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Wormholes

 
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WH sites not spawning?

First post
Author
DaReaper
Net 7
Cannon.Fodder
#21 - 2014-08-30 23:40:30 UTC
Surrian O'Connor wrote:
3 **** gas sites and finally a combat site im my c5. gg ccp, you win. moth balling the system at the next appropriate entrance i think.



awesome, less supply means t3 prices will rise, means more money for me. sweet

OMG Comet Mining idea!!! Comet Mining!

Eve For life.

Maduin Shi
MAGA Inc
#22 - 2014-08-31 06:32:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Maduin Shi
DaReaper wrote:
Surrian O'Connor wrote:
3 **** gas sites and finally a combat site im my c5. gg ccp, you win. moth balling the system at the next appropriate entrance i think.



awesome, less supply means t3 prices will rise, means more money for me. sweet


Edit: Nevermind
corbexx
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#23 - 2014-08-31 13:19:47 UTC
Maduin Shi wrote:
corbexx wrote:


aye agree.

although after a patch (espeically the first wh patch in 3 years) stuff should be up even if its just due to people trying **** out. so if its down early on that could be a issue, although the oposite is true and it coudl be people need a month to figure it out.

need to wait for numbers. although my worry is by the time we get them **** will already be in a really bad stage.


It could be symptomatic of a big drop in WH groups farming their static connections, since its now a lot harder to secure an inactive static. "Parking lot" wormhole systems may be becoming a bigger problem.


aye but this is still bad. People need to make isk and they are still in space so targets which provide content.
Pro TIps
Doomheim
#24 - 2014-08-31 13:47:01 UTC
We have one new combat site today. Sorry, I mean one new combat site since Tuesday. :(
Sequester Risalo
German Corps of Engineers 17
Federation of Respect Honor Passion Alliance.
#25 - 2014-09-01 09:01:55 UTC  |  Edited by: Sequester Risalo
Maduin Shi wrote:
There's a "pool" of sites that are shared by... a given constellation or region of w-space I forget which. Though the meaning of those terms is sort of lost given how w-space works. But if you run a site, it will respawn in some other w-space system that TQ associates with your constellation/region.


Has this ever been confirmed? I only read about this a s a theory or rumour. Did CCP ever verify that this is actually the case?
AtomYcX
Perkone
Caldari State
#26 - 2014-09-01 11:49:01 UTC
Sequester Risalo wrote:
Maduin Shi wrote:
There's a "pool" of sites that are shared by... a given constellation or region of w-space I forget which. Though the meaning of those terms is sort of lost given how w-space works. But if you run a site, it will respawn in some other w-space system that TQ associates with your constellation/region.


Has this ever been confirmed? I only read about this a s a theory or roumor. Did CCP ever verify that this is actually the case?


It doesn't seem to be true in my experience, we put scouts in every wormhole system in our constellation (5 other systems) and warped every site whenever they popped up for over a month, and we didn't see a huge influx of sites in our home system.
Trinkets friend
Sudden Buggery
Sending Thots And Players
#27 - 2014-09-02 00:45:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Trinkets friend
Yes, I too have noticed lots and lots of empty systems. C4s with no or one site in them. The normal is for any wormhole to have a minimum of 2-3 sites. You can roll your hole for 4 hours into 8 subsequent C4's and on the ninth find one with 40 sites.

There are some things I would like to just randomly point out in case CCP Greyscale needs to dunk CCP Fozzie headfirst into a bin and unbugger whatever maths has been screwed up here.

OK, so you spent 4 hours of very risky rage-rolling finding the holy grail C4 bear haven with 40 sites. it has 8 wormholes connecting to it, 4 of which are frigate sized. Most people do not run the sites in here because you cannot close the frigate holes down.

So you are up to 4 hours times 5 meatbods time (20 man-hours) to find one system which has decent amounts of PVE content, out of 9 wormholes.

We have two explanations.
The First
Eight of those wormholes either have very efficient carebears who smack down every sleeper site within hours of it coming up, and live from orcas and have no POSs in 4 of those holes (50% vacancy rate is implied, gg CCP). In the other 4 inhabited holes, they are equally puissant at instantly running sites, such that nothing remains.

The Second
Wormholes are not actually spawning.

There's a bad mechanism at work here, too. maybe this will change as people HTFU and adjust to having 4 frigate wormholes open in their system. Maybe people are just being rational, though, and not ratting when there are too many wormholes open. As said above, if CCP doesn't climb down fast from a bad change or tweak things in the RNG so that there's more reward to go with the increased risk, then people are going to either unsub or leave.

One of the above 5 meatbods hasn't run sites in two weeks due to the corp moving out of a Cataclysmic hole 9because they now suck thanks to Hyperion), and moving in to our new hole, which is still potentially hostile. It's also a C4 with two wormhole statics, and a frig hole per day, so it's more risky. We spent hours rolling to get PVE content in the C4 and found nothing we could do (using our rational brains). In a few weeks, my poverty stricken corpie's sub runs out, one two accounts, and he's gone from game because he cannot afford to pay $30/mo and won't pay $30/mo now everything is borked.

