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Interdiction Nullified Shuttle - Solution To Greyscales Proposal
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Medalyn Isis
Doomheim
#1 - 2014-10-06 11:36:31 UTC
CCP Greyscale wrote:
Planned new feature to address new player movement:

For players less than thirty days old, once per player corporation joined, and
For all players, once a year

You may push a button in your corp interface (while a member of a player corp and docked) that:
- Moves your medical clone to a station designated by your corporation, and
- Automatically moves you to your medical clone

Exact method of corporations designating target station still being ironed out, but it will involve at the very least being able to designate a default station for all corp members, and will likely be allowed for *any* station with a corp office, regardless of system sec status.

This seems to us like it solves the "I want to recruit people to nullsec" concern, and also gives non-nullsec recruiters an easier way to get genuinely new players to the right location easily.

Thoughts? Pasting this into the FAQ and also trying to get it into the blog proper.

As suggested in the subject line, I think I have a better suggestion for helping new players into null sec

I think all methods of being able to remotely install a clone should be removed from the game completely as it takes away from the epic feel of the countless systems in the galaxy.

Also I feel using the method described by CCP Greyscale will simply just confuse new players as it won't make sense to them that they can just jump around for no apparent lore reason. If I was new again this would be immersion breaking for me. You should need to be present for the medical facility to physically copy your consciousness onto a new clone, if you make an edge case where it is possible then it opens up pandoras box.

So the solution, introduce an interdiction nullified shuttle with no skill requirement to fly. This will be more fun for a new player and will make a lot more sense to them, and also give them a sense of perspective of the galaxy rather than just simply appearing at their new location with no sense of bearing.
Lugh Crow-Slave
#2 - 2014-10-06 11:51:21 UTC
Medalyn Isis wrote:


You should need to be present for the medical facility to physically copy your consciousness onto a new clone,



First understand your lore your consciousness is copied at the moment of death then sent f.t.l. to your new clone. with this being how it works the new feature does not break lore.

now on to your idea this will be far more used by non-new players as a coast around null free card so no to your idea from a game play stand point.



remember this new feature isn't changing anything this is a way new players have been brought to null for a long time only thing is now they don't need to self destruct to move out there.

BLOPS Hauler
The 16.8km Bubble
Tabyll Altol
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#3 - 2014-10-06 11:55:59 UTC
To keep it short no interdiction nullified shuttle, go and train t3 or interceptors.

Its hard enough to catch those two nullified ships and a shuttle have an even smaller sig radius than a interceptor.

-1
Medalyn Isis
Doomheim
#4 - 2014-10-06 11:57:46 UTC
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
Medalyn Isis wrote:
You should need to be present for the medical facility to physically copy your consciousness onto a new clone,



First understand your lore your consciousness is copied at the moment of death then sent f.t.l. to your new clone. with this being how it works the new feature does not break lore.

I know the consciousness is copied at the moment of death, but to actually install the clone in the first place, that should require you to be present at the medical facility, or else logically why could I not simply install my clone wherever I want across the galaxy. Perhaps the lore is a little fuzzy, but in terms of consistency it opens up a pandoras box and will be confusing for new and old players alike.

Medalyn Isis wrote:
now on to your idea this will be far more used by non-new players as a coast around null free card so no to your idea from a game play stand point.

I don't see that as an issue, they cannot do much in a shuttle anyway except simply travel. Veteran players already use interceptors in this way anyway, and it is annoying for new players to have to train for a T2 ship in order to do this also.
Feyrin
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#5 - 2014-10-06 12:47:22 UTC
I looked at this post initially and thought lol no. But actually veterans use the Ares for exactly this as a glorified interdiction immune shuttle. Adding an interdiction immune "T2" shuttle with build cost around the same as an ares actually wouldn't change anything for Vets but would certainly help new players.
Zan Shiro
Doomheim
#6 - 2014-10-06 13:16:40 UTC
Tabyll Altol wrote:
To keep it short no interdiction nullified shuttle, go and train t3 or interceptors.

Its hard enough to catch those two nullified ships and a shuttle have an even smaller sig radius than a interceptor.

-1


Gonna say this. An inty should be a good first ship to offer your new 0.0 home and should be in place. And if they google travel fits for them well the one I run while I can't say for sure its poster is accurate in it being damn near instalock proof but will say by seat of pants flying she is zippy as hell. Warp rigs means not same as me you aren't catching up too well either once clear.

