Player Features and Ideas Discussion

Before the elitists start screaming, let's define what "too difficult" means. I'll even use the Angel Burner, which is prolly the easiest, in my example of the definition of "too difficult".

IMO, these missions are too difficult because too many ships, regardless of setup, will not be able to complete these mission (or might be able to complete with a severe lack of efficiency).

For example, the Angel Burner vs a Daredevil t2 fit is pretty easy. I was able to solo this burner using meta 4 guns and my hybrid wep skill is only trained up to 3 lol. On the other hand, my minmatar frigate related skills are much higher. I have yet to be able to solo the Angel burner with a projectile boat, such as the Dramiel. Has anyone been able to do this with a projectile turret boat? If so could you post a fit / strategy / vid? (Granted, I dont claim to be a frigate wiz, I could just be bad w/ the Dram, but hey, if it turns out to that way hopefully ill learn something xD)

At any rate, the difficultly here, to me anyway, feels like its pigeonholes the player into overly specific setups. Not having the freedom pick a ship and find a fit that works, coupled with a player new to these missions nearly guaranteed to loose their shiny-ish frigate on their first attempt(s), all for the possibility of relatively meager rewards... blows.

IMO, the difficulty of these missions should be set to a threshold that allows any player a reasonable expectation of success using an appropriately t2 fit pirate / t2 combat frigate of their choice, provided they have the sp. The first attempts IMO, should fall into the category of "just lost / barely won" rather than.... "wow, i didnt even land a hit / i didnt even get through the shields".

Burner missions are not designed for the average L4 mission runners, for most are just BS skilled PvE pilots.

Burner missions are a hard step towards unfair PvP and they all scale, Angel is not Guristas, which you can see at the estimated bonus time. As an example,. Bloodraiders bonus time is 45 minutes... Guristas way over 4 hours, that is a huge step in difficulty. You know how many pros have burned their ships ?

If you didn't read about them ..

Burner Rats are bling fit elite pirate rats (Super AI) with implants and off grid boost. - Even one on one in those stats you will have a hard time.

The weakest might be ok to do with T2 mods and decent skills, the next already requires a good counter fit and good flying, the next probably fleet, boost reps and so forth and all the while the Rats will be more clever ... they are exactly where they should be.

Loot is a bit disappointing though, they could at least drop some faction ammo and a tag, even if just for sentimental gains.

Its a step into PvP and fleet fights ... they are also skippable for every blitzer without any hits.

Been overloading and such. Any chance you were able to kill the angel burner with a projectile frigate? I mean, t2 fit w/ daredevil is a cakewalk as mentioned in my original post. But I have yet to kill it in a projectile boat. Any advice / fitting you have would be welcome.

Actually...


E: None of the above.

Could you explain why needing to use the right ship is a bad thing for a mission that is supposed to be similar to a PVP engagement?

If you wouldn't engage the ship with a projectile boat in PVP, why should a PVP simulation not reflect this?

The issue for me is not difficulty. They aren't hard. Fly in with the right countermeasures, engage, win. Yay.

The problem is that it's nothing but EFT warrioring. There's no gameplay here. Either your ship is up to the task or you die. It's even sadder when you realize this is INTENDED:



And to all the above posters, these were NOT intended to resemble PVP. Don't judge them by PVP standards. It was clearly stated that they are to give a challenge and option to fly frigates to mission runners:



I suggest that the problem is not that they are too difficult, but that they are too niche. It's a niche that very few players are interested in.

I wish that were true, indeed it was what I had hoped. But rather than rehash that point here is the source:




They are (to my mind, regrettably) nothing to do with PvP and just rats on steroids.

I disagree, it is not about the mechanics of PvP; but about the feeling of unfairness and unpreparedness which always emanates from a PvP engagement or even considering it, which is exactly the case here.
It forces you to consider and prepare for all eventualities and figure out counters before you actually 'know' how its gonna end (at least for now) and combined with the feeling and dread.. you might not make it out.

Anyway, in regards to the above post that Fozzy did it without bling etc ... well, he knows what they can do and what a good hard counter is. If that wouldn't be possible .. it probably wouldn't have made it into the game .. but not knowing that means exactly the excitement and difficulty we have .. or even just perceive at the moment.

Summery: Burner Missions are fine (and optional)

If burner missions were like PvP, you'd have a half dozen ships camping the acceleration gate before you could even warp to the target. Then the target would be fleet-boosted with logistics while everyone within 3 jumps piled on for the kill...

I hear ya man. EFT warrioring is quite fun. Just a heads up though, these rats might take you by surprise. Def test on the test server.

Some fun nostalgia:
My first attempt at any burner was against the angel burner. I got myself a firetial, dual ASB, some 200mm acs. I got this!.... Never landed a hit.... Same thing happened like 3 or 4 more times xD.

Shortly after completing the angel burner with a daredevil, I was feeling pretty confident. Next on my mission list was guristas. I thought to myself: I got this. This is a kiter. The daredevil has a great web bonus. I got my hardeners prepared to overload. I'll activate them at around half shields (<-- spoiler alert: terrible idea.) That rat's first volley put me into structure, or nearly did. Second volley put into a capsule.