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The New Caldari - An Observation
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Stitcher
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#41 - 2014-09-01 03:38:01 UTC  |  Edited by: Stitcher
Skye Nico wrote:
Diana Kim wrote:

While Caldari capsuleers were defending the State, flying in fleets to defend out systems or to attack occupied by enemy zones, he has chosen to not be part of us, part of the State, he didn't want to be Caldari, and thus he is not among us.


This is a load of ****. It is legally impossible to be a State citizen if you are not born there. It does not matter if you 'want to be Caldari' or not.


You should probably have quoted a paragraph where she wasn't specifically vomiting out some more calumnied bilgewater about me, Pilot Nico. I was very much born in the State.

In any event, you've got that wrong. - immigration to the State by foreign-born nationals is perfectly possible. There are just a few caveats that many potential migrants would find offputting.

A minority of State citizens were born abroad and are of ethnic groups other than the principle ones most commonly identified as Caldari. We're talking roughly 1% here, but we have ethnic Gallenteans from the Federation, Khanid, Minmatar, you name it.

Of course, if you're a State citizen you are expected to behave like one. The Megacorporate Meritocraitc system largely treats ethnicity as an irrelevance, a joke or, if somebody is particularly keen on practising their ethnic identity, as a disruption to harmonious social homogeneity. It's not that you can't become a State citizen if you were born abroad - it's that if you were born abroad and are proud of that fact then you're not behaving like a Caldari, and we are the Caldari State. Cases like the Provist administration which treated otherwise excellent citizens who happened to have a hint of Gallentean genome as borderline criminals are an anomaly.

A Minmatar, for example, who wished to immigrate to the State, would be expected to renounce their voluval mark, clan markings and tattoos in order to integrate into the State's mainstream, or else find themselves pushed into a client colony without a fraction of the opportunities or room to advance. In light of that, it's hardly surprising then that we have so little immigration. It's neither illegal nor impossible, it's just that we're not interested in multiculturalism. The State is for Caldari. If you want to share in its bounty, you need to be Caldari, but that word is a philosophical rather than an ethnic term.

"Our House, Our Rules".

AKA Hambone

Author of The Deathworlders
Skye Nico
#42 - 2014-09-01 05:00:12 UTC  |  Edited by: Skye Nico
Stitcher wrote:
Skye Nico wrote:
Diana Kim wrote:

While Caldari capsuleers were defending the State, flying in fleets to defend out systems or to attack occupied by enemy zones, he has chosen to not be part of us, part of the State, he didn't want to be Caldari, and thus he is not among us.


This is a load of ****. It is legally impossible to be a State citizen if you are not born there. It does not matter if you 'want to be Caldari' or not.


You should probably have quoted a paragraph where she wasn't specifically vomiting out some more calumnied bilgewater about me, Pilot Nico. I was very much born in the State.

In any event, you've got that wrong. - immigration to the State by foreign-born nationals is perfectly possible. There are just a few caveats that many potential migrants would find offputting.

A minority of State citizens were born abroad and are of ethnic groups other than the principle ones most commonly identified as Caldari. We're talking roughly 1% here, but we have ethnic Gallenteans from the Federation, Khanid, Minmatar, you name it.

Of course, if you're a State citizen you are expected to behave like one. The Megacorporate Meritocraitc system largely treats ethnicity as an irrelevance, a joke or, if somebody is particularly keen on practising their ethnic identity, as a disruption to harmonious social homogeneity. It's not that you can't become a State citizen if you were born abroad - it's that if you were born abroad and are proud of that fact then you're not behaving like a Caldari, and we are the Caldari State. Cases like the Provist administration which treated otherwise excellent citizens who happened to have a hint of Gallentean genome as borderline criminals are an anomaly.

A Minmatar, for example, who wished to immigrate to the State, would be expected to renounce their voluval mark, clan markings and tattoos in order to integrate into the State's mainstream, or else find themselves pushed into a client colony without a fraction of the opportunities or room to advance. In light of that, it's hardly surprising then that we have so little immigration. It's neither illegal nor impossible, it's just that we're not interested in multiculturalism. The State is for Caldari. If you want to share in its bounty, you need to be Caldari, but that word is a philosophical rather than an ethnic term.

"Our House, Our Rules".


I believe you are confusing residence with citizenship.
Jinari Otsito
Otsito Mining and Manufacture
#43 - 2014-09-01 08:11:03 UTC
Pretty sure he responded to a post about citizenship and whether or not it was possible to attain as a foreigner.

Prime Node. Ask me about augmentation.
Desiderya
Blue Canary
Watch This
#44 - 2014-09-01 09:30:47 UTC
Ladies and Gentlemen,

I'm seeing it like Jude and am sorry for being so awesome.



Proceed.

Ruthlessness is the kindness of the wise.
Skye Nico
#45 - 2014-09-01 13:46:19 UTC
Jinari Otsito wrote:
Pretty sure he responded to a post about citizenship and whether or not it was possible to attain as a foreigner.


The source material he referenced is out of date and incorrect. I responded with more recent material that clears up the issue. It is possible for someone born outside of the State to have residence that includes many of the benefits of citizenship, but full citizenship is not possible for them.
Stitcher
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#46 - 2014-09-01 14:13:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Stitcher
I think what we have here, gentlepilots, is a clear example of things in the State being a little more complicated than can adequately be given a brief summary. One source says one thing, another contradicts it... let's just accept for now that in a society as heavily fractured along corporate lines as ours, what's true for Lai Dai may not be true for Hyasyoda.