But barring that even....I am of the opinion our noobie noob not in a nullifying inty probably needs to meet mr. bubble and die in it. Only to get that little eve lesson out of the way. My first time out new as hell I read many guides on what to do out there. I even read what to do in a bubble guides. And my first time in the pretty blue sphere of death I had a full on noobtard stupid attack and did everything wrong. Broke my cherry though, not as nice as I'd like but well I got that eve experience we all get in 0.0 out the way for the first time.

If mr. noob meets mr bubble on the first run out there....well....they get those lessons sooner than they'd maybe like to but still good lessons all in all they will eventually look back on. Med cloned moved just a nice insurance policy if that happens.
Rowells
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#7 - 2014-10-06 13:28:13 UTC
Only problem with this is how not-new players will use this. The other proposal had hard limits and addressed this. Unless I missed it in the OP.
Tabyll Altol
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#8 - 2014-10-06 13:55:39 UTC
Zan Shiro wrote:
Tabyll Altol wrote:
To keep it short no interdiction nullified shuttle, go and train t3 or interceptors.

Its hard enough to catch those two nullified ships and a shuttle have an even smaller sig radius than a interceptor.

-1


Gonna say this. An inty should be a good first ship to offer your new 0.0 home and should be in place. And if they google travel fits for them well the one I run while I can't say for sure its poster is accurate in it being damn near instalock proof but will say by seat of pants flying she is zippy as hell. Warp rigs means not same as me you aren't catching up too well either once clear.

But barring that even....I am of the opinion our noobie noob not in a nullifying inty probably needs to meet mr. bubble and die in it. Only to get that little eve lesson out of the way. My first time out new as hell I read many guides on what to do out there. I even read what to do in a bubble guides. And my first time in the pretty blue sphere of death I had a full on noobtard stupid attack and did everything wrong. Broke my cherry though, not as nice as I'd like but well I got that eve experience we all get in 0.0 out the way for the first time.

If mr. noob meets mr bubble on the first run out there....well....they get those lessons sooner than they'd maybe like to but still good lessons all in all they will eventually look back on. Med cloned moved just a nice insurance policy if that happens.


So its 0.0 not highsec, if you want to go there you should prepare for it. If you ask friendly the most people will help you to get in 0.0 space or give you fitting help ans tipps how to behave if the gate is bubbled and such things. If your not able to ask you deserve to die. And every time i lost something i learned much.

And if you really fail with this set your clone to the 0.0 station and destroy you pod thats way faster than traveling there.

Still against the idea

-1
Cidanel Afuran
Grant Village
#9 - 2014-10-06 14:18:00 UTC
Medalyn Isis wrote:

I don't see that as an issue, they cannot do much in a shuttle anyway except simply travel. Veteran players already use interceptors in this way anyway, and it is annoying for new players to have to train for a T2 ship in order to do this also.



So you are saying I can now make a brand new NPC alt, not bother to activate a training queue and use it to stroll through gate camps and scout out any territory, then get caught, biomass it and start again?

Sign me up.
King Fu Hostile
Mea Culpa.
Shadow Cartel
#10 - 2014-10-06 14:32:33 UTC
aka how to move cyno alts the easy way on the future

nice try mate
Medalyn Isis
Doomheim
#11 - 2014-10-06 14:39:14 UTC
Cidanel Afuran wrote:
Medalyn Isis wrote:

I don't see that as an issue, they cannot do much in a shuttle anyway except simply travel. Veteran players already use interceptors in this way anyway, and it is annoying for new players to have to train for a T2 ship in order to do this also.



So you are saying I can now make a brand new NPC alt, not bother to activate a training queue and use it to stroll through gate camps and scout out any territory, then get caught, biomass it and start again?

Sign me up.

It could have a small skill requirement. The main point would be that it is less than that of an interceptor, so that new players can use it. Also it is pretty easy already to scout with a 1 day character anyway and then biomass. If you want to scout properly though with a cloaked covert ops or recon you still need to train for it, and a "t2" shuttle wouldn't change that.
Cidanel Afuran
Grant Village
#12 - 2014-10-06 15:12:57 UTC
Medalyn Isis wrote:
Cidanel Afuran wrote:
Medalyn Isis wrote:

I don't see that as an issue, they cannot do much in a shuttle anyway except simply travel. Veteran players already use interceptors in this way anyway, and it is annoying for new players to have to train for a T2 ship in order to do this also.



So you are saying I can now make a brand new NPC alt, not bother to activate a training queue and use it to stroll through gate camps and scout out any territory, then get caught, biomass it and start again?

Sign me up.

