, who don't actually play this game but influence the market anyway because of the relative safety of Highsec and AFK mining/hauling/mission running.

James 315 pointed this out years ago in his Manifesto II (which is now available on Soundcloud), why the bot-aspirants are bad for the game. More and more people start to realize how right he was and they are the people who donate money for our battle for a better Highsec.

Some carebears like Beers Veldspar seam to have a particularly hard time grasping this simple truth. He usually starts to generate some fantasy facts and economic arguments that have absolutely no relevance in this game, to defend his own bot-aspirant behavior and blame the miners alone or something. We are fighting for a cause, the same way others are fighting for a cause in this game. The difference to most of the other warriors in EVE is we do it in Highsec where there is CONCORD and special tactics like suicide ganking are needed to slay a target.

Another difference is that the targets we kill are part of the most entitled crowd in this game. You can see this directly here in the forums. I mean if somewhere in Nullsec thousands of players collide and shred each other to pieces, there may be a few posts about the epic tales of that battle. On the other hand if we dunk only a hand full of Freighters in Highsec, the forums will overflow with tears, nerf and ban requests.

Evil RatKid
Veers Belvar
Swordmasters of New Eden
#160 - 2014-10-19 14:57:31 UTC
La Nariz wrote:
Angelique Duchemin wrote:
Veers Belvar wrote:

... you will understand the multiple offers I've received to join Goonwaffe, for a fee of course.
I already told you that you're not welcome to join. Are the other 5 offers imagined just like you imagine mine?


Seconding this, we have enough horrible pubbies we don't need you.

E: This is the only forum you are allowed to post killmails in too so **** or get off the pot.


Seriously? Goons have now gotten so pathetic to the point where they no longer know how to look up killmails? This must really be a new low....maybe it's just time to disband and move on.

Here is one JF kill https://zkillboard.com/kill/41759169/

And another..... https://zkillboard.com/kill/41843905/


I mean come on Goons....this is easy. I mean getting owned by PL is one thing - being too incompetent to even look through Zkill is quite another!