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Wormholes

 
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PvE C1 to C4

First post
Author
Pro TIps
Doomheim
#161 - 2014-09-29 15:50:32 UTC
Aladar Dangerface wrote:
An idea I heard thrown around my corp a while back that I thought was good: T3 frigs and sleeper loot from low class whs being used to build them.

I've seen this mentioned before. I think the problem is those new T3 frigs would have to be balanced among the existing ships in the game, while still providing advantages to make players want them. That is time-consuming for devs and they will probably make another Ishtar by accident.

It would be better if they simply raised the value of the blue loot.
Bhane Celesto
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#162 - 2014-09-29 17:44:31 UTC
Pro TIps wrote:
[quote=Aladar Dangerface]

It would be better if they simply raised the value of the blue loot.



This is the simple fix, but it's not the best one. This only addresses the "I can run incursions in highsec in a ship worth the same amount, for more isk with no risk" issue with WH income right now.
Bjurn Akely
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#163 - 2014-09-29 18:08:04 UTC
Bhane Celesto wrote:
Pro TIps wrote:
[quote=Aladar Dangerface]

It would be better if they simply raised the value of the blue loot.



This is the simple fix, but it's not the best one. This only addresses the "I can run incursions in highsec in a ship worth the same amount, for more isk with no risk" issue with WH income right now.


Although I agree in point I'd like to point out that there will (most probably) always be a 'more lucrative thing to do'. The point, for me, is not to balance W-space against all tho other things. I'd be fine with just balancing it within W-space. As it is now there is a order of magnitude difference between say C2 and C5 when it comes to income. C2's are also where the most kills happen in W-space if I remember eve-sensus.com right. Don't quote me on the destroyed VALUE though. Eve-sensus is number of kills.

Anywho and all that said... If people are of the opinion that w-space should be worth more than X... Why not go do X? I like W-space, so I'll stick around, probably until I quit Eve. Because it's w-space I like, not the ISK.
Aladar Dangerface
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#164 - 2014-09-29 19:26:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Aladar Dangerface
Pro TIps wrote:
Aladar Dangerface wrote:
An idea I heard thrown around my corp a while back that I thought was good: T3 frigs and sleeper loot from low class whs being used to build them.

I've seen this mentioned before. I think the problem is those new T3 frigs would have to be balanced among the existing ships in the game, while still providing advantages to make players want them. That is time-consuming for devs and they will probably make another Ishtar by accident.

It would be better if they simply raised the value of the blue loot.


I agree that bumping up loot is the easier way to go but the whole T3 frig idea (if done right i.e balanced properly) would benefit more people as it would probably entice more people into whs. i mean look what happend with the amount of people running SOE missions when the new ships came out, this would mean more activity in whs, it would also give us more toys to play with and give more things for industrialists to build so this doesn't just benefit wh residents but all eve players.

Hell this could be done along with a buff in loot from sleepers. It just needs to be balanced.

I don't need twitter. I'm already following you.

MooMooDachshundCow
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#165 - 2014-09-29 21:37:16 UTC
The only thing that makes me want a T3 frig is the new frig holes. They would go good together, but I can't imagine how to make a T3 frig that doesn't break the game.

Conversely, if the existing T3's were properly rebalanced (maybe remove SP loss?) enough to encourage greater use, perhaps we could get sleeper loot prices back up through normal supply/demand free market operations.

Of course, that would require a good rebalance of T3's to the point where they became used extensively again.

Otherwise, the easy answer would be to just rebalance site blue loot so that risk/reward scale with C-value and are always more rewarding than hisec. This is actually probably a necessary first step for any WH revamps that seek to populate it more heavily.

Fix Idea for Mining:
When you rebalance the anoms, add deposits of +10% high-end ores to the sites, based again on difficulty etc. Many of the sites already have veldspar or other minerals in the site. By putting things that people actually want in the sites, you can encourage them to mine, while requiring them to have some minimal PVP abilities. This mining would take place after the final wave has been cleared making them unprobable without combats.

This would mean that miners would again be encouraged to mine in a WH, and that they would have some guns. Maybe they'd even shoot back. Oh, and make the WH ghost sites contain ice, lol.

Yeah, well, it's just like my opinion, man.

Pro TIps
Doomheim
#166 - 2014-09-30 04:27:13 UTC
Bhane Celesto wrote:
This is the simple fix, but it's not the best one. This only addresses the "I can run incursions in highsec in a ship worth the same amount, for more isk with no risk" issue with WH income right now.

No, it could also address the, you can't make enough ISK in W-space to replace your losses, problem.