It could have a small skill requirement. The main point would be that it is less than that of an interceptor, so that new players can use it. Also it is pretty easy already to scout with a 1 day character anyway and then biomass. If you want to scout properly though with a cloaked covert ops or recon you still need to train for it, and a "t2" shuttle wouldn't change that.


Why make it even easier for throwaway scouts? You can absolutely scout without a cloak, especially if you can blow through gate camps (like you could with your shuttle).

This is a massive buff to scouting with alts that adds nothing to gameplay for new characters, other than a perceived problem with lore.
Leonard Nimoy II
Doomheim
#13 - 2014-10-06 16:41:43 UTC
The problem I see with this is - as others have pointed out - that it will be the least benefit to new players, and more benefit to older players who will exploit it.
Zan Shiro
Doomheim
#14 - 2014-10-06 17:01:41 UTC
Cidanel Afuran wrote:


This is a massive buff to scouting with alts that adds nothing to gameplay for new characters, other than a perceived problem with lore.



problem with lore not only problem. If scared to make the run in n a t1 frigate if only thing they can fly....wtf are they going to do in their new home? Run shuttles on roams?

Wanting to join 0.0, and only flying t1 frigates at the time.....our noob may as well run the get camp gauntlet day one on trip out in the t1 frigate they can fly to develop some skills. Its what they will be doing for quite sometime lol.

Or med clone it and dman the lore. I am sure they get ample time to see the vastness of eve on those 20+ roams...just in one direction. Overtime they may even get quite the bm collection. One day going though my bm's I saw bm's in space I have never even recalled being in. Very long range drunk roam I guess lol. No where near any home I have been in or space I invaded.
TheMercenaryKing
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#15 - 2014-10-06 17:12:45 UTC
Who the **** is 30 days old and going into nullsec? Oh wait, it's alt accounts.
Johann Rascali
The Milkmen
Sedition.
#16 - 2014-10-06 18:04:28 UTC
Medalyn Isis wrote:
I know the consciousness is copied at the moment of death, but to actually install the clone in the first place, that should require you to be present at the medical facility, or else logically why could I not simply install my clone wherever I want across the galaxy.


Last I checked you can install medical clones from a medical facility to any station that your corporation holds an office in, including ones without their own medbays.
So, uh...

Blanking signatures doesn't seem to work, so this is here.
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
#17 - 2014-10-06 18:16:22 UTC
Medalyn Isis wrote:

It could have a small skill requirement. The main point would be that it is less than that of an interceptor, so that new players can use it. Also it is pretty easy already to scout with a 1 day character anyway and then biomass. If you want to scout properly though with a cloaked covert ops or recon you still need to train for it, and a "t2" shuttle wouldn't change that.

So please tell us, on a brand new clone what is the training time for an Inty. They don't need all those other fitting skills at V either. Just the Inty to get out there.
Cidanel Afuran
Grant Village
#18 - 2014-10-06 19:13:45 UTC
Leonard Nimoy II wrote:
The problem I see with this is - as others have pointed out - that it will be the least benefit to new players, and more benefit to older players who will exploit it.



Malcanis’ Law

"Whenever a mechanics change is proposed on behalf of ‘new players’, that change is always to the overwhelming advantage of richer, older players."

http://outofcake.wordpress.com/2012/12/10/malcanis-law/
Medalyn Isis
Doomheim
#19 - 2014-10-06 22:46:07 UTC
Nevyn Auscent wrote:
Medalyn Isis wrote:

It could have a small skill requirement. The main point would be that it is less than that of an interceptor, so that new players can use it. Also it is pretty easy already to scout with a 1 day character anyway and then biomass. If you want to scout properly though with a cloaked covert ops or recon you still need to train for it, and a "t2" shuttle wouldn't change that.

So please tell us, on a brand new clone what is the training time for an Inty. They don't need all those other fitting skills at V either. Just the Inty to get out there.

It is just over 23 days for a new player. The problem is they want to train other stuff also, telling them to slog it out for 23 days just so they can travel to null sec in a poorly fit interceptor which is no use for anything else is not viable or fair to ask of them. They want to train up to fly cruisers and battlecruisers to run missions or rat, as that kind of stuff is what excites a new player, not a 23 day slog for an interceptor.
Khan Wrenth
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#20 - 2014-10-07 03:33:00 UTC
Medalyn Isis wrote:
...that kind of stuff is what excites a new player, not a 23 day slog for an interceptor.


Which is why the option of moving a medical clone is being discussed, right? Sounds like the solution to your problem is the very thing you're fighting against.

Let's discuss overhauling the way we get intel in EvE.
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