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Player Features and Ideas Discussion

 
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Prototype: Dojos

First post First post First post
Author
Jenn aSide
Worthless Carebears
Pandemic Horde
#661 - 2014-09-26 14:05:28 UTC
Bamboozlement wrote:
Jenn aSide wrote:
You're like a simplicity bot. Why do you think anyone cares about how you play? Who exactly do you think you are that anyone would care.

You do have a platform, it's called EVE, it's the same platform the rest of us have. What stops "your community" from going to any of the thousands of empty systems and soloing each other to your hearts content? No one needs to alter EVE's flying in space concept to make a tournament.

Hopefully the fine people at CCP (and our CSM reps) will wise up and let this prototype (as it's currently imagined) hit the scrap heap (like most prototypes do) so they can spend time building something fun for people that stays within EVE's established lines.


What you don't understand is that people have been soloing and gimping their gameplay for years and it's not viable on the long run, CCP is fixing this just like they will (hopefully) fix POS management, just like they fixed the industry UI.

Consensual pvp existed since 2005 in eve, you must be new or something but consensual pvp isn't a less valid gameplay than hotdropping people or mining, welcome to the sandbox. Bear


"consensual pvp" has, since 2005 been CONFINED to Tournaments. The reason for that is because EVE is a non-consensual open worlds pvp game.

You cling to the AT and NEO examples because you know what you want is selfish. I can't comprehend such selfishness, I've never run to CCP and said "hey, I'm a PVE player, you guys need to make me safer so i can PVE". As an EVe players, i accept that even though i like PVE, EVEis such a game that people can disrupt my activities.

So becoming a good PVE player in EVE means knowing HOW to prevent disruption.

main point incoming:

Dojo users should have to do this as well. Their safety should only come from their efforts, not game mechanics.

Maybe CCP makes Dojo Deadspace scannable but gives the users other tools to make being scanned down unlikely (like a more expensive dojo that makes dojo ships even harder to scan down). Or maybe CCP finds a way to let dojo users TRAP people trying to scan them down.

Those things would be in keeping with the player run and "ALWAYS DANGEROUS" nature of EVE's 'flying in space' gameplay. But this thing they have now is an abomination.
Bamboozlement
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#662 - 2014-09-26 14:05:59 UTC
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
Bamboozlement wrote:
Nicolai Serkanner wrote:

Says the champion in this topic of logical fallacies.


Feel free to highlight my logical fallacies and say why I'm wrong, you know like I just did for him. Roll

Unlike you, I don't just post "you're wrong because I don't agree with you", right now you're just circlejerking.

Bamboozlement wrote:
Tirke wrote:
Dojos 'll kill this sandpit like game. You wouldn't need to undock. Wow arenas, are u seriously?Shocked


Just like duels killed pvp and eve. http://i.imgur.com/5v1zptC.jpg

LolLolLol

you were saying...


This is relevant factual data of what happened last time CCP introduced a feature some people (the same kind of people complaining about dojos) judged "un-eve".

I have a Ph.D

Noriko Mai
#663 - 2014-09-26 14:06:39 UTC
Oh. I totaly missed the point where this thread becomes a this little kids game. I'm right... No you aren't... yes.. no.. yes.. no.. yes.. no... yes.. no..

The only realy FACT here is that this thread goes donwhill.

"Meh.." - Albert Einstein

Josef Djugashvilis
#664 - 2014-09-26 14:09:29 UTC
Bamboozlement wrote:
Jenn aSide wrote:

Sea Change

I'm not a fan of the readily available arena pvp thing but I could live with it. But yea, to me the main problem is the deadspace thing, NOTHING in space except a noob in a noob system should be "un-screw-with-able" and i say this as someone not inclined to 'screw with' anyone. What EVE is matters.

They get rid of the unscannable pocket in space thing and (while i don't like the idea of arenas ,EVE's Arena is called EVE Online) I'm more or less cool with it. Even if that pocket was 'damn near' impossible to scan down with the best skills and gear, that would be in keeping with the 12 year tradition of this game.


I think you don't understand that the point of having dojos is to provide fair and controlled fights, fair and controlled fights existed in eve for a long time (the first AT was in 2005) just because CCP only used funny stories about betrayal, awox, theft and big 10% tidi battles to market eve till now doesn't mean it's not a valid part of the gameplay.

I mean, CCP is working hard to provide a good and professional AT stream, you don't like it fine it's a sandbox you can go do something else.

