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QotD: How do you measure profitability of highsec ganking?

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Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
#121 - 2014-10-03 02:35:11 UTC
Chainsaw Plankton wrote:
Mr Epeen wrote:
Charax Bouclier wrote:
Income - Cost = Profitability



Wrong equation. That's the industry one.

The ganking one is destruction + tears = joy

Mr Epeen Cool


were that true there would be a lot more ganking going on. Last time I was in a mission hub it was just overflowing with people running missions. pretty sure most gankers care about making isk.


Well, that's the most clueless thing said in the thread so far.

If gankers were in it for the money, mission hubs are exactly where they'd be plying their craft. But are they going after those juicy, blinged out, multi-billion ISK piggy banks? Of course not.

They're ganking untanked miners and empty haulers. For every decent gank you link, I'll link a hundred that were completely valueless.

It's for the tears, dude. No more. No less. And there's nothing wrong in admitting it. Don't be ashamed. Be proud. It's a perfectly valid game mechanic.

Mr Epeen Cool
Renegade Heart
Doomheim
#122 - 2014-10-03 05:49:21 UTC
Wolf Incaelum wrote:
Renegade Heart wrote:
Wolf Incaelum wrote:
We actually don't really need pods to drop implants. I've gotten plenty of my victims to buy back their corpses for exactly that purpose. Oh, the sweet, sweet tears. One can only imagine the joy I feel, the beat my heart skips, when a victim actually agrees to buy his own corpse back so that he can get his implants back. Of course, I'm always generous enough to sell the corpse back at a price that is lower than the total cost of the implants. Twisted


This is genius. Perhaps we could consider the cost of ganking a pod with no implants a price worth paying for the good ones to be found?


I'm assuming you're referring to the large drop in sec status for popping a pod. It really isn't a bad price to pay at all. Indeed, negative sec status does become a bit of a nuisance. It can be worked around, though. Provided you are fast and accurate enough. If it becomes too bothersome, you can always farm rat tags and turn them in at a CONCORD station. It's a bit of a grind, but it's a good way to pass the time if your targets have become particularly mindful of your presence. When they start hiding from you, disappear into lowsec for a while to collect tags. Turn the tags in for sec status increase, then go back to your hunting grounds. By that time, your targets will be nice and complacent again. Might even have a few new faces eager to meet their demise. :)


Oh no lol I forgot about sec status. But you can pop pods as an outlaw anyway, even in 1.0 systems Twisted

Yeah I was referring to the cost of the gank thrasher. Bout 1.2 mil lol.
Barbara Nichole
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#123 - 2014-10-03 06:17:50 UTC
well, you don't. if you aren't having fun the effort is a faulure.. of course, if you have some goal in your ganking you can try to use that as a secondary metric. but you won't last long at it without some entertainment value.

  - remove the cloaked from local; free intel is the real problem, not  "afk" cloaking -

[IMG]http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a208/DawnFrostbringer/consultsig.jpg[/IMG]
Ima Wreckyou
The Conference Elite
The Conference
#124 - 2014-10-03 07:21:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Ima Wreckyou
So this is the basic formula I use to calculate my profitability:

Profit = ( ISK value of Freighter load after op ) - ( ISK value of Freighter load with Gank equipment ) + ( Permit money ) + ( other )

The gank induced rage ( in game, generated by exploding spacehips only ) goes directly into ( other ) which is sometimes the biggest number of the above. It's about channeling the rage ( in game ) of the carebears or local wanabe heroes to gain ISK (no bonus room or even chat interaction needed, pure spaceship violence and some other game mechanics).

I call it space-AIKIDO

Evil RatKid
Wolf Incaelum
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#125 - 2014-10-03 16:46:26 UTC
Mr Epeen wrote:
Chainsaw Plankton wrote:
Mr Epeen wrote:
Charax Bouclier wrote:
Income - Cost = Profitability



Wrong equation. That's the industry one.

The ganking one is destruction + tears = joy

Mr Epeen Cool


were that true there would be a lot more ganking going on. Last time I was in a mission hub it was just overflowing with people running missions. pretty sure most gankers care about making isk.


Well, that's the most clueless thing said in the thread so far.

