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Intergalactic Summit

 
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Disciples of Ston

Author
Eran Mintor
Metropolis Commercial Consortium
#401 - 2014-05-06 21:04:30 UTC
Who are the officials?

-Eran
Tahrmal Nalthkh
Disciples of Ston
#402 - 2014-05-06 22:28:17 UTC
Eran Mintor wrote:
Who are the officials?

-Eran


In time an explanation of the identity of the officials invited will be given that will likely not satisfy most of those who want that information. Those inquiring should know that DSTON is operating on a sort of shared protocol with another parallel situation involving another organization. For now I am most eager to protect the identity of the baseline officials involved and will not reveal names unless given permission to do so. As of yet, we are not sure if capsuleer representatives will be invited to the summit. We will give it consideration and we are interested in one particular organization but have not yet made contact with them about the summit.

Dr. Tahrmal Nalthkh CEO, DSTON Rescue Pilot

Jandice Ymladris
Aurora Arcology
#403 - 2014-05-10 20:26:43 UTC
I'm following the reports of DSTOn about this summit as close as I can, due to personal interest.

I do wish you all the luck and sensibility on this sensitive matter. May level-headedness and common sense prevail!

Providing a new home for refugees in the Aurora Arcology

Tahrmal Nalthkh
Disciples of Ston
#404 - 2014-05-11 00:29:36 UTC
Is a small scale cultural integration possible?
Should such an effort be successful, could it lead to larger scale cultural integration?

Participants:
Hedion: Professor of cultural anthropology
Hedion: Professor of economics
Pator Tech: Professor of Political Science and International Trade
Republic University: Professor of Urban Studies

This is as much information about the participants that I have permission to share. Each is experienced in diplomatic efforts in addition to their academic responsibilities.

The Summit is dealing with non-capsuleer perceptions and analysis of capsuleer efforts to establish mixed communities of non-capsuleers involved in their humanitarian programs. DSTON has been scratching our collective head on this issue since we first began to rescue both slaves and slavers, sometimes in the same deathcan.

This is all I am going to post at this time but I have asked Ston Momaki to comment, because his experience in this issue predates mine, and DSTON dealt with some of these issue in the past.

Dr. Tahrmal Nalthkh CEO, DSTON Rescue Pilot

Ston Momaki
Disciples of Ston
#405 - 2014-05-11 17:25:29 UTC
Our idealism is both our best friend and our worst enemy. DSTON is fueled by idealism. Without it we would not continue doing our work. However, that same idealism has generated our worst blunders. Why? Sometimes idealism, especially the kind that drive humanitarian efforts, peaceful efforts, humanism in general, can blind a person or organization to the reality of persistent issues of human nature. We see what we want to see rather than what is really out there. The same value can be light to show the path and a “blinding fault.”

That said, sometime good advice comes from unexpected areas. Quite some time ago, I had sought feedback in this forum about plans to incorporate rescued slavers in rehabilitation programs involving community service in our Matriculation Centers. Capsuleer pilot Istvaan Shogaatsu raised the red flag and returned sound advice to us to slow down and take a closer look at the social ramifications of such plans. This is tough medicine for idealists such as ourselves to swallow. But, we did. We delayed that program, and it is still in delay mode until we are sure it would do more good than harm.

We are still asking the same questions today and that is the reason for the summit. Early reports from the Summit confirm what we guessed: Small scale successes in project oriented cultural integrations do not translate into larger scale projects. Larger numbers typically lead to exponential social problems. This feels like a knife to the heart of the Idealist who wants everyone to get along and for society to progress. These things require more time than we sometimes possess the patience for.

Example: Even in the massive infrastructure of the station housing our Kaap Center, we still set the critical mass of rescued slavers at about 50 before we transfer them to the D-Center in Yulai. Even just the knowledge that there are a “bunch” of those guys on the station, sets the rest of the M-Center twitchy. Our current policy is one of separation. It is not our ideal.

We look forward to hearing the Summit report.

The Disciples of Ston bid you peace

Samira Kernher
Cail Avetatu
#406 - 2014-05-11 18:34:52 UTC
It is still my recommendation that slavers be returned to their empires of origin. If their practices were illegal, then they will face appropriate justice for their actions. If they were not, as is the case for most slavers of origin in the Amarr Empire, then it is immoral to keep them detained.
Deitra Vess
Non-Hostile Target
Wild Geese.
#407 - 2014-05-11 19:30:43 UTC
Samira Kernher wrote:
It is still my recommendation that slavers be returned to their empires of origin. If their practices were illegal, then they will face appropriate justice for their actions. If they were not, as is the case for most slavers of origin in the Amarr Empire, then it is immoral to keep them detained.