Look at the eve numbers after big battles : http://eve-offline.net/?server=tranquility now look what happens months after that..
We are literally back to 2008 tier of average people online, CCP listened to people like you for years I hope they are tired of listening to people with metagame agendas.



...fair and controlled fights...in Eve Online?

Then you are doing it wrong dear chap.

This is not a signature.

Bamboozlement
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#665 - 2014-09-26 14:09:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Bamboozlement
Jenn aSide wrote:
"consensual pvp" has, since 2005 been CONFINED to Tournaments. The reason for that is because EVE is a non-consensual open worlds pvp game.

You cling to the AT and NEO examples because you know what you want is selfish. I can't comprehend such selfishness, I've never run to CCP and said "hey, I'm a PVE player, you guys need to make me safer so i can PVE". As an EVe players, i accept that even though i like PVE, EVEis such a game that people can disrupt my activities.

So becoming a good PVE player in EVE means knowing HOW to prevent disruption.

main point incoming:

Dojo users should have to do this as well. Their safety should only come from their efforts, not game mechanics.

Maybe CCP makes Dojo Deadspace scannable but gives the users other tools to make being scanned down unlikely (like a more expensive dojo that makes dojo ships even harder to scan down). Or maybe CCP finds a way to let dojo users TRAP people trying to scan them down.

Those things would be in keeping with the player run and "ALWAYS DANGEROUS" nature of EVE's 'flying in space' gameplay. But this thing they have now is an abomination.


I wouldn't care about disruption, we have duels for 1v1s that can be disrupted (they had to add duels because of the crimewatch changes), we have no option to play in the same AT/NEO setup, CCP is fixing this need.

The always dangerous nature of eve come with rewards, we have no in game rewards for dojos.

Risk vs reward, no risk, no rewards just pew pew.

I have a Ph.D

Bamboozlement
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#666 - 2014-09-26 14:11:50 UTC
Josef Djugashvilis wrote:

...fair and controlled fights...in Eve Online?

Then you are doing it wrong dear chap.


Fair and controlled fights exist in eve online since 2005, you must be new friend.

Or you missed the AT/NEO streams/news I guess.

I have a Ph.D

Josef Djugashvilis
#667 - 2014-09-26 14:15:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Josef Djugashvilis
Bamboozlement wrote:
Josef Djugashvilis wrote:

...fair and controlled fights...in Eve Online?

Then you are doing it wrong dear chap.


Fair and controlled fights exist in eve online since 2005, you must be new friend.

Or you missed the AT/NEO streams/news I guess.


New since early 2007.

If the AT is to be the bench mark, then expand the AT to let folk have 'one versus one' fights during the tournament.

This is not a signature.

Bamboozlement
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#668 - 2014-09-26 14:18:37 UTC
Josef Djugashvilis wrote:


New since early 2007.

It the AT is to be the bench mark, then expand the AT to let folk have 'one versus one' fights during the tournament.


That's what CCP is doing, giving us players the tools because you know Eve Online is a sandbox.

I have a Ph.D

Ralph King-Griffin
New Eden Tech Support
#669 - 2014-09-26 14:19:55 UTC
Bamboozlement wrote:


This is relevant factual data of what happened last time CCP introduced a feature some people (the same kind of people complaining about dojos) judged "un-eve".

and that feature is not the same as the one in question, making your comparison about as relevant as my left testicle
Bamboozlement
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#670 - 2014-09-26 14:23:29 UTC
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
Bamboozlement wrote:


This is relevant factual data of what happened last time CCP introduced a feature some people (the same kind of people complaining about dojos) judged "un-eve".

and that feature is not the same as the one in question, making your comparison about as relevant as my left testicle


This is your (wrong) opinion and not factual data, you can lookup the thread about duels and notice the exact same posting patterns "this will kill pvp/eve", "eve is wow now", "I don't like consensual pvp", etc.

Of course the feature can't be the same, but again like I said the topic is the same and it was judged "un-eve" by the same kind of people.

Please try to focus.

I have a Ph.D

Adrie Atticus
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#671 - 2014-09-26 14:25:42 UTC
Hold on, hold on.

There is going to be a structure in wide open space which is full of ships which are not protected by a timer of any shape or form?

If yes, then restrict them to player corps like the good CCP you are.
If no, then don't implement the thing at all.
Priscilla Project
Doomheim
#672 - 2014-09-26 14:28:32 UTC
Why are you argueing with a troll who hides behind an npc alt?

He just wants you to fill the pages anyway.