There are some thousands of billions of people living in the State after all, and I would consider it deeply unlikely for there to be NO exceptions whatsoever to any general rule you might make about the nature of their citizenship or legal status.

AKA Hambone

Author of The Deathworlders
Katrina Oniseki
Oniseki-Raata Internal Watch
Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
#47 - 2014-09-01 14:48:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Katrina Oniseki
The next time I see you, Steff, I'm going to answer everything you say with "For the Staaaaaate!".

Just for making this thread.

Katrina Oniseki
Veikitamo Gesakaarin
Doomheim
#48 - 2014-09-02 01:07:42 UTC
I still fail to see what the actual issue is though. The vast majority of IGS discussion is not unlike people discussing a Splinterz match over drinks. Talk of your favourite teams, the performance of players, and general statistics does not change the fact that you're not playing on the field yourself.

Kurilaivonen|Concern
Claudia Osyn
Non-Hostile Target
Wild Geese.
#49 - 2014-09-02 16:51:34 UTC
[Obligatory rabble rousing]


Carry on.

A little trust goes a long way. The less you use, the further you'll go.
Jude Kopenhagen
Stormcrows
#50 - 2014-09-02 17:56:05 UTC
Desiderya wrote:
Ladies and Gentlemen,

I'm seeing it like Jude and am sorry for being so awesome.



Proceed.


Hahahaha, nice try.

No, seriously, what does "Sorry" mean?

I am shadow, ruled by light.
Desiderya
Blue Canary
Watch This
#51 - 2014-09-02 20:38:09 UTC
In this case? Being polite and humble.

Ruthlessness is the kindness of the wise.
Jude Kopenhagen
Stormcrows
#52 - 2014-09-02 22:16:52 UTC
Desiderya wrote:
In this case? Being polite and humble.


But you always are, it comes with being awesome.

I am shadow, ruled by light.
Quintrala
Sisters of Eve eXpeditonary
#53 - 2014-09-03 01:17:55 UTC
Jude Kopenhagen wrote:
Desiderya wrote:
Ladies and Gentlemen,

I'm seeing it like Jude and am sorry for being so awesome.

Hahahaha, nice try.

No, seriously, what does "Sorry" mean?

Need I remind you?

Q
Morgan Wulver
SAYR Reserve Guard
SAYR Galactic
#54 - 2014-09-03 02:37:58 UTC
If you Stormcrows want to start a riot so easily, you could just toss a brick through a window or something instead of harnessing generations of cultural hatred.

Kirjuun! Uakan! Teknikiara! Kanpai kameitsamuu! Ra ra ra!
Veikitamo Gesakaarin
Doomheim
#55 - 2014-09-03 10:35:59 UTC
Morgan Wulver wrote:
If you Stormcrows want to start a riot so easily, you could just toss a brick through a window or something instead of harnessing generations of cultural hatred.


Who would start a riot? Those too easily offended by words on the IGS?

Kurilaivonen|Concern
Elmund Egivand
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#56 - 2014-09-03 10:50:38 UTC
Morgan Wulver wrote:
If you Stormcrows want to start a riot so easily, you could just toss a brick through a window or something instead of harnessing generations of cultural hatred.


Wrong. If you want the Stormcrows to start a riot you need to sign an agreement with them and make the down-payment.

A Minmatar warship is like a rusting Beetle with 500 horsepower Cardillac engines in the rear, armour plating bolted to chassis and a M2 Browning stuck on top.
Steffanie Saissore
Tyrathlion Interstellar
#57 - 2014-09-03 12:32:47 UTC
Morgan Wulver wrote:
If you Stormcrows want to start a riot so easily, you could just toss a brick through a window or something instead of harnessing generations of cultural hatred.


First, this is my personal observation and not one shared by the rest of the Stormcrows. Also, if you did just a little research, you would realize that the majority of the Stormcrows are Caldari.

We travel in the dark of the new moon,

A starry highway traced on the map of the sky
Jude Kopenhagen
Stormcrows
#58 - 2014-09-03 20:56:04 UTC
Steffanie Saissore wrote:
Also, if you did just a little research, you would realize that the majority of the Stormcrows are Caldari.


I thought we all were...

I am shadow, ruled by light.
Steffanie Saissore
Tyrathlion Interstellar
#59 - 2014-09-03 21:08:13 UTC
Jude Kopenhagen wrote:
Steffanie Saissore wrote:
Also, if you did just a little research, you would realize that the majority of the Stormcrows are Caldari.


I thought we all were...


Do I need to pull out the application form?

We travel in the dark of the new moon,

A starry highway traced on the map of the sky
Jude Kopenhagen
Stormcrows
#60 - 2014-09-03 21:10:55 UTC
Steffanie Saissore wrote:
Jude Kopenhagen wrote:
Steffanie Saissore wrote:
Also, if you did just a little research, you would realize that the majority of the Stormcrows are Caldari.


I thought we all were...


Do I need to pull out the application form?


Sorry Ma'am, no ma'am.

Gosh, you certainly have our sense of humour.

I am shadow, ruled by light.