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Player Features and Ideas Discussion

 
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Pre-CSM Summit Nullsec and Sov Thread

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MASSADEATH
MASS A DEATH
Scumlords
#521 - 2014-09-22 02:22:41 UTC
utter lack of judgement :)

which mechanics cant fix :)
Shepard Wong Ogeko
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#522 - 2014-09-22 02:48:28 UTC
But what happened to

MASSADEATH wrote:
small groups can use capitals and defend their space.
Anthar Thebess
#523 - 2014-09-22 08:45:02 UTC
Shepard Wong Ogeko wrote:
But what happened to

MASSADEATH wrote:
small groups can use capitals and defend their space.


Blob happened.
You use capital , and you get 255 enemy capitals and supers that will login instantly to get capital KM Roll

Instant teleportation is bad , to fast, to far without any danger and at minimal costs.

Stop discrimination, help in a fight against terrorists

Show your support to The Cause!
KatanTharkay
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#524 - 2014-09-22 09:12:38 UTC  |  Edited by: KatanTharkay
Steve Ronuken wrote:
Had the initial meeting with CCP about this today.

Cautiously optimistic about what we talked about. obviously I can't talk about what was discussed, because :NDA:, but the approach being taken is a good one. Obviously, it's not set in stone yet (Good chance of never being entirely set, just a target to be constantly worked towards), so any wonderful ideas people might have still have a chance to be integrated.

Thanks for letting us know man. It would be great if people from CCP would be nice enough to at least give us some directions, because players using their time to post things that are not compatible with CCP's ideea of null-sec is just a waste of time.
Kagura Nikon
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#525 - 2014-09-22 09:43:49 UTC
Anthar Thebess wrote:
Shepard Wong Ogeko wrote:
But what happened to

MASSADEATH wrote:
small groups can use capitals and defend their space.


Blob happened.
You use capital , and you get 255 enemy capitals and supers that will login instantly to get capital KM Roll

Instant teleportation is bad , to fast, to far without any danger and at minimal costs.



That is why I think the fix must be limit of how many capitals can jump into a system per minute. If you can only bring 1 super or 2 normal cap ships per minute into a system, regardless of sides, affiliations etc (i.e all share the same queue). Then massive hotdrops wil vanish.

The capital blbo will die in all but the longest of engagements were both sides takes days to mass their capitals on a system.

"If brute force does not solve your problem....  then you are  surely not using enough!"
Kagura Nikon
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#526 - 2014-09-22 09:45:18 UTC
Adrie Atticus wrote:
Syndicate is the perfect case and point in "want that space? fight for it". It's exactly what people are asking for in terms of mechanics. Why is this bad?



Well sindicate has NPC stations. That makes it a completely different 0.0. You cannot ever really evict someone from npc 0.0 unless you are goign to LIVE there and enforce that.


"If brute force does not solve your problem....  then you are  surely not using enough!"
Adrie Atticus
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#527 - 2014-09-22 11:27:11 UTC
Kagura Nikon wrote:
Adrie Atticus wrote:
Syndicate is the perfect case and point in "want that space? fight for it". It's exactly what people are asking for in terms of mechanics. Why is this bad?



Well sindicate has NPC stations. That makes it a completely different 0.0. You cannot ever really evict someone from npc 0.0 unless you are goign to LIVE there and enforce that.




Well the previous poster (which I forgot to quote) just said that someone is actually having a strangehold on syndicate and he/she wishes not to live there; people are enforcing their space.

It's not the same, granted, but it has lead to a conclusion where outsider was kept away by using the space and defending it.
Rowells
Blackwater USA Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#528 - 2014-09-22 11:44:13 UTC
Anthar Thebess wrote:
Shepard Wong Ogeko wrote:
But what happened to

MASSADEATH wrote:
small groups can use capitals and defend their space.


Blob happened.
You use capital , and you get 255 enemy capitals and supers that will login instantly to get capital KM Roll

Instant teleportation is bad , to fast, to far without any danger and at minimal costs.

The system was cyno jammed. Moa only won the match when they had carrier on the field. Why is this? carriers are broken. amazing reps, great ehp, and healthy dps makes it impossible to break without being the bigger blob. the issues isnt necessarily the projection, but the power. I can teleport a fleet of slashers around eve, but that doesnt mean anything if i cant beat anyone in them.

The fact that I can be far from home in perfect safety because my ships are nigh on untouchable is what is bad.
TiGGar Shadow
24th Imperial Crusade
Amarr Empire
#529 - 2014-09-22 14:40:20 UTC
You post 2012 sumits as example with some ideas and now we coming in to 2015 you should use that idea of upgrades outside iHub instead of truesec for conflict driven. Null sec should be place to fight wars where map and force deployment matters not whole galaxy teleport to one system to fight and then node crash.
Kagura Nikon
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#530 - 2014-09-22 14:40:39 UTC
Adrie Atticus wrote:
Kagura Nikon wrote:
Adrie Atticus wrote:
Syndicate is the perfect case and point in "want that space? fight for it". It's exactly what people are asking for in terms of mechanics. Why is this bad?



Well sindicate has NPC stations. That makes it a completely different 0.0. You cannot ever really evict someone from npc 0.0 unless you are goign to LIVE there and enforce that.




Well the previous poster (which I forgot to quote) just said that someone is actually having a strangehold on syndicate and he/she wishes not to live there; people are enforcing their space.

It's not the same, granted, but it has lead to a conclusion where outsider was kept away by using the space and defending it.



I completely agree. And that is the point. On any NPC space you need to LIVE there if you want to be sure some other specific group cannot live there.