If they left their area to do what would be deemed illegal in the area they were operating in, shouldn't they still be held accountable for their actions?
Samira Kernher
Cail Avetatu
#408 - 2014-05-11 19:37:36 UTC  |  Edited by: Samira Kernher
Of course. I didn't say they shouldn't?
Deitra Vess
Non-Hostile Target
Wild Geese.
#409 - 2014-05-12 01:16:39 UTC
Samira Kernher wrote:
Of course. I didn't say they shouldn't?


I might have misunderstood what you were saying, im saying if they were caught in a place where its illegal they should face the conscequences of their actions in the area they were caught, I mean why let them get a slap on the wrist if they knowingly went over a place they know its illegal and did it anyways. It may be legal where they come from, but not everywhere...
Samira Kernher
Cail Avetatu
#410 - 2014-05-12 01:47:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Samira Kernher
It is intergalactic law. You're mistaken if you think a slaver conducting illegal slavetaking outside the Empire would be given leniency in Imperial courts.

This is not a matter of 'being caught'. The Disciples are not a police force. They are humanitarians rescuing people from deathcans and other life-threatening situations (and most of these rescues happen in Amarr space, by the way). It is only appropriate that citizens be returned to their home empires and, if they were involved in any criminal activity, that they be tried accordingly. This might entail extradition to other empires for crimes committed there, according to established extradition treaties, or punishment at home. Either way, it is a matter that should be handled by formal authorities.
Ston Momaki
Disciples of Ston
#411 - 2014-05-13 22:46:43 UTC
Samira Kernher wrote:
It is intergalactic law. You're mistaken if you think a slaver conducting illegal slavetaking outside the Empire would be given leniency in Imperial courts.

This is not a matter of 'being caught'. The Disciples are not a police force. They are humanitarians rescuing people from deathcans and other life-threatening situations (and most of these rescues happen in Amarr space, by the way). It is only appropriate that citizens be returned to their home empires and, if they were involved in any criminal activity, that they be tried accordingly. This might entail extradition to other empires for crimes committed there, according to established extradition treaties, or punishment at home. Either way, it is a matter that should be handled by formal authorities.


In a very real measure, Ms. Kernher is correct. For this reason, we often attract a persistent criticism for our actions regarding the Slavers we rescue from deathcans. It is correct to say that slavers in violation of treaty would not receive lenience within the Empire. This is precisely why we do what we do. Though we have explained this principle many times over, I will do so once again. Slavers tell us that if they are returned to the Empire for trial, it is likely they will be executed or enslaved together with their families. The treaty between the Empire and the State is of such import that violations are held as extreme offenses and non-capsuleers are not protected from the harshest of punishments. Since we countenance neither the death penalty nor generational slavery, we detain the slavers we rescue in our own facilities. Slavers will not be handed over to such punishments. Unless and until the death penalty and slavery are off the table of justice, our actions will continue as is.

We know that some regard this very negatively and we live with that perpetual frown upon us as a necessary consequence of our beliefs. In fact, we have been called outlaws, pirates and rogues because of this particular position. So it must remain.

The Disciples of Ston bid you peace

Tahrmal Nalthkh
Disciples of Ston
#412 - 2014-05-14 13:02:49 UTC
Having returned from Yulai, I offer the following summit report:

Recommended: Small scale project/task focused carefully selected integrated groups possibly leading to larger small scale groups. With time, contingencies and great patience: smaller large scale project focused integrated groups. The report suggests that pressing for fully integrated groups in too great of a hurry will short-circuit the process and could result in dangerous conflict.

Integration on the project level must be carefully managed to ensure equal interdependence of the parts with careful attention to shared authority and equal economic and social benefit. The social strata within natural communities will not appear as such in the project focused integrations.

Capsuleers just beginning the process should precede with the assumption of separation of conflicting cultural groups until careful study is done and then begin with very small task oriented integration. Size of groups should be grown very slowly. Where cultural groups are highly conflicted, it may not be possible to begin any integrated groups apart from extensive pre-education and testing. Any growth of such groups once begun should be highly calculated and cautious.

With regard to the Kameiras, all participants agreed that this highly indoctrinated military group is not well suited to experimental integration within any previous context of conflict. As long as the Kameiras exist as a present subculture with a high degree of personal identity, they ought to remain as a socially separated entity where conflict is likely. The study group also cautioned against what they called “capsuleer presumption” and the risk of disenfranchising groups such as the Kameiras. Such disenfranchisement could result in unpredictable results that are difficult to manage peacefully. We at DSTON receive this exhortation as a warning to our own tendency to hubris. It is not for us to press our own “hopes” upon the Kameiras that come under our jurisdiction as is our want to do. This is one reason we are somewhat anxious to know how the PIE program is initially working to see if we ought to continue participating with other Kameira elements in our care.

