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Warfare & Tactics

 
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Caldari wiped out of FW?

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Crosi Wesdo
War and Order
#221 - 2014-09-05 15:39:07 UTC
GavinGoodrich wrote:
So yeah...gg wp n' all that gallente. Try not to take this game too seriously, though. All this FW stuff is voluntary, not obligatory. We vote with our feet and our ships on what we feel like doing. I'm sure the pride of getting all the systems was great n' all, but how much of your free time did that suck up?

Man, Dota 2 is addicting. I might just give a few bil of the ships i pre-assembled in ichy to somebody else to use 'cause I'm movin' house soon and it seems like a waste, but resubbing when there's so many other good games that don't take up SO MUCH OF YOUR TIME to play are out there.

Also, May had a nice post a few pages back.

Long live the war. Not to sound like a condescending ****, but yeah...the war continues with or without 100% control. *edit* and you guys may be rivals on the forums but seriously, everyone teams up vs. a random 3rd party all the time.

Squids + pies vs. frogs
Squids vs. pies + frogs
Pies + pies vs. Squids
Pies + pies vs. Galls
random 0.0'ers vs. whoever else is around at the time.

The list goes on.


Just don't take this **** too seriously.


Who are you talking to?
Deacon Abox
Black Eagle5
#222 - 2014-09-05 15:39:27 UTC
GavinGoodrich wrote:
. . . , everyone teams up vs. a random 3rd party all the time.

Squids + pies vs. frogs
Squids vs. pies + frogs
Pies + pies vs. Squids
Pies + pies vs. Galls
random 0.0'ers vs. whoever else is around at the time.

The list goes on.


Just don't take this **** too seriously.


You missed the Squids + Frogs vs. pies , which has happened quite a bit in my 2+ years of FW. Remember Damar Day AttentionP

Anyway, good to see the squids with some new fighting spirit. And now maybe we can get unanimous support for fixing lp accumulation (whilst remembering that farming played some part but alone, and by quite a good margin, did not take the warzone).

CCP, there are off buttons for ship explosions, missile effects, turret effects, etc. "Immersion" does not seem to be harmed by those. So, [u]please[/u] give us a persisting off button for the jump gate and autoscan visuals.

Bad Messenger
Rehabilitation Clinic
#223 - 2014-09-05 15:58:15 UTC
Yun Kuai wrote:
emAugust wrote:
[list=1]


Quote:
THE CALDARI WAR MACHINE MARCHES ON.


http://i.imgur.com/ccusjJa.jpg



Since when did hiding in a POS next to a Titan become marching? Oh you nullbears never learn. When will people realize that fighting an enemy who only bridges an exact counter to your fleet and constantly has caps on standby is not fun to fight.

Hope you got lotion next to your chair for all those blue balls you're gonna get.


well, same goes with other tactics too so... who is not learning is the question
Bad Messenger
Rehabilitation Clinic
#224 - 2014-09-05 16:01:45 UTC
Veskrashen wrote:
Cearain wrote:

FW has overwhelming numbers of people deciding the occupancy war is not worth it.

At some point a rational person might decide to try and figure out why that is.

PROTIP: People who care about occupancy warfare don't generally care about LP or isk, beyond that needed to sustain the occupancy war.

Thus, those saying it's "not worth it" either don't have the organizational support to effectively engage in occupancy warfare, or are more interested in farming LP.


why to do same thing for cause when doing same elsewhere give lot of isk?
Thanatos Marathon
Moira.
#225 - 2014-09-05 17:10:01 UTC
Bad Messenger wrote:
why to do same thing for cause when doing same elsewhere give lot of isk?


Fun

JUSTK is recruiting
GavinGoodrich
Perkone
Caldari State
#226 - 2014-09-05 19:22:27 UTC
Crosi Wesdo wrote:
GavinGoodrich wrote:
stuff


Who are you talking to?


...Everyone on this forum in general?

Haaaaaalp my head's on fire
Crosi Wesdo
War and Order
#227 - 2014-09-05 19:48:50 UTC
GavinGoodrich wrote:
Crosi Wesdo wrote:
GavinGoodrich wrote:
stuff


Who are you talking to?


...Everyone on this forum in general?


Why? Maybe i missed the post you were responding to, seemed a bit random.
Cearain
Plus 10 NV
#228 - 2014-09-05 20:16:53 UTC
Thanatos Marathon wrote:
Bad Messenger wrote:
why to do same thing for cause when doing same elsewhere give lot of isk?


Fun


I agree with your answer. Isk can only be used ingame so what is the point if there is nothing fun to do with it? The question is whether getting an alt to rabbit plex (which we have already seen many in the gallente have done) is fun.

The overwhelming response from most people who thoroughly understand the mechanics is that they couldn't care less about the overall occupancy war. Now some people do think it's fun no doubt. Sasawong must have found it enjoyable for him and his alt Sheltering sky to get that many vp. But the vast majority who see how the occupancy game is played decide its not worth their time.



Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
X Gallentius
Black Eagle1
#229 - 2014-09-05 20:54:02 UTC
Cearain wrote:
The overwhelming response from most people who thoroughly understand the mechanics is that they couldn't care less about the overall occupancy war.
Maybe they should. Invariably, we get orders of magnitude MORE pvp fighting for occupancy than we get not fighting for it.
Epikurus
TheBlacklist
#230 - 2014-09-05 23:44:24 UTC
Veskrashen wrote:
Cearain wrote:

FW has overwhelming numbers of people deciding the occupancy war is not worth it.

At some point a rational person might decide to try and figure out why that is.

PROTIP: People who care about occupancy warfare don't generally care about LP or isk, beyond that needed to sustain the occupancy war.

Thus, those saying it's "not worth it" either don't have the organizational support to effectively engage in occupancy warfare, or are more interested in farming LP.


This is more or less a textbook example of a false dichotomy. I'm certainly not interested in defending Cearain's position but your 'either/or' is far from exhaustive.
Fenris Orion
Strata Victoria
Of Essence
#231 - 2014-09-06 00:22:09 UTC
Dear god, so much crying and foolishness in this thread.

Taking and especially keeping control of systems is of chief importance to people actively engaged in FW (non-farming-alts). Why!? Because all of our stuff is in stations, and if we loose control of the system we can't use those stations. Ergo: taking and keeping systems is a major effort and generates fantastic PVP opportunities in strategically important systems.

If you missed this concept somewhere along the way, do us all a favor, and go play WOW or something.

I wonder how many CalMil have ships and gear locked up in stations all across the war zone right now... I have a bunch of loot locked up in Tama right now myself, and put up quite a fight trying to disrupt the iHub bash for it. Hilarious fun, btw, killed an Oracle with my Astero before anyone could get to me.

Glad to have active targets again. Bring on the Squid Pasta!
Rahelis
Doomheim
#232 - 2014-09-06 07:45:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Rahelis
It is called alts, bro - no one cares for station lockouts. The concept ws flawed right from the start.


Every single aspect for FF/FW has serious desigh flaws.


I guess - guess - that CCP made FF/FW in the same mode they did WHs. Write some random code and look what players do with it.

Without being too critical with CCP - the dev`s cleary have none to zero understandings of big parts of their own product - them all being 100% nullbears. That sickness is found in the whole industry and military worldwide - ppl doing decisions mostly have no clue what they are doing.


If you would make LPs only for enemy farmer kills - young players would have no chance having success in FF. All accesses to FF space would be insta perma campef 23/7.


If you would make FF playable for high skilled players, many FF guys would never go to null sex - which is now a 100% farming zone. CCP does want to herd young players to nulls sex, where they bore themselves until they unsub. FW would have cap and BS fights like 3 years before and threaten null sex.


If you would make FF only accessible with say a standing of 3 or 5 with the npc empire - most ppl would never join FF. Only the diehards would play and thus absolutly dominate FW.


So CCP tries to make FF playable for everyone - 0.5 standing with an empire is way too low. You get 0.5 faction standing with beginners missions - that is a real bad idea to herd EVE noobs into FF. Think of begginner getting L4 high sec missions - that would be the same level of stupidness.


CCP does not understand that ppl join FF/FW for fun - I did that for over 3 years. CCP assumes that every EVE player is a nullbear and ONLY interested in farming. I never was interested in farming - but in my milita (Amarr) only about a handful of players feel the same way like me.


It would be damn simple to make Faction War far better than null sex - that is what CCP fears.


A structures, balanced and hard fought game enviroment is anathema to all that CCP wants in high and low sec. Same goes to WH space, CCP wants that the whole game is pointed via null sex.

As long as null sex is such a boring mess CCP is simply failing to design a well balanced game.
Arla Sarain
#233 - 2014-09-06 09:01:17 UTC
Fenris Orion wrote:
Dear god, so much crying and foolishness
all of our stuff is in stations, and if we loose control of the system we can't use those stations.
taking and keeping systems is a major effort and generates fantastic PVP opportunities in strategically important systems.

<- 8 months old and not as clueless as the quoted guy.
Yang Aurilen
State War Academy
Caldari State
#234 - 2014-09-06 09:40:30 UTC
Fenris Orion wrote:
Dear god, so much crying and foolishness in this thread.

Taking and especially keeping control of systems is of chief importance to people actively engaged in FW (non-farming-alts). Why!? Because all of our stuff is in stations, and if we loose control of the system we can't use those stations. Ergo: taking and keeping systems is a major effort and generates fantastic PVP opportunities in strategically important systems.

If you missed this concept somewhere along the way, do us all a favor, and go play WOW or something.

I wonder how many CalMil have ships and gear locked up in stations all across the war zone right now... I have a bunch of loot locked up in Tama right now myself, and put up quite a fight trying to disrupt the iHub bash for it. Hilarious fun, btw, killed an Oracle with my Astero before anyone could get to me.

Glad to have active targets again. Bring on the Squid Pasta!