If gankers were in it for the money, mission hubs are exactly where they'd be plying their craft. But are they going after those juicy, blinged out, multi-billion ISK piggy banks? Of course not.

They're ganking untanked miners and empty haulers. For every decent gank you link, I'll link a hundred that were completely valueless.

It's for the tears, dude. No more. No less. And there's nothing wrong in admitting it. Don't be ashamed. Be proud. It's a perfectly valid game mechanic.

Mr Epeen Cool


Not entirely true. A lot of gankers start with suicide ganking because it takes the least time to train for. You can start a new character and have it ready to gank highsec miners in like two days, if even that. The more profitable ninja looting takes a bit longer to train for, and even longer to become proficient at it. You can't really ninja loot with low level skills. Hell, I have Astrometric Acquisition 3, Astrometric Pinpointing 4, Astrometric Rangefiniding 4, and Astrometrics 4, and I still have trouble pinning mission runners. And if you want to gank a freighter, you have to use one of the larger, more expensive ships that take a bit longer/cost a bit more to train for. Unless you want to split the profit 5 - 7 ways with a fleet of dessies.

The more ISK you are trying to get out of a target, the more ISK you will inevitably have to put into killing the target. Granted, there will be exceptions like haulers with a bunch of cargo expanders and little or no tank carrying shinies, but there is still a definite limit to how much you will be able to make off of them compared to freighters. Not to mention that you have to be able to pay for (and be able to replace, as per the golden rule of Eve) a ship for an alt to use to pick up the loot.

There's a fine but very clear line between ganking for profit and just simply griefing. A griefer would go after an empty hauler without hesitation, but just because someone goes after an untanked miner doesn't mean they're just in it for the tears. The tears are just a nice little bonus.

ANARCHYFOREVAAARRRRRRRRRR!!!!!!!
Wolf Incaelum
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#126 - 2014-10-03 18:54:33 UTC
Renegade Heart wrote:


Oh no lol I forgot about sec status. But you can pop pods as an outlaw anyway, even in 1.0 systems Twisted

Yeah I was referring to the cost of the gank thrasher. Bout 1.2 mil lol.


Wow. Since when is a Thrasher cheaper than a Catalyst? lol. I've been out of game too long... Cry


ANARCHYFOREVAAARRRRRRRRRR!!!!!!!
Renegade Heart
Doomheim
#127 - 2014-10-03 19:42:28 UTC
Wolf Incaelum wrote:
Renegade Heart wrote:


Oh no lol I forgot about sec status. But you can pop pods as an outlaw anyway, even in 1.0 systems Twisted

Yeah I was referring to the cost of the gank thrasher. Bout 1.2 mil lol.


Wow. Since when is a Thrasher cheaper than a Catalyst? lol. I've been out of game too long... Cry




Yeah I didn't meant a gank catalyst for the mining barges, they can be more expensive. Not much still Big smile

Was referring to merely a cheap pod popper.
Petre en Thielles
Doomheim
#128 - 2014-10-03 20:09:07 UTC
I have nothing useful to say, I just felt this should be here

Tears, Tears, Tears
Solecist Project
#129 - 2014-10-03 21:03:35 UTC
Profitablitiy.
It doesn't really matter to me.

What matters is to kill them out of the blue ..............

That ringing in your ears you're experiencing right now is the last gasping breathe of a dying inner ear as it got thoroughly PULVERISED by the point roaring over your head at supersonic speeds. - Tippia
Veers Belvar
Swordmasters of New Eden
#130 - 2014-10-03 21:19:02 UTC
Solecist Project wrote:
Profitablitiy.
It doesn't really matter to me.

What matters is to kill them out of the blue ..............


So you would gank empty shuttles just because?
Mag's
Azn Empire
#131 - 2014-10-03 21:22:17 UTC
Veers Belvar wrote:
Solecist Project wrote:
Profitablitiy.
It doesn't really matter to me.

What matters is to kill them out of the blue ..............


So you would gank empty shuttles just because?
I have many times. So what?

Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the Lions will ignore you in the Savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless.
admiral root
Red Galaxy
#132 - 2014-10-03 21:23:00 UTC
Veers Belvar wrote:
So you would gank empty shuttles just because?


Just because *and* just because sometimes people are silly enough to put all kinds of expensive stuff in a shuttle.