On the practical side: I was reminded by Ston as we were arranging for the transfer of rescued Slavers from the Kaap Center to Yulai that only 50 of the 55 were going to be transferred. Five were to remain in Kaap as part of a very small scale integration in our service dog training program. Carefully selected slavers skilled in working with the rescued slaver hounds assist the other trainers in this program. We have kept this at a very small scale and so far there have been no issues.

The upshot of this preliminary report is that it is likely we will continue to participate in the PIE re-assignment program for disaffected Kameiras. Of all the things it could be, the fact that it aids civilians in war torn areas is a large determiner in our estimation.

Dr. Tahrmal Nalthkh CEO, DSTON Rescue Pilot

Pieter Tuulinen
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#413 - 2014-05-14 15:11:35 UTC
It has always been my understanding that culturally disparate group are immiscible to a certain extent. You have to allow culturally distinctive groups to encyst within the greater body of the population with those of their own type. I used to employ a large proportion of Sebiestor technicians within my ground crews and found it worked best when these groups provided their own officers and supervisors and were allowed to police themselves (Within State legal guidelines). I even found it necessary to amend basic contractual details of employment in order to better mesh with Sebiestor cultural norms.

This approach only worked because I allowed the Sebiestor to encyst within the community of my ground crews as a semi-separate cultural group. Had I attempted to integrate them further then there would have been friction - either as a result of others having to work around Sebiestor cultural expectations or my forcing the Sebiestor to acclimate to State cultural expectations.

Manage disparate cultures by keeping them separate as much as possible - or selecting flexible individuals who are open to change.

For the first time since I started the conversation, he looks me dead in the eye. In his gaze are steel jackhammers, quiet vengeance, a hundred thousand orbital bombs frozen in still life.

Jandice Ymladris
Aurora Arcology
#414 - 2014-05-14 19:21:32 UTC
Thank you for the Summit overview.

It aligns well with what I experienced. A good way to keep order is to make sure there's culturally distinctive districts, allowing people to feel 'home' in a way.
This need for a place reminding them of 'home' tends to grow along with the size of the population.

On kameiras being resistant to integration, it follows naturally if one realizes how Kameiras are selected. It assures they only see the Amarr population as suitable to live amongst, believing them to be 'superior' It is also part of the issue that makes them controversial to have around.
Not as controversial as others... like Slavers, but at least slavers can still be re-integrated into society, provided that they are willing and a good program is set up. It still needs to be closely watched, as they are reviled due to their old profession.

Concerning the PIE program, I'm closely watching it as well, so far it seems good, and looking into supporting it further to reduce Kameira numbers at the Arcology Station.

Providing a new home for refugees in the Aurora Arcology

Manwe Todako
Disciples of Ston
#415 - 2014-07-15 01:17:19 UTC
I just completed my patrol route and all was clear. I did find some time to think about a recent interaction with a blood cult member and wanted to clarify a couple things. The Blooder referred to Ston Momaki as a false prophet. As long as I have known Ston, he has never considered himself a prophet nor a particularly religious man period.

"Disciple" is one of those words that can smack of religion, so its purer meaning is often lost. A disciple is one who comes under a prescribed discipline. Sometimes this can refer to a religion, but it can also refer to just about any pursuit. The Disciples of Ston, I recall, was a name originally given in jest, but there is a grain of descriptive accuracy in it. For a period of time, I left the discipline while sorting out some anger issues of my own. I returned to the discipline when I could embrace it again. Believe me, peace and non-violence is a discipline, especially for anyone who has ever struggled with anger or unresolved conflict.

We are just people who have chosen a discipline. Each of us has our own religious values and ideas that are more or less connected with the discipline but quite distinct from it. Ston just happens to be the namesake of the corporation but I think he would consider himself just as much a "disciple" in the pure sense of the term as any of us.

SANKOFA

Lunarisse Aspenstar
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#416 - 2014-08-11 05:00:04 UTC
Manwe Todako wrote:
I just completed my patrol route and all was clear. I did find some time to think about a recent interaction with a blood cult member and wanted to clarify a couple things. The Blooder referred to Ston Momaki as a false prophet. As long as I have known Ston, he has never considered himself a prophet nor a particularly religious man period.