Lets put it this way. if CCP borked the sov upgrades which give infinite and endless respawns of Sanctums (a different issue in and of itself, would really enjoy that in w-space), we'd see the whole forums locked down by the ISD gestapo because of the QQ. Yet here we are, with plenty of anecdotal evidence something is awry in w-space spawning mechanics after someone put their poo-finger in the pie (no names) and it's glorious silence.

No Local is a feature of the wormholes, not the forums.

CCP/ISD need to sit down with a PR consultant and look at other massive PR failures recently (try Black Milk clothing, you dirty apes) and cast a weather eye over the recent immature behaviour on the forums. Yes, a lot of people QQ and say inane bullcrap and don't provide feedback. But responding by locking 40 threads shows you've lost the PR battle, and sends a very sure message to your customers: that you really don't appreciate their business at all.

Thanks CCP. Your product is faulty, you need to fix your product, not try to make your customers less a bunch of solipsistic whiny aspergers victims.
Rroff
Antagonistic Tendencies
#28 - 2014-09-02 01:00:05 UTC
Since the patch we've only had 2 rubbish ore sites, no combat anoms that I've noticed (if so they got despawned) and the odd so so gas site and infact not a lot of anything - unusual but its not been long enough to know if theres a change in the trend.
Trinkets friend
Sudden Buggery
Sending Thots And Players
#29 - 2014-09-02 15:06:53 UTC
There is two ways to look at this, given information leaked by CCP Gheyscale.

There is either a mechanism by which a signature is caused to spawn within a given wormhole system.

This mechanism works either on a system whereby the result of that spawn chance is, to whit;
a) a static
b) a transient wormhole
c) a frigate wormhole (nelwy addedin Hyperion)
d) a relic site
e) a data site
f) an ore site
g) a combat site

The chance is either as a percentage of a whole number (ie; percentage chances must add up to 10%) or an abitrary number (percentages can add up to +/- 100%).

So. An event happens and the system makes a call (C) on a table (A) whereby the result (R) is determned either as a percentage of a chance. In other words, a chance out of 100, or a chance out of X where X is arbitrary.

1) Of a probability pool of 100%
a) Wormhole statics have remained the same percentage
b) transient wormholes have been increased a percentage
c) frigate wormholes have been added as a percentage
d) radars remained the same percentage
e) data site remained the same percentage
f) ore sites remained the same percentage
g) combat anomaly remained the same percentage

2) of a probability pool of X (where X is an arbitrary number)
a) Wormhole statics have remained the same percentage of X
b) transient wormholes have been increased a percentage of X (ie; X + A)
c) frigate wormholes have been added as a percentage (ie; + B)
d) radars remained the same
e) data site remained the same
f) ore sites remained the same
g) combat anoma remained the same

Thereore, depending on the probability chances of a frigate or transient wormhole (which have been increased in hyperion by Fozzie) versus the pool of chances (100 *or* X);

Any increase in frigate wormholes from zero naturally results in a decrease in the probabilities of spawning any other result (as a proportion of 100 or X)

Any increase in the chances of spawning a transient wormhole also reduces the probabilities of spawning any other result (as a proportion of Xor 100%)

Therefore, should we really be surprised that a ham-fisted attempt at creating more content in wormholes by rejiggering the spawn percentage chanes of an anomaly vs wormhole vs transient vs frig wormhole, blah blah blagh, will result in LESS ANOMALIES SPAWNING?

No.

OMG you guys have no idea how hard this was to type legibly after ten scotcch whiskeys. ZOMG. Srs problums.
Levina Windstar
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#30 - 2014-09-02 15:26:42 UTC
Trinkets friend wrote:

OMG you guys have no idea how hard this was to type legibly after ten scotcch whiskeys. ZOMG. Srs problums.



Kudos for you my friend Smile

Back on topic, we had 2 or 3 combat site in our C4 since the patch and no data/relic (but these were already pretty rare before the patch anyway...)

"I can make billions using my mouth ...

... and sometimes when I talk, too" --- Solecist Project

chris elliot
Wildcard.
Boundary Experts
#31 - 2014-09-02 20:36:36 UTC
corbexx wrote:
Maduin Shi wrote:
corbexx wrote:


aye agree.

although after a patch (espeically the first wh patch in 3 years) stuff should be up even if its just due to people trying **** out. so if its down early on that could be a issue, although the oposite is true and it coudl be people need a month to figure it out.

need to wait for numbers. although my worry is by the time we get them **** will already be in a really bad stage.


It could be symptomatic of a big drop in WH groups farming their static connections, since its now a lot harder to secure an inactive static. "Parking lot" wormhole systems may be becoming a bigger problem.


aye but this is still bad. People need to make isk and they are still in space so targets which provide content.



From the sound of things lately mate the only things people are doing in space by and large is ship spinning and waiting.
Trinkets friend
Sudden Buggery
Sending Thots And Players
#32 - 2014-09-03 03:00:06 UTC
Ugh. Such hangover. Mouth taste like dirty sock. Yarf.
Maduin Shi
MAGA Inc
#33 - 2014-09-03 05:22:30 UTC  |  Edited by: Maduin Shi
Trinkets friend wrote:
There is two ways to look at this, given information leaked by CCP Gheyscale.

