These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

EVE Information Portal

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

Dev blog: All That Is Gold Does Not Glitter - Data Sites, Expeditions

First post First post First post
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
Lady Vici
Blinky goes to Hollyhole
Blinky Red Brotherhood
#161 - 2014-10-16 11:43:29 UTC
Have you been thinking of changing the anomaly status of ore sites in wormholes back to signatur status so that they need to be scanned again like gas sites? Atm it is nearly suifide mining in a wormhole as there is no real chance to avoid getting cought in there. With the addition of those frig wormholes Intercepter are the miners death in wormhole. Even if you spam the local scanner you probably won't have a chance to leave before the Inty catches you. Not even mentioning a cloaker. The risk vs reaward here looks quite unbalanced.

But anyways I really like all those changes you are doing as they make you need to rethink a lot what keeps it interresting! Don't stop this!
Doyle Aldurad
Stellar Winds Consortium
#162 - 2014-10-16 11:48:53 UTC
Just wanted to address the NPE changes you've got in mind - to reduce the depth of richness and detail in the mission text towards some seeming goal of a bullet list 1. fly 5 jump to [there] 2. kill (6) of [them] 3. Loot container B. 4. Return for Lootz

Umm.. no thank you :) PLEASE in this regard, don't dumb down the content of the game. NPE is a great idea and support it whole heartedly, but that said. What makes Eve Compelling is the content (from both sides of the divide PvP vs PvE) but the PvE content is already far weaker -- please don't make it worse like this.
CCP RedDawn
C C P
C C P Alliance
#163 - 2014-10-16 11:58:52 UTC
Little update for you all as things progress.

I've lowered the volume of the following items to 0.1:

Electric Conduit
Mechanic Parts
Positron Cord
Electronic Link
Spare Parts
Auxilliary Parts
Current Amplifier
Second-Hand Parts
Energy Cells
Force Cable
Power Couplings
Heat Depressor
Construction Alloy
Elemental Crux
Armor Blocks
Data Processor
Analogue Panel
Computer Chips
Internal Bulkhead
Mainframe Bit

Carbon has been lowered to 0.01.

Expedition/Escalation jump ranges have been decreased from 4 to 20 (min max), down to 2 to 10.
I'm also adding in some Science skill books to the data sites and looking into the usages of the most commonly dropped Data site loot.

Team Genesis
Dwissi
Miners Delight Reborn
#164 - 2014-10-16 12:04:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Dwissi
Spugg Galdon wrote:
Alvatore DiMarco wrote:
I rarely post outside of F&I, but I felt extremely compelled to say that telling the player which structure to shoot feels like the sort of dumbing-down that even CCP can't magic-handwave away as "optimization" or "streamlining".

You're flat-out telling them what they need to do to proceed. Stop that. If the player can't be bothered to stop drooling on themselves long enough to investigate beyond simply "kill everything that moves because pretty explosions", then do they really deserve that escalation? Or has CCP decided "everyone should be able to have access to everything, no matter what, and having to think or investigate is for other games"?

TL;DR -
For the love of all things, scale back your "shoot this structure to get bacon" into a hint "there may be bacon here, but you'll have to look for it." This is EVE, not preschool.



I kind of agree that these "Ample" infomation blocks, although quite "Compact" on the screen give extremely clear and "Scoped" objectives. Perhaps you could be a little more "Restrained" in your infomation giving to prevent any further dumbing down and the bitter vets might be a little more "Enduring" with you.

I'd also like to see the sites objective become a little more complex. Instead of just shooting a structure why aren't we hacking it to retreive the data. This might help give the game a little more dpeth.

Also, the mechanics of the "Expedition" system are a little dull. The expeditions tend to all be a "Step 1: go here, shoot a couple of rats. Then Step 2: Go here, shoot a couple of rats. Then Step 3: Go here and shoot a couple of rats. and this continues till you get to the end. You basically go on a little ride around a region of space doing very little of interest until you maybe get to the end and then possibly get phat loot.

I think this system could be broadened a little. I mean, why not "go undercover" or something. Say site one there was a hauler of some sort. you blow it up and it drops all of its cargo and a message saying where it was going to deliver it to. You could either keep the cargo (which would be quite valuable due to high volume of it) or take the cargo in a hauler yourself to the "drop off" and get to the next expedition point that way.


The whole thing really could use some fleshing out.