No, your rights end in optimal+2*falloff
Solecist Project
#133 - 2014-10-03 21:29:23 UTC
Veers Belvar wrote:
Solecist Project wrote:
Profitablitiy.
It doesn't really matter to me.

What matters is to kill them out of the blue ..............


So you would gank empty shuttles just because?

No. I do not do things "just because".
I never have and the universe does not work that way anyway.
There is not a single being in existence that does things "just because".

"Just because" usually either means that someone does not want to bother telling the reason,
does not want to tell the reason or does not know the reason.

Causality......... it's weird, right?


"Out of the blue" means that I engaged "by surprise" or "without them seeing it coming".


That ringing in your ears you're experiencing right now is the last gasping breathe of a dying inner ear as it got thoroughly PULVERISED by the point roaring over your head at supersonic speeds. - Tippia
Veers Belvar
Swordmasters of New Eden
#134 - 2014-10-03 21:43:25 UTC
Solecist Project wrote:
Veers Belvar wrote:
Solecist Project wrote:
Profitablitiy.
It doesn't really matter to me.

What matters is to kill them out of the blue ..............


So you would gank empty shuttles just because?

No. I do not do things "just because".
I never have and the universe does not work that way anyway.
There is not a single being in existence that does things "just because".

"Just because" usually either means that someone does not want to bother telling the reason,
does not want to tell the reason or does not know the reason.

Causality......... it's weird, right?


"Out of the blue" means that I engaged "by surprise" or "without them seeing it coming".




So what do you get out of popping an empty shuttle?
Paranoid Loyd
#135 - 2014-10-03 21:46:03 UTC
Veers Belvar wrote:
So what do you get out of popping an empty shuttle?


Well for one, the pleasure of knowing it bothers people like you.

"There is only one authority in this game, and that my friend is violence. The supreme authority upon which all other authority is derived." ISD Max Trix

Fix the Prospect!
Petre en Thielles
Doomheim
#136 - 2014-10-03 21:49:01 UTC
Veers Belvar wrote:

So what do you get out of popping an empty shuttle?


The more people who get ganked doing stupid things, the more they learn and the more challenging it is to fight next time.

It is community service, really.
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#137 - 2014-10-03 21:51:11 UTC
Veers Belvar wrote:

So what do you get out of popping an empty shuttle?


A chance to pop the pod of the player inside, duh.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
voetius
Grundrisse
#138 - 2014-10-03 21:52:25 UTC
Veers Belvar wrote:
Solecist Project wrote:
Veers Belvar wrote:
Solecist Project wrote:
Profitablitiy.
It doesn't really matter to me.

What matters is to kill them out of the blue ..............


So you would gank empty shuttles just because?

No. I do not do things "just because".
I never have and the universe does not work that way anyway.
There is not a single being in existence that does things "just because".

"Just because" usually either means that someone does not want to bother telling the reason,
does not want to tell the reason or does not know the reason.

Causality......... it's weird, right?


"Out of the blue" means that I engaged "by surprise" or "without them seeing it coming".




So what do you get out of popping an empty shuttle?


If it's a Leopard you get a 70mill killmail Blink
Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
#139 - 2014-10-03 21:53:44 UTC
Mag's wrote:
Veers Belvar wrote:
Solecist Project wrote:
Profitablitiy.
It doesn't really matter to me.

What matters is to kill them out of the blue ..............


So you would gank empty shuttles just because?
I have many times. So what?


Now that's what I'm talking about.

Unapologetic ganking for fun and tears.

No hiding behind excuses. No fancy equations. No profit/lose discussion. Just a simple "saw an opportunity and took advantage of it".

/respect Solecist
/respect Mag's

Mr Epeen Cool
Solecist Project
#140 - 2014-10-03 21:56:22 UTC
I do not get anything out of it personally.
The answer to your question lies in March 2012, in Hek.
It was a means to an end, which I managed to achieve. (I apologise if that's not the proper saying)


If you noticed ... or, actually, even CARED to notice ...
... I do not share the attitude or even gameplay of absolutely most other gankers.

That ringing in your ears you're experiencing right now is the last gasping breathe of a dying inner ear as it got thoroughly PULVERISED by the point roaring over your head at supersonic speeds. - Tippia