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So what ship should I fly for my Amarr missions?
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Tusen Takk
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#1 - 2011-12-08 21:50:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Tusen Takk
i had this all typed out and ready to go, then the ******* board wiped everything. let's try this again

i'm looking to fly a cheaper ship than i fly now, but one that is as convinient. and no, i will not fly a tengu.

here is what im flying now
Quote:
[Legion, Den Gylne Øks]

Legion Electronics - Tactical Targeting Network
Legion Defensive - Nanobot Injector
Legion Propulsion - Fuel Catalyst
Legion Offensive - Liquid Crystal Magnifiers
Legion Engineering - Capacitor Regeneration Matrix

Heavy Pulse Laser II, Conflagration M
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Conflagration M
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Conflagration M
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Conflagration M
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Conflagration M

Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II
Shadow Serpentis Tracking Computer
Republic Fleet 10MN Afterburner

Imperial Navy Armor EM Hardener
Imperial Navy Armor Thermic Hardener
Imperial Navy Heat Sink
Imperial Navy Heat Sink
Imperial Navy Heat Sink
Medium Armor Repairer II
Corpum A-Type Medium Armor Repairer

Medium Auxiliary Nano Pump II
Medium Auxiliary Nano Pump I
Medium Capacitor Control Circuit II


672dps, 652dps/s tank. so i can pretty much walk into an L4, tank full room aggro, and finish it in about 10-15 minutes. plus it's omnitank so i dont have to change mods based on the missione.however it comes at a price; to the tune of about 2bn isk, which is nice and all but i need some isk SO i was looking into Apoc Navy Issues, and found this:
Quote:
[Apocalypse Navy Issue, Apocalypse Navy Issue: Lvl 4 Imperial RipperRoo]

Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L

Tracking Computer II
Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II

Armor EM Hardener II
Armor EM Hardener II
Armor Thermic Hardener II
Armor Thermic Hardener II
Imperial Navy Heat Sink
Imperial Navy Heat Sink
Imperial Navy Heat Sink
Imperial Navy Large Armor Repairer

Large Auxiliary Nano Pump I
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I

Hammerhead II x5
776dps with scorch and drones, 1023dps with conflag and drones. cool right? plus it'd cost about 700mil isk to fit, whihc is pretty groovy. there are a few cons to it for me though:

-it's slow as molasses
-it has worse tracking than my Legion
-i would actually have to pay attention to what groups i'm shooting at instead of reading cracked articles while shooting things
-it only can tank 202.5dps/s. lame

so, is it worth it even through all those problems i have with it? will it make me more money than i am now without me having to worry about it going kablooey? im interested to know and i havent flown BSs in a very long time so i thought before i sell my baby, i would check out the public opinion :D
Alara IonStorm
#2 - 2011-12-08 21:59:36 UTC
Tusen Takk wrote:

-it only can tank 202.5dps/s. lame

It tanks 202.5 Omni DPS. The NPC's your fit is for do EM / Therm.

Your fit tanks 783 EM DPS and 603 Therm DPS. You can pretty much sit AFK in that thing since 23min is practically stable.
Tusen Takk
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#3 - 2011-12-08 22:29:51 UTC
Alara IonStorm wrote:
Tusen Takk wrote:

-it only can tank 202.5dps/s. lame

It tanks 202.5 Omni DPS. The NPC's your fit is for do EM / Therm.

Your fit tanks 783 EM DPS and 603 Therm DPS. You can pretty much sit AFK in that thing since 23min is practically stable.

welp in that case i think imma fit one up when i get home then.
Ziester
State War Academy
Caldari State
#4 - 2011-12-09 02:59:51 UTC
Why don't you get that Navypoc fit onto a Paladin and slap some Tractor beams in highs ?
Dunno about the costs tbh but if you can afford faction modules, you could prolly afford a Paladin.
40km beams would counter balance the slugginess.
You don't really need tracking, just focus frigs first *pop* *pop* *pop* *pop* *pop*. IOf they ever get close, whip out the drones and let them loose.

And I'm surprised a Navypoc can only tank 202ish dmg against amarr with those 2x EM+Thermal hardeners. You sure you got that right ?