How about this:

Release your PvE content design tools and let the community design some missions and anomalies and expeditions and all that stuff for you. Then you simply test it and if it works/isn't broken to simply be an isk faucet, release that player made PvE content. This way you get stacks of new PvE content made for you!!


As you know already that this will never happen (releasing dev tools to the community) why dont you simply provide them with some decent UML-formatted use cases of expeditions. That reduces the actual programming already a lot. (there is even free software to create the actual drawings like SmartDraw)

Proud designer of glasses for geeky dovakins

Before someone complains again: grr everyone

Greed is the death of loyalty
Fonac
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#165 - 2014-10-16 12:07:21 UTC
CCP RedDawn wrote:
Little update for you all as things progress.

snip


Expedition/Escalation jump ranges have been decreased from 4 to 20 (min max), down to 2 to 10.
I'm also adding in some Science skill books to the data sites and looking into the usages of the most commonly dropped Data site loot.


Does this remove / reduce the chance, of getting escalations into new regions?

Reason im asking, is because before it seemed that no matter what it seemed an escalation always led into another region, regardless of range.
t
Solkara Starlock
Circle of Mystery
#166 - 2014-10-16 12:17:37 UTC
CCP RedDawn wrote:
Little update for you all as things progress.

I've lowered the volume of the following items to 0.1:

Electric Conduit
Mechanic Parts
Positron Cord
Electronic Link
Spare Parts
Auxilliary Parts
Current Amplifier
Second-Hand Parts
Energy Cells
Force Cable
Power Couplings
Heat Depressor
Construction Alloy
Elemental Crux
Armor Blocks
Data Processor
Analogue Panel
Computer Chips
Internal Bulkhead
Mainframe Bit

Carbon has been lowered to 0.01.

Expedition/Escalation jump ranges have been decreased from 4 to 20 (min max), down to 2 to 10.
I'm also adding in some Science skill books to the data sites and looking into the usages of the most commonly dropped Data site loot.


Thanks for listening to the feedback!
I highlighted the most important sentence.
It has been said before: if there is no significant market for the loot (and unfortunately, as it stands now, there is none), prices will drop and all this and the faction stuff will be considered useless crap.

The whole point of the revision of the data sites was to improve the income. That can only be done if there is enough demand for the new stuff.
With the removal of the interfaces, demand will now even decrease while supply will increase, resulting in a decline of the income.

The skillbooks are nice though!Blink
CCP RedDawn
C C P
C C P Alliance
#167 - 2014-10-16 12:27:14 UTC
Fonac wrote:
CCP RedDawn wrote:
Little update for you all as things progress.

snip


Expedition/Escalation jump ranges have been decreased from 4 to 20 (min max), down to 2 to 10.
I'm also adding in some Science skill books to the data sites and looking into the usages of the most commonly dropped Data site loot.


Does this remove / reduce the chance, of getting escalations into new regions?

Reason im asking, is because before it seemed that no matter what it seemed an escalation always led into another region, regardless of range.
t


This will reduce the chance but not eliminate it.

Team Genesis
Damjan Fox
Fox Industries and Exploration
#168 - 2014-10-16 13:37:15 UTC
Quote:
I've lowered the volume of the following items to 0.1


So no volume decrease for Decryptors or Data Cores... Sad

Proposal: >>> New Inventory / Item Hangar <<<
dirtydebbs
the wreking crew
#169 - 2014-10-16 13:43:15 UTC
Can we get a answer with escalations in wh space ?
Ama Scelesta
#170 - 2014-10-16 14:00:58 UTC
dirtydebbs wrote:
Can we get a answer with escalations in wh space ?

Only data and relic sites are added to WH space and they don't escalate. Escalation is for combat sites and anomalies.
Komi Toran
Perkone
Caldari State
#171 - 2014-10-16 14:29:32 UTC
CCP RedDawn wrote:
I'm also adding in some Science skill books to the data sites and looking into the usages of the most commonly dropped Data site loot.

Please please please keep the drops of Science skill books rare so that they don't flood the market. We don't need more Encryption Methods books.
Jandice Ymladris
Aurora Arcology
#172 - 2014-10-16 14:43:09 UTC
I've got a question concerning the nullsec data/relic sites spawning in Wormhole space: Does this lorewise mean that the various pirate factions have begun exploring wormhole space as well? In search for new technology & resources they can use in some far away future?