THe hard part is how to achieve that, while keeping the "I OWN THIS PLACE" concept of 0.0.

"If brute force does not solve your problem....  then you are  surely not using enough!"
TiGGar Shadow
24th Imperial Crusade
Amarr Empire
#531 - 2014-09-22 14:56:13 UTC  |  Edited by: TiGGar Shadow
You all sure love FW mechanic instead of orbiting plexes .. you need to complete anomals and mine rocks.. Ugh to actually live in space.... You conquare system to live in it not live in it to conquare ..
Angelique Duchemin
Team Evil
#532 - 2014-09-22 16:32:05 UTC
Dwissi wrote:
Angelique Duchemin wrote:


...

As for timers. They are required or people would have no incentive to have expensive structures in space if they could wake up in the morning and find that a fleet of ninja Dreadnoughts had blown up their capital construction tower during the night.


Cant really agree on that one - without timers alliances would be back to what they originally where: Organisations that had to cover the 24/7 period to avoid losing their assets. A corp alone has a hard time to achieve that - thats why there are alliance levels.

Timers are a convenience and make Eve just a 'normal' MMO again. Without them it would be back to original spirit of being a harsh environment that requires organisation and wit - and not just numbers.

Post 461 says it all - there are many many players who would like to play - but on fair grounds. Just try to remember why everyone joined up against BoB in old times - because everyone was sick of single powerhouses and their 'pets'. Look at what you have created by now - a universe of powerhouses and 'pets' that own more sov than yourself.


It takes 5 minutes to take down a large tower without stront. Each Alliance would be limited to 1 tower in one system if they were expected to be able to defend it at all times.

Even then it probably wouldn't work since there would be no forewarning of attack and then enemy would be much better prepared on account of being the acting party.

The very sun of heaven seemed distorted when viewed through the polarising miasma welling out from this sea-soaked perversion, and twisted menace and suspense lurked leeringly in those crazily elusive angles of carven rock where a second glance shewed concavity after the first shewed convexity.

Shepard Wong Ogeko
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#533 - 2014-09-22 17:27:06 UTC
Anthar Thebess wrote:
Shepard Wong Ogeko wrote:
But what happened to

MASSADEATH wrote:
small groups can use capitals and defend their space.


Blob happened.
You use capital , and you get 255 enemy capitals and supers that will login instantly to get capital KM Roll

Instant teleportation is bad , to fast, to far without any danger and at minimal costs.


Not only was the system they died in cyno jammed, the entire constellation was cyno jammed from an Incursion.

There were no enemy capitals or supers on those dreadnought killmails. And for all the talk of being able to crush the goons and keep them out if it wasn't for jump drives and titan bridges, we still got in and killed some capitals.
SFM Hobb3s
Perkone
Caldari State
#534 - 2014-09-22 17:27:49 UTC
If there were three voices that I would recommend CSM and Devs listen to here above all others, I'd argue they are Manfred Sidious, Baltec, and even Snot Shot.

For the huge task that is ahead, I wouldn't expect any kind of overnight fix or revelation.
I do think however that all ship rebalances need to be placed on the back-burner until carriers/supers are dealt with. This needs to happen yesterday, before any 'inty' rebalances.
Capqu
Half Empty
xqtywiznalamywmodxfhhopawzpqyjdwrpeptuaenabjawdzku
#535 - 2014-09-22 21:30:27 UTC
maybe if ccp responded to people on their own forum more instead of reddit

that would be swell

i'd take that over any kind of sov changes any day

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K5tVbVu9Mkg
Arsine Mayhem
Doomheim
#536 - 2014-09-22 23:09:48 UTC
You're the devs, grow some.

Fix it.
Arsine Mayhem
Doomheim
#537 - 2014-09-22 23:12:06 UTC
Eryn Velasquez
#538 - 2014-09-23 09:29:12 UTC
Arsine Mayhem wrote:
Use it or lose it.

http://vincentoneve.wordpress.com/some-ideas-on-eve/an-influence-sovereignty-system/


I think this is the right direction, but seems to be too complicated.

Why not take the normal index for system usage - whichever Corp/Alliance holds them above 3 is the sov-owner.

plus - every structure in system must be fueled, even the i-hub.

_“A man's freedom consists in his being able to do whatever he wills, but that he should not, by any human power, be forced to do what is against his will.” ― Jean-Jacques Rousseau _
Oxide Ammar
#539 - 2014-09-23 09:55:42 UTC
Arsine Mayhem wrote:
Use it or lose it.

http://vincentoneve.wordpress.com/some-ideas-on-eve/an-influence-sovereignty-system/


I like this, rather than having load of systems not in use this will encourage ppl to habitat nullsec and do their pve/pvp activities otherwise you don't need all this space.

Lady Areola Fappington:  Solo PVP isn't dead!  You just need to make sure you have your booster, remote rep, cyno, and emergency Falcon alts logged in and ready before you do any solo PVPing.
Adrie Atticus
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#540 - 2014-09-23 11:03:16 UTC
Oxide Ammar wrote:
Arsine Mayhem wrote:
Use it or lose it.

http://vincentoneve.wordpress.com/some-ideas-on-eve/an-influence-sovereignty-system/


I like this, rather than having load of systems not in use this will encourage ppl to habitat nullsec and do their pve/pvp activities otherwise you don't need all this space.


You'd have as much empty space as you have now, isn't one of the arguments for change to happen to see more targets in null?

System security tanks your PvE options heavily when it drops below -0.7 and that has to change.