"Disciple" is one of those words that can smack of religion, so its purer meaning is often lost. A disciple is one who comes under a prescribed discipline. Sometimes this can refer to a religion, but it can also refer to just about any pursuit. The Disciples of Ston, I recall, was a name originally given in jest, but there is a grain of descriptive accuracy in it. For a period of time, I left the discipline while sorting out some anger issues of my own. I returned to the discipline when I could embrace it again. Believe me, peace and non-violence is a discipline, especially for anyone who has ever struggled with anger or unresolved conflict.

We are just people who have chosen a discipline. Each of us has our own religious values and ideas that are more or less connected with the discipline but quite distinct from it. Ston just happens to be the namesake of the corporation but I think he would consider himself just as much a "disciple" in the pure sense of the term as any of us.



Speaking of blood cult members, I am curious as to whether the Disciples of Ston's pacifism and non-violence extends to the truly recalcitrant. Those who continuing killing without mercy or reason. At what point does the moral surety of pacifism lend little comfort to the thousands who die while those who deem themselves "good" stand by idly and preach but do not take action. At what point does it give way to the need to confront evil decisively?
Morwen Lagann
Tyrathlion Interstellar
#417 - 2014-08-11 12:34:14 UTC
Presumably, at the point where he discovers that dying pointlessly without firing even a single shot in self-defense serves not a single purpose but to massage his own ego, and not only doesn't help anyone supposedly under his charge but actively harms them.

Of course, should that occur, it's worth noting (as many have done before) he will have quite a large and likely well-armed force behind him, considering all of the equipment he's "confiscated" over the years.

Morwen Lagann

CEO, Tyrathlion Interstellar

Coordinator, Arataka Research Consortium

Owner, The Golden Masque

Manwe Todako
Disciples of Ston
#418 - 2014-08-12 23:21:41 UTC
The DSS Beacon has been moth-balled and will likely seldom see service in spite of the intention of the Development office to keep her in standby. There simply is no active service justification for her specifications. I will miss piloting her. She was an elegant and beautiful vessel. I am now aboard the DSS Benefactor with a far more practical fit for rescue work.

SANKOFA

Ston Momaki
Disciples of Ston
#419 - 2014-09-04 00:17:37 UTC
Finding wisdom in the counsel of friends and those appointed to oversee:

DSTON development chose to send Manwe Todako into Delve to extract and securely conduct 20 refugees out of Blood Cult space and to a new high security system Matriculation Center in Shenda. Why didn't they send me since I had received the contract for the 20 freed slaves from Pilot Funk? It is because they know that good will though most often "good" can also be a distraction and lead to ill. However, they knew that between the two of us, Manwe would chose the crew and staff appropriate for the situation and would exercise due caution, refusing all distraction in the task.

I've been told by a trusted source that Ms. Funk is a dangerous and violent blood cult member and would just as soon "drink me for lunch" as look at me. That I do not know, but it might be true. It is very, very odd that both Manwe and Tahrmal have both received terrible standing notification by Ms. Funk, but I have not. That in itself feels wrong and very suspicious. We will care for the fefugees in Shenda but watch them carefully.

Ms. Funk, if you read this, let us know what this was all about, would you?

Ston

P.S. Thank you Che Biko for your kind and cautious words. Pass on my thanks to those you consulted as well.

The Disciples of Ston bid you peace

Lunarisse Aspenstar
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#420 - 2014-11-07 17:11:58 UTC  |  Edited by: Lunarisse Aspenstar
Ston Momaki wrote:
Finding wisdom in the counsel of friends and those appointed to oversee:

DSTON development chose to send Manwe Todako into Delve to extract and securely conduct 20 refugees out of Blood Cult space and to a new high security system Matriculation Center in Shenda. Why didn't they send me since I had received the contract for the 20 freed slaves from Pilot Funk? It is because they know that good will though most often "good" can also be a distraction and lead to ill. However, they knew that between the two of us, Manwe would chose the crew and staff appropriate for the situation and would exercise due caution, refusing all distraction in the task.

I've been told by a trusted source that Ms. Funk is a dangerous and violent blood cult member and would just as soon "drink me for lunch" as look at me. That I do not know, but it might be true. It is very, very odd that both Manwe and Tahrmal have both received terrible standing notification by Ms. Funk, but I have not. That in itself feels wrong and very suspicious. We will care for the fefugees in Shenda but watch them carefully.

Ms. Funk, if you read this, let us know what this was all about, would you?

Ston

P.S. Thank you Che Biko for your kind and cautious words. Pass on my thanks to those you consulted as well.


Given the communications silence since this and the 9-28 post on the specific reports thread, I confess to having a grave concern that Mr. Todako's efforts to retrieve persons from the clutches of Blooders in Delve may have met a tragic end. Can you apprise?