Pop, rock, Metal radio station
Tusen Takk
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#5 - 2011-12-09 03:05:09 UTC
Ziester wrote:
Why don't you get that Navypoc fit onto a Paladin and slap some Tractor beams in highs ?
Dunno about the costs tbh but if you can afford faction modules, you could prolly afford a Paladin.
40km beams would counter balance the slugginess.
You don't really need tracking, just focus frigs first *pop* *pop* *pop* *pop* *pop*. IOf they ever get close, whip out the drones and let them loose.

And I'm surprised a Navypoc can only tank 202ish dmg against amarr with those 2x EM+Thermal hardeners. You sure you got that right ?

Alara IonStorm wrote:

It tanks 202.5 Omni DPS. The NPC's your fit is for do EM / Therm.

Your fit tanks 783 EM DPS and 603 Therm DPS. You can pretty much sit AFK in that thing since 23min is practically stable.

also a paladin is too far away atm, i may consider it further down the road
Goose99
#6 - 2011-12-09 03:18:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Goose99
[Armageddon Navy Issue, New Setup 2]
Imperial Navy Heat Sink
Imperial Navy Heat Sink
Imperial Navy Heat Sink
Imperial Navy Heat Sink
Armor EM Hardener II
Armor Thermic Hardener II
Imperial Navy Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane
Imperial Navy Large Armor Repairer

Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range
Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range
Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range
Heavy Capacitor Booster II, Cap Booster 800

Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L
[empty high slot]

Large Capacitor Control Circuit I
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I


Garde II x5
Hammerhead II x5

1069 dps with Scorch, 83 km, 1265 dps with imp multi, 40 km.

Nothing better until NM. Paladin has severe grid problems.
Ziester
State War Academy
Caldari State
#7 - 2011-12-09 13:18:01 UTC  |  Edited by: Ziester
Goose99 wrote:
[Armageddon Navy Issue, New Setup 2]
Imperial Navy Heat Sink
Imperial Navy Heat Sink
Imperial Navy Heat Sink
Imperial Navy Heat Sink
Armor EM Hardener II
Armor Thermic Hardener II
Imperial Navy Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane
Imperial Navy Large Armor Repairer

Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range
Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range
Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range
Heavy Capacitor Booster II, Cap Booster 25

Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L
[empty high slot]

Large Capacitor Control Circuit I
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I


Garde II x5
Hammerhead II x5

1069 dps with Scorch, 83 km, 1265 dps with imp multi, 40 km.

Nothing better until NM. Paladin has severe grid problems.

Which is counter-balanced by using 4 guns instead of 7 ?
Besides :
Cap Booster in mission ? No. Missions are meant to make money, not spend it.
4 HS is useless as in the 4th one doesn't get you anything big enough to justify its use. Either get a Tracking enchancer or Cap Power Relay.

Pop, rock, Metal radio station
Ziester
State War Academy
Caldari State
#8 - 2011-12-09 13:29:11 UTC
Quote:
[Paladin, Paladin fit]

Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L
Small Tractor Beam I
Small Tractor Beam I
Salvager I

100MN Afterburner II
Cap Recharger II
Federation Navy Stasis Webifier
Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range

Imperial Navy Large Armor Repairer
Armor EM Hardener II
Armor EM Hardener II
Armor Thermic Hardener II
Armor Thermic Hardener II
Imperial Navy Heat Sink
Imperial Navy Heat Sink

Large Capacitor Control Circuit II
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I


Hammerhead II x5

Tanks 581 amarr dps for over 5 minutes (you don't need more)
836 DPS w/ Scorch
1107 w/ Conflag
All that with plenty of room left in CPU/Grid

Pop, rock, Metal radio station
Tusen Takk
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#9 - 2011-12-09 20:19:41 UTC
yeah that fit is absolute bollocks.
Captain Nares
O3 Corporation
#10 - 2011-12-09 20:21:19 UTC
Nightmare.
Zyella Stormborn
Green Seekers
#11 - 2011-12-09 20:34:10 UTC
To be honest, your Legion should almost never be at risk (unless your hitting missions in low sec or doing WH's). I find my legion tends to do everything faster all around than my BS / Maurauder, once I factor in travel, etc.