Even if you could make 200M/hr in a C1, you will quickly run out of anoms. Highsec incursions are almost always there for endless farming. Need two billion? Spend a day farming incursions.

Need two billion in low-class W-space? Scan/roll/etc until you find a couple systems full of anoms, without so many WHs you can't watch them, then spend all day running the sites, looting, salvaging, hope you don't get killed by other wormholers, THEN go to K-space to sell your loot. Do all that while spamming D-scan and having alts online to watch your back, anchor your wormhole, and so on.

See the difference?
Aiyshimin
Shiva Furnace
#167 - 2014-09-30 06:02:58 UTC
Pro TIps wrote:
Bhane Celesto wrote:
This is the simple fix, but it's not the best one. This only addresses the "I can run incursions in highsec in a ship worth the same amount, for more isk with no risk" issue with WH income right now.

No, it could also address the, you can't make enough ISK in W-space to replace your losses, problem.

Even if you could make 200M/hr in a C1, you will quickly run out of anoms. Highsec incursions are almost always there for endless farming. Need two billion? Spend a day farming incursions.

Need two billion in low-class W-space? Scan/roll/etc until you find a couple systems full of anoms, without so many WHs you can't watch them, then spend all day running the sites, looting, salvaging, hope you don't get killed by other wormholers, THEN go to K-space to sell your loot. Do all that while spamming D-scan and having alts online to watch your back, anchor your wormhole, and so on.

See the difference?


yeah, you had fun in the wormhole while the incursion nerds just pressed f1
Bjurn Akely
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#168 - 2014-09-30 07:09:59 UTC
Aiyshimin wrote:
Pro TIps wrote:
Bhane Celesto wrote:
This is the simple fix, but it's not the best one. This only addresses the "I can run incursions in highsec in a ship worth the same amount, for more isk with no risk" issue with WH income right now.

No, it could also address the, you can't make enough ISK in W-space to replace your losses, problem.

Even if you could make 200M/hr in a C1, you will quickly run out of anoms. Highsec incursions are almost always there for endless farming. Need two billion? Spend a day farming incursions.

Need two billion in low-class W-space? Scan/roll/etc until you find a couple systems full of anoms, without so many WHs you can't watch them, then spend all day running the sites, looting, salvaging, hope you don't get killed by other wormholers, THEN go to K-space to sell your loot. Do all that while spamming D-scan and having alts online to watch your back, anchor your wormhole, and so on.

See the difference?


yeah, you had fun in the wormhole while the incursion nerds just pressed f1


This. Nice to see there is someone who seems to figure that virtual ISK is less worth than real life enjoyment..
epicurus ataraxia
Illusion of Solitude.
Illusion of Solitude
#169 - 2014-09-30 07:17:44 UTC
Pro TIps wrote:
Aladar Dangerface wrote:
An idea I heard thrown around my corp a while back that I thought was good: T3 frigs and sleeper loot from low class whs being used to build them.

I've seen this mentioned before. I think the problem is those new T3 frigs would have to be balanced among the existing ships in the game, while still providing advantages to make players want them. That is time-consuming for devs and they will probably make another Ishtar by accident.

It would be better if they simply raised the value of the blue loot.


The idea of T3 frigates is interesting, but the balance issue really is significant.

As an idea both to bring people into wormhole space and to provide a solution to the balance problem, there should be an entire new class of ship, this can either be the redeveloped T3 line that could include all sizes of ship or provide it with a T4 fitting slot for example.

This ship is balanced against other ships in KS to ensure it is not overpowered, but when operating in wormhole space a wormhole specific module can be activated and it gains enhanced functionality or power.

For example the Nestor could have been designed as a T4 and gained the ability to warp cloaked in wormhole space that it so desperately needed to thrive here, without it becoming unbalanced against other battleships in known space, this could really create a flood of interest in wormhole space too and help bring activity when coupled with other improvements, and suck up extra income as well.

There is one EvE. Many people. Many lifestyles. WE are EvE

Aiyshimin
Shiva Furnace
#170 - 2014-09-30 10:52:37 UTC
Instead of a whole new shipline, it should be much easier to develop a new Sleeper faction module line. Power level somewhere between Cosmos and C-types, but unique overheating potential (either time or higher bonus percentage).

Blueprint (copies) would drop from mag/radar sites, and would be built out of normal minerals and ancient salvage. Then tune the BPC and salvage component drop amounts to be inverse to wormhole class. Current junk salvage would become valuable without increasing ISK input to the economy, and those who would like to build these would focus on C1-3 holes.

I'd leave reverse engineering out of this to keep the new income source accessible to newer players, but if it's important to keep it in line with T3 ship production, why not.