Zero. Black frog and alts exists for a reason. Heck I still have my missioning bomber in innia because I'm too lazy to actually contract it to an alt and fly it out.

Post with your NPC alt main and not your main main alt!
Cearain
Plus 10 NV
#235 - 2014-09-06 13:18:55 UTC
Fenris Orion wrote:
Dear god, so much crying and foolishness in this thread.

Taking and especially keeping control of systems is of chief importance to people actively engaged in FW (non-farming-alts). Why!? Because all of our stuff is in stations, and if we loose control of the system we can't use those stations. Ergo: taking and keeping systems is a major effort and generates fantastic PVP opportunities in strategically important systems.

If you missed this concept somewhere along the way, do us all a favor, and go play WOW or something.

I wonder how many CalMil have ships and gear locked up in stations all across the war zone right now... I have a bunch of loot locked up in Tama right now myself, and put up quite a fight trying to disrupt the iHub bash for it. Hilarious fun, btw, killed an Oracle with my Astero before anyone could get to me.

Glad to have active targets again. Bring on the Squid Pasta!



Try your best to actually win occupancy for about a year and then come back and tell me about the rich strategy of the game.

Let me say you will either be like XG and Sasawong sitting an alt in plexes, or you will be like the other 499,900 players who think fw occupancy is not worth their time. Not to mention the numerous fw vets who left fw and often eve altogether.

And as far as WOW why would I play that? Thats a false dichotomy. There are other better games to learn/play with actual strategy. Eve can be good if they can get it so it delivers multiple entertaining fights in an hour and a half or so. But I am not interested in rabbit plexing with an alt.

Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
Thanatos Marathon
Moira.
#236 - 2014-09-06 13:53:07 UTC
Cearain maybe you should just move a bunch of ships to tama and see how long it takes you to get fights when you are undocked and flying around the system. Feel free to poke your head into suj/ked as well. All decent systems to find a few fights per hour no prob.

JUSTK is recruiting
Cearain
Plus 10 NV
#237 - 2014-09-06 14:26:49 UTC
Thanatos Marathon wrote:
Cearain maybe you should just move a bunch of ships to tama and see how long it takes you to get fights when you are undocked and flying around the system. Feel free to poke your head into suj/ked as well. All decent systems to find a few fights per hour no prob.



I could find alot of fights in null sec by undocking in a select few blobby null sec systems as well.

Ideally Faction war would to be a mechanic that forced people to spread out to defend their systems throughout the effected regions. CCP has had varying success at this. But the current iteration is as close to null sec as it has ever been. With the new disparaty between offensive and defensive plexing and Gallente's alt d-plexing army fw has never been such a blob for the win game.



The other issue is what would going to tama or ked really do from an occupancy perspective? I am sure I would gain more vp by having 4 alts rabbit plexing systems. I was in rvb and looked for something beyond just random fights with no overriding objective. And I had good fun doing it for a while. I played faction war that way and have fun doing that too, but its better in a neutral corp since you don't have to hassle around with de-plexing alts to dock and can shoot all the fw players. But again that game play is only fun for a while. CCP still needs to put it all together where fighting for occupancy as efficiently as possible does not involve any alts rabbit plexing. Until that happens you will have a choice whether you want to get as much pvp as possible or you want to gain occupancy as much as possible.

Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
X Gallentius
Black Eagle1
#238 - 2014-09-06 14:46:09 UTC
Cearain wrote:
Try your best to actually win occupancy for about a year and then come back and tell me about the rich strategy of the game.
We've done it twice and I've tried to tell you all about it but you won't listen. Big smile
Cearain
Plus 10 NV
#239 - 2014-09-06 16:46:50 UTC
X Gallentius wrote:
Cearain wrote:
Try your best to actually win occupancy for about a year and then come back and tell me about the rich strategy of the game.
We've done it twice and I've tried to tell you all about it but you won't listen. Big smile


I listened. Your alt captured over 100 plexes in 2 weeks. Your main didn't even have that many vp during that week.

Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
Crosi Wesdo
War and Order
#240 - 2014-09-06 17:15:55 UTC
Cearain wrote:
X Gallentius wrote:
Cearain wrote:
Try your best to actually win occupancy for about a year and then come back and tell me about the rich strategy of the game.
We've done it twice and I've tried to tell you all about it but you won't listen. Big smile


I listened. Your alt captured over 100 plexes in 2 weeks. Your main didn't even have that many vp during that week.


Why have a dog and wag your own tail? If people allow these toothless alts to operate, they clearly dont care enough about the area. Why would someone sit their pvp toons in an area no one is fighting for?

Horses for courses my silly friend. I dont light cynos with my pvp toons either, or haul, or any number of other activities.

Bring fights to my alts and ill bring my pvp toon to your fights.

I know you just like to spout inconsistent objections to how everyone else plays the game and accuse people with far more kills this year than you have ever had of being farmers, because you are terrible at eve and have barely participated in FW on anythihng other than a solo grunt level, but posting the same tired nonsense and offering no solutions or at best things that would make it worse grows tiresome.

Stop posting, thanks.