If you are just looking for something different, well I understand completely. But if you are looking for something that will be comparable in performance? You are probably looking at not a hell of a lot cheaper price in the new toy.

Navy Apoc
Paladin
Nightmare

All of them if well fitted will usually run you over 1b.

Just something to think about. ;)

There is a special Hell for people like that, Right next to child molestors, and people that talk in the theater. ~Firefly
Barbie D0ll
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#12 - 2011-12-09 20:38:27 UTC
legion + NPC TD = dead legion
also fu forum for eating my post
Tarunik Raqalth'Qui
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#13 - 2011-12-09 20:59:29 UTC
Ziester wrote:
Goose99 wrote:
[Armageddon Navy Issue, New Setup 2]
Imperial Navy Heat Sink
Imperial Navy Heat Sink
Imperial Navy Heat Sink
Imperial Navy Heat Sink
Armor EM Hardener II
Armor Thermic Hardener II
Imperial Navy Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane
Imperial Navy Large Armor Repairer

Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range
Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range
Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range
Heavy Capacitor Booster II, Cap Booster 25

Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L
[empty high slot]

Large Capacitor Control Circuit I
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I


Garde II x5
Hammerhead II x5

1069 dps with Scorch, 83 km, 1265 dps with imp multi, 40 km.

Nothing better until NM. Paladin has severe grid problems.

Which is counter-balanced by using 4 guns instead of 7 ?

To an extent. The Pally's grid issues really are only a big deal if you try to fit Tachyons on the thing...sticking to MegaPulse/MegaBeam is the way to go on anything but a NM.
Ziester wrote:

Besides :
Cap Booster in mission ? No. Missions are meant to make money, not spend it.

Cap charges (and I'm talking about 800s here) cost only ~3000 isk/unit (if that much) and take up 32m3, so you can fill a max skill Itty V (39192 m3) to the brim with 'em for 3.67 mil or so. Considering that's over 1,200 charges for less than 1 L4's worth of rats, cap boosted mission setups are just fine at making money.
Ziester wrote:

4 HS is useless as in the 4th one doesn't get you anything big enough to justify its use. Either get a Tracking enchancer or Cap Power Relay.

Actually, downgrade the 4th HS to a T2. The only useful bonus that a TE would give this ship's guns is tracking, and there's better ways to do that (such as switching the CCCs to SMCs, upping the size of the cap charges, and switching 1 cap rig for a T2 Locus Coordinator, this allows you to rescript a TC to Tracking Speed). A CPR is pointless on a capboosted setup anyway.
Pryvate Pile
Doomheim
#14 - 2011-12-09 21:08:31 UTC
The paladin has infinitely superior cap life to the nightmare and has more than enough grid for a faction/ds LAR with tachs. The only thing you'll struggle to fit with tachyons is a prop mod. The NM is a better ship in some cases, but the only issue with a paladin is people not knowing how to fit one.
Goose99
#15 - 2011-12-10 00:09:41 UTC
Pryvate Pile wrote:
The paladin has infinitely superior cap life to the nightmare and has more than enough grid for a faction/ds LAR with tachs. The only thing you'll struggle to fit with tachyons is a prop mod. The NM is a better ship in some cases, but the only issue with a paladin is people not knowing how to fit one.


Paladin: 5625 gj, 14.6 e/s
NM: 6950 gj, 14.4 e/s

NM has one more slot than Paladin, where, in theory, you can fit a cap mod (not that you would want to with cap booster fit), and one more rig slot for one more CCC.

Paladin with max skills runs out of grid after fitting 4 tachs, leaving no room for t2 LAR. After you fit meta4 LAR, there's no grid for cap booster. So you swap out 3 TCs for rechargers so that you don't cap out, and deal with the crap range.Lol
Kahldor
Doomheim
#16 - 2011-12-10 02:43:28 UTC
Goose99 wrote:
Pryvate Pile wrote:
The paladin has infinitely superior cap life to the nightmare and has more than enough grid for a faction/ds LAR with tachs. The only thing you'll struggle to fit with tachyons is a prop mod. The NM is a better ship in some cases, but the only issue with a paladin is people not knowing how to fit one.