Now I have to look through this mess.......
  • All incoming connection attempts are being blocked. If you want to speak to me you will find me either in Hek local, you can create a contract or make a thread about it in General Discussions. I will call you back. -
Bamboozlement
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#673 - 2014-09-26 14:32:06 UTC
Adrie Atticus wrote:
Hold on, hold on.

There is going to be a structure in wide open space which is full of ships which are not protected by a timer of any shape or form?

If yes, then restrict them to player corps like the good CCP you are.
If no, then don't implement the thing at all.


I agree that we need a player corp restriction, it would be really stupid to be able to deploy one in a npc corp.

Unless you can shoot it and go suspect instead of having concord rek you.

Priscilla Project wrote:
Why are you argueing with a troll who hides behind an npc alt?

He just wants you to fill the pages anyway.

Now I have to look through this mess.......


Please stick to arguments and factual data.

I have a Ph.D

Priscilla Project
Doomheim
#674 - 2014-09-26 14:33:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Priscilla Project
Bamboozlement wrote:
Please stick to arguments and factual data.

Oh Hi Veers... was wondering where you were.

I know. Coincidences.
Roughly the same facial structure and the same hairdo.

And the same stupid textline.

Gotta check the speed of your replies.


Anyhow... reading.
  • All incoming connection attempts are being blocked. If you want to speak to me you will find me either in Hek local, you can create a contract or make a thread about it in General Discussions. I will call you back. -
ISD Ezwal
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
ISD Alliance
#675 - 2014-09-26 14:35:57 UTC
To use a frequently posted phrase: 'Well, this escalated quickly!'

In other words, I would like to remind everybody to keep it on topic and please, above all, civil!

ISD Ezwal Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)

Ralph King-Griffin
New Eden Tech Support
#676 - 2014-09-26 14:50:27 UTC
Bamboozlement wrote:


Feel free to highlight my logical fallacies and say why I'm wrong, you know like I just did for him. Roll

vv so because people were wrong before, they are wrong now? really?
Bamboozlement wrote:
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
Bamboozlement wrote:


This is relevant factual data of what happened last time CCP introduced a feature some people (the same kind of people complaining about dojos) judged "un-eve".

and that feature is not the same as the one in question, making your comparison about as relevant as my left testicle


This is your (wrong) opinion and not factual data, you can lookup the thread about duels and notice the exact same posting patterns "this will kill pvp/eve", "eve is wow now", "I don't like consensual pvp", etc.

Of course the feature can't be the same, but again like I said the topic is the same and it was judged "un-eve" by the same kind of people.

Please try to focus.

read my posts , at no point have i stated anything other than unease at the notion of this being implemented as is outside of a tourney.

you could a least be aware of my opinion before declaring it invalid.
Priscilla Project
Doomheim
#677 - 2014-09-26 14:53:19 UTC
Haven't you learned from the other thread, Ralph?


Still reading......
  • All incoming connection attempts are being blocked. If you want to speak to me you will find me either in Hek local, you can create a contract or make a thread about it in General Discussions. I will call you back. -
Ralph King-Griffin
New Eden Tech Support
#678 - 2014-09-26 14:53:26 UTC
Priscilla Project wrote:
Bamboozlement wrote:
Please stick to arguments and factual data.

Oh Hi Veers... was wondering where you were.

I know. Coincidences.
Roughly the same facial structure and the same hairdo.

And the same stupid textline.

Gotta check the speed of your replies.


Anyhow... reading.

oh nice catch, missed that.
in that case im out

o7
Bamboozlement
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#679 - 2014-09-26 15:00:51 UTC
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
vv so because people were wrong before, they are wrong now? really?


No, I just showed that the "doom and gloom" comments are not to be taken seriously when CCP implement something they dislike, is it okay for people to wrongfully say "eve will die if you do something I don't like"?

Ralph King-Griffin wrote:

read my posts , at no point have i stated anything other than unease at the notion of this being implemented as is outside of a tourney.

you could a least be aware of my opinion before declaring it invalid.


Sure I also agree that this need work and testing, but a lot of people are saying "consensual pvp shouldn't be part of eve", which is not only false since it existed in eve since 2005 but also ridiculous because eve is a sandbox.

I don't think your gameplay (whatever you do) is a lesser gameplay than mine, I won't tell you to do the same thing as me and like the same stuff.

I have a Ph.D

Mike Azariah
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#680 - 2014-09-26 15:18:33 UTC
Marian Devers wrote:
So... which CSM members ok-ed this? Speak up, no need to be afraid...


me

m

Mike Azariah  ┬──┬ ¯|(ツ)