**math stuff**



I may stand corrected then. We'll probably never get a dev in here to confirm this, but it explains the lack of site spawns and it explains why HK wasn't able to spawn more sites in their home system by warping to sites in their own constellation.

However, I find it hard to believe that the probabilities of combat/data/relic/gas/ore site spawns weren't adjusted upward to compensate for the increased spawn probability of random wormholes and the addition of frigate wormholes to the spawn table. Or that the table itself isn't simply called more often to obtain the same pre-patch site spawn rate.
Maduin Shi
MAGA Inc
#34 - 2014-09-03 05:31:31 UTC
Incidentally, I've had all of one gas and one data/relic site spawn in my C2 since the patch, so something definitely isn't right if there's so many folks with dry wormholes....
Pavel Sohaj
BAND of MAGNUS
Hole Control
#35 - 2014-09-03 05:58:15 UTC
corbexx wrote:
Maduin Shi wrote:
corbexx wrote:


aye agree.

although after a patch (espeically the first wh patch in 3 years) stuff should be up even if its just due to people trying **** out. so if its down early on that could be a issue, although the oposite is true and it coudl be people need a month to figure it out.

need to wait for numbers. although my worry is by the time we get them **** will already be in a really bad stage.


It could be symptomatic of a big drop in WH groups farming their static connections, since its now a lot harder to secure an inactive static. "Parking lot" wormhole systems may be becoming a bigger problem.


aye but this is still bad. People need to make isk and they are still in space so targets which provide content.


Right. Content.
We wanted to at least MINE some friggin ore yesterday. Five wormholes, but of all kinds which is amusingly fun. C1, C3, C5, 2 frig ones. And to that four miners. So we logged. People aint figuring out anything, its still the same, only what changed is that its nigh impossible to farm with six to twelve exits open in just your home and static WHs. SO the sites stay there.

I wonder whos in space to provide targets, I spent three hours ship spinning under POS and logged off :D guess thats CCPs main aim.
Honestly corbexx, do they not care at all ? THere is no incentive to play the game really so all there is to it is account expiration and throwing cash at smth else, maybe some cosmetic items at Dota 2. And judging by general response, ppl are happy that others are leaving even. Not bad.
chris elliot
Wildcard.
Boundary Experts
#36 - 2014-09-03 15:01:21 UTC  |  Edited by: chris elliot
Pavel Sohaj wrote:

Honestly corbexx, do they not care at all ?



People have already answered this, the answer is, no they don't.


Pavel Sohaj wrote:

THere is no incentive to play the game really so all there is to it is account expiration and throwing cash at smth else, maybe some cosmetic items at Dota 2.


Carefull, or they will censor you for suggesting such blasphemy as actually going and playing something else.
Terrorfrodo
Interbus Universal
#37 - 2014-09-03 15:19:19 UTC
Trinkets friend wrote:
There is two ways to look at this, given information leaked by CCP Gheyscale.

~interesting stuff~

Is that solid knowledge or more like conjecture?

If that is fact and the numbers were not adjusted to keep site spawns like before the changes, that would seem incredibly... odd. It's hard to imagine that something obvious like that could be an oversight.

From my own scanning, I can say that I see plenty of sites, but since most of the systems are inactive, they may just have been there a long time.

.

Rroff
Antagonistic Tendencies
#38 - 2014-09-03 21:26:27 UTC  |  Edited by: Rroff
6 sigs today, 5 of them wormholes the other the common ore site still hanging about, doesn't look like most of the systems in the chain(s) have much in the way of sites (other than gas/ore) either but plenty of wormholes :S
corbexx
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#39 - 2014-09-03 22:38:54 UTC
chris elliot wrote:
corbexx wrote:
Maduin Shi wrote:
corbexx wrote:


aye agree.

although after a patch (espeically the first wh patch in 3 years) stuff should be up even if its just due to people trying **** out. so if its down early on that could be a issue, although the oposite is true and it coudl be people need a month to figure it out.

need to wait for numbers. although my worry is by the time we get them **** will already be in a really bad stage.


It could be symptomatic of a big drop in WH groups farming their static connections, since its now a lot harder to secure an inactive static. "Parking lot" wormhole systems may be becoming a bigger problem.


aye but this is still bad. People need to make isk and they are still in space so targets which provide content.



From the sound of things lately mate the only things people are doing in space by and large is ship spinning and waiting.


sad thing is I think you could be very right.

we've connected to a few big groups and they havent had the numbers to fight us, so we have literally farmed there sites.
corbexx
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#40 - 2014-09-03 22:42:11 UTC
Pavel Sohaj wrote:

Honestly corbexx, do they not care at all ? THere is no incentive to play the game really so all there is to it is account expiration and throwing cash at smth else, maybe some cosmetic items at Dota 2. And judging by general response, ppl are happy that others are leaving even. Not bad.


They care, the issue is they think this is for the best. I disagree and so do most people on the forums. But I don't think they are willing to change it till the numbers show how god aweful this is, At which point I just hope to bob its not to late.