Warfare & Tactics

I have the fall of Ladister and the celebration that followed recorded :)

I don't think the pendulum should swing on the nuts of AFK plex farmers, but at the same time, there has to be some value to a player willing to fight for a side on a down swing.

A good part of this Gallente Victory is the also Caldari's inability to work together between corps and alliances. I was there in the meeting when the plan was laid out on which system would get hit in what order, the Gallente FCs and CEOs having full knowledge that none of the groups would move in to help one another hold their space, and would patiently wait their turn for the whole of the Gallente militia to come to them.

In a sense, I'm a bit sad at this victory. I saw flashes of brilliance from the Caldari side during the Okkamon campaign, with large Caldari fleets and several groups working together. There was one night in particular where you guys really brought it, and there were a lot of frustrated words on Gal Mil comms. Had you guys been able to keep it up, the Gallente might never have taken that system, but you didn't, and they did.


I also think there's a marked difference of attitude between the two sides.....

We had to start over from scratch, and what happened was that the following day, ....

That's the real difference I see between the militias. When the Gallente get a bad turn, they seem to rally together tighter than before, and try harder.....

The Caldari could learn something from that, but it won't be easy.....

In closing, while I will happily look at ways to incentivise a losing side to keep fighting (and take suggestions) to bring these ideas to CCP's attention, I also think the Caldari have some work to do on their own house. Any changes that could be made that would affect all sides equally at this point still won't save you guys from yourselves, and your inability/unwillingness to work together

http://baby-recipes.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/01/downs+baby.jpg

Congratulations are in order for the Gallente Militia. This is the second time I've seen the warzone get swept like this. Last time worked much the same, except without the Caldari throwing in the towel. As I recall, Gal Mil only held the whole zone for a day last time as Ev0ke landed up in the northwest and began their march to Eha where they were eventually stopped.

That said, this is looking like the beginning of a long painful drought for the Caldari Militia. Some people have brought up to me, and I would agree, that the current system is a bit too punishing for the side getting the screws put to it. It's something I'll bring up with CCP, though I'm not 100% on a solution yet. What is clear is that there is no incentive to join a side losing as bad as the Caldari are right now. That is bad for player retention on their end, and also for bringing in fresh blood. Only a true Caldari loyalist (Read: RPer), gluttons for punishment, and those too stubborn to back down would see much value in joining or staying with Cal Mil at this point. That is unhealthy not only for the Caldari's ability to remain competitive, but also for the Gallente that rely on decent Caldari numbers for content.

I don't think the pendulum should swing on the nuts of AFK plex farmers, but at the same time, there has to be some value to a player willing to fight for a side on a down swing.

A good part of this Gallente Victory is the also Caldari's inability to work together between corps and alliances. I was there in the meeting when the plan was laid out on which system would get hit in what order, the Gallente FCs and CEOs having full knowledge that none of the groups would move in to help one another hold their space, and would patiently wait their turn for the whole of the Gallente militia to come to them.

In a sense, I'm a bit sad at this victory. I saw flashes of brilliance from the Caldari side during the Okkamon campaign, with large Caldari fleets and several groups working together. There was one night in particular where you guys really brought it, and there were a lot of frustrated words on Gal Mil comms. Had you guys been able to keep it up, the Gallente might never have taken that system, but you didn't, and they did.

I also think there's a marked difference of attitude between the two sides. I remember a few months ago spending 12 hours attacking Enaluri and finally getting it to 28% that first day after losing hundreds of ships. I wanted to put a fist through my monitor that night when the node crashed from something that was happening several systems away, and we logged back in to find the system back down to 0%. We petitioned it of course, but the response was that the tools didn't exist to fix the percentage bar back to where it had been.

We had to start over from scratch, and what happened was that the following day, Gallente numbers swelled as people who had not participated in the offensive at that point, and hadn't really cared, rallied around the FCs and people who'd wasted their time and ISK the previous day, because "**** that ****".

That's the real difference I see between the militias. When the Gallente get a bad turn, they seem to rally together tighter than before, and try harder. If someone's home system comes under attack it's basically a guarantee that almost every major corp and alliance will be there to help in the defense. Help is asked for, and it's given without a second thought because each of us knows that those guys will be there for us when it's our turn to get **** on.

The Caldari could learn something from that, but it won't be easy. The Gallente core groups have the advantage that comes with flying together for years at this point, while the Caldari have gone through a lot of turnover in that time. If you were to look at the Gallente corps and alliances that bashed the final iHub in January of 2013, a lot of the same flags were flying in August of 2014. On the Caldari side, I don't think more than Templis and the Russians around OMS still remain from the 2013 Campaign.

In closing, while I will happily look at ways to incentivise a losing side to keep fighting (and take suggestions) to bring these ideas to CCP's attention, I also think the Caldari have some work to do on their own house. Any changes that could be made that would affect all sides equally at this point still won't save you guys from yourselves, and your inability/unwillingness to work together

Ok, why do you to have to go and be so magnanimous as to explicitly point out what calmil did wrong? It's not rocket science. But, I chose not to state it so blatantly. Give them a chance to realize it on their own, ffs.

Concerning how to fix the current fw mechanics, please read my posts for some suggestions as to how CCP can build in support for a militia on the down side. The current feedback loop for farmers to support the winning side (even though that is not the major reason for victory as Cearain seems to think) making it easier for sweeps to occur has got to be changed. LP should not be uniform across the warzone. Dplex lp should be much less in occupied systems, for one thing.


Anyway, here's hoping you and the CSM can help CCP keep making fw better.

You seem to assume rabbit plexing favors the losing side. It doesn't. It simply favors those who want to avoid pvp. Gallente have put rabbit plexing to the best use ever. That is a huge reason gallente won.

...

When you talk about caldari militia who do you mean exactly? Do you mean the 5,299 characters reported in the caldari militia? The overwhelming majority of those players are alts and have no interest in any sort of pvp defense. The same is true of the 6,145 gallente characters and all the other militias. The game strongly favors alts so that is what our ranks are full of.

Now we just need a well done XG and the congrats will be complete from Caldari

you contradicted yourself here. in the first part of your post you said gallente won because we had too many plexing alts. Later in your post you said caldari lost because they had too many plexing alts.

What he said.