Paladin: 5625 gj, 14.6 e/s
NM: 6950 gj, 14.4 e/s

NM has one more slot than Paladin, where, in theory, you can fit a cap mod (not that you would want to with cap booster fit), and one more rig slot for one more CCC.

Paladin with max skills runs out of grid after fitting 4 tachs, leaving no room for t2 LAR. After you fit meta4 LAR, there's no grid for cap booster. So you swap out 3 TCs for rechargers so that you don't cap out, and deal with the crap range.Lol


*Sigh* another one of these threads...ok here goes. This is my fit

Lows:
2 Armor Thermic II
1 Armor EM II
1 Corpus A-type large armor rep
3 Imperial Navy HS

Med:
2 Cap recharger II
2 tracking computer II w/ scripts

Highs:
4 Tachyon Beam II
2 Tractor Beam
1 Salvager

Rigs:
Large Nanobot accelerator I
Large Cap Control Circuit I

Implants:
PG8
AX-2
CC8
CX-2
Lancer G2-Epsilon

951 DPS/6545volley INMF 43+39 with range scripts
1043 DPS w/ hobgob II

Cap lasts 2:43 with my skills with everything running (which it never is)
Stable at 55% without the repper running

I have ran this fit since I got it and so far have never found a mission remotely challenging except for L4 sansha blockade. There is a spawn with 6 elite cruisers that tracking disrupt to the point where you can't hit anything and if you don't pop them before they get into range you will most likely have to warp out. Other than that mission you will one shot almost everything BC and below as fast as you can lock it.

As for the grid "issues" a PG8 takes care of that. Sure you won't be able to fit a AB/MWD on the fit above but switching to pulses leaves more than enough grid if you need to. From what you said above I have no idea why you would need a cap booster and I hardly call 43+39km "crap" range. Hell, even my 950 DPS pulse fit with 58+16km (scorch), a 100MN AB, and cap stable at 44% with everything but the repper running would hardly need what you suggest above.
Pryvate Pile
Doomheim
#17 - 2011-12-10 02:46:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Pryvate Pile
Goose99 wrote:

Paladin with max skills runs out of grid after fitting 4 tachs, leaving no room for t2 LAR. After you fit meta4 LAR, there's no grid for cap booster. So you swap out 3 TCs for rechargers so that you don't cap out, and deal with the crap range.Lol


What the **** are you babbling about? You do have EFT, yes?

[lows]
-Imperial Navy LAR
-Hardener II
-Hardener II
-Hardener II
-Imperial Navy Heatsink
-Imperial Navy Heatsink
-Imperial Navy Heatsink

[med]
-Tracking Comp II
-Tracking Comp II
-Cap Recharger II
-Cap Recharger II

[high]
-Tach II, IN-MF
-Tach II, IN-MF
-Tach II, IN-MF
-Tach II, IN-MF
-Salvager II
-Tractor II
-Tractor II

[rig]
CCC II
CCC II

Fits with ABSOLUTELY NO FITTING IMPLANTS, runs every single module for over 5mins (turn off the salvager/tractors and 1 gun and you are cap stable for infinite o-**** repping). INMF Optimal + Falloff hits 84km (915 turret dps) with optimal scripts in the TCs.

Show me the nightmare fit that is this cheap and efficient without using cap boosters and 10x the bling and i'll **** a brick.

This ship does not need a damn cap booster newb.
Ayianapa
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#18 - 2011-12-10 10:32:34 UTC
Not using cap boosters in pve has almost become a meme, do people think they cost 5 million per charge or something? you don't perma run them, just use them for heavy rep use which is not every mission.

[Cost effective Nightmare yes with bank breaking omg too expensive cap booster, Nightmare fit]

Tachyon Beam Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Tachyon Beam Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Tachyon Beam Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Tachyon Beam Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Auto Targeting System II
Drone Link Augmentor I

Photon Scattering Field II
Heat Dissipation Field II
Invulnerability Field II
Caldari Navy X-Large Shield Booster
Heavy Capacitor Booster II
Tracking Computer II
Tracking Computer II

Imperial Navy Heat Sink
Imperial Navy Heat Sink
Imperial Navy Heat Sink
Imperial Navy Heat Sink
Tracking Enhancer II

Large Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I
Large Energy Discharge Elutriation I
Large Semiconductor Memory Cell I