Providing a new home for refugees in the Aurora Arcology
Jeremiah Saken
The Fall of Leviathan
#173 - 2014-10-16 14:55:26 UTC
CCP RedDawn wrote:
I've lowered the volume of the following items to 0.1:

Electric Conduit
Mechanic Parts
Positron Cord
Electronic Link
Spare Parts
Auxilliary Parts
Current Amplifier
Second-Hand Parts
Energy Cells
Force Cable
Power Couplings
Heat Depressor
Construction Alloy
Elemental Crux
Armor Blocks
Data Processor
Analogue Panel
Computer Chips
Internal Bulkhead
Mainframe Bit

What about data cores and decryptors?

"I am tormented with an everlasting itch for things remote. I love to sail forbidden seas..." - Herman Melville
Sam Spock
The Arnold Connection
#174 - 2014-10-16 15:17:17 UTC
Here is a possible use for all the spare parts and such: decrease the drop rate of decryptors and introduce bpc's for them that use all these parts. Seems a bit odd to me that you can't build the decryptors any way.

It would also be nice to see T1 rig bpc's drop in High-sec relic sites.

Giving you Inconsistent grammar, speilling and Punct-uation since 1974!
CCP RedDawn
C C P
C C P Alliance
#175 - 2014-10-16 15:23:13 UTC
Komi Toran wrote:
CCP RedDawn wrote:
I'm also adding in some Science skill books to the data sites and looking into the usages of the most commonly dropped Data site loot.

Please please please keep the drops of Science skill books rare so that they don't flood the market. We don't need more Encryption Methods books.


They are only be present in the tier 3 and 4 containers. (Mainframes and Databanks) and have a rare drop rate. So hopefully that alleviates your worries.

Team Genesis
CCP RedDawn
C C P
C C P Alliance
#176 - 2014-10-16 15:31:20 UTC
Damjan Fox wrote:
Quote:
I've lowered the volume of the following items to 0.1


So no volume decrease for Decryptors or Data Cores... Sad


More information incoming regarding these.
The changes are all still in flux so don't be too disheartened. Big smile

Team Genesis
Vincent Athena
Photosynth
#177 - 2014-10-16 16:02:02 UTC
CCP RedDawn wrote:
Little update for you all as things progress.

..........

I'm also adding in some Science skill books to the data sites and looking into the usages of the most commonly dropped Data site loot.

You might want to consider adding most every skill book in the game. Just make sure that the drop rate of any given book is low compared to the rate they are bought from the NPCs (to avoid a price crash that makes said loot useless).

Know a Frozen fan? Check this out

Frozen fanfiction
Jeremiah Saken
The Fall of Leviathan
#178 - 2014-10-16 16:02:20 UTC
CCP RedDawn wrote:
More information incoming regarding these.
The changes are all still in flux so don't be too disheartened. Big smile

If those will be reduced to 0.1m3 (as much as salvage from relics) it would be great.

"I am tormented with an everlasting itch for things remote. I love to sail forbidden seas..." - Herman Melville
Casey Ambraelle
VoidRunner's Inc.
#179 - 2014-10-16 16:32:02 UTC
CCP RedDawn wrote:
Little update for you all as things progress.

I've lowered the volume of the following items to 0.1:

-snip-

Carbon has been lowered to 0.01.

Expedition/Escalation jump ranges have been decreased from 4 to 20 (min max), down to 2 to 10.
I'm also adding in some Science skill books to the data sites and looking into the usages of the most commonly dropped Data site loot.


Yay no more 2m3 Carbon Big smile

I would go even further with the Expedition range changes a stage 1 expedition that's 8 jumps away and doesn't escalate further is still a 16 jump round trip for no reason. I know your also fixing broken triggers and looking into boss loot drops so it may balance out if that stage one doesn't escalate further at least, maybe, I'll get paid for the 16 jump trip. Give me a reason to follow the expedition whether it goes 1 stage or all the way to the final stage.

Why only Science skillbooks? Make it any skillbook the higher the skill rank the rarer the drop rank 12+ skillbook (or similar value item) could be the "officer" drop for a data site.
YinKo Toranaga
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#180 - 2014-10-16 17:56:31 UTC
Maybe I'll have another look at exploration when this update comes out. The loot spew of useless garbage and the low ISK/Hr ratio will have to change before it makes sense to risk my ships out in 0.0 for exploration purposes though.