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Why the push to force people to work together?

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Ramona McCandless
Silent Vale
LinkNet
#81 - 2014-08-27 12:25:36 UTC
Angeal MacNova wrote:
EVE is pay to win after all.


I understand these words individually, but in this order they make no sense

"Yea, some dude came in and was normal for first couple months, so I gave him director." - Sean Dunaway

"A singular character could be hired to penetrate another corps space... using gorilla like tactics..." - Chane Morgann
Velicitia
XS Tech
#82 - 2014-08-27 12:29:55 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:


Like, whipping the crew to make them work faster?

I imagine that's what "Overheat" is for Amarr ships.


Yeah, fine, that ... Roll


I mean stuff like "replace the DCU II with the M4, and you'll get just enough CPU freed up to fit [this other module] that gives enough resists to offset the loss from the DCU, and you still end up higher than with the DCU II"

One of the bitter points of a good bittervet is the realisation that all those SP don't really do much, and that the newbie is having much more fun with what little he has. - Tippia
Ralph King-Griffin
New Eden Tech Support
#83 - 2014-08-27 12:31:58 UTC
Angeal MacNova wrote:
Just read the OP and skipped to the end.

Two things,

1. Never tried them yet but from what I hear, it sounds like the risk doesn't properly match the reward with these missions. In other words, they're not worth doing.

2. You hit the nail on the head with alts. These will encourage the use of alt accounts. EVE is pay to win after all.


1) then don't whine about them

2)no he didn't. Ye all don't spend time in assault frigates!? Shouldn't need alts for this.
Explain yourself.

Murderers of Negotiable Motivations

=]|[=
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#84 - 2014-08-27 12:36:20 UTC
Velicitia wrote:
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:


Like, whipping the crew to make them work faster?

I imagine that's what "Overheat" is for Amarr ships.


Yeah, fine, that ... Roll


I mean stuff like "replace the DCU II with the M4, and you'll get just enough CPU freed up to fit [this other module] that gives enough resists to offset the loss from the DCU, and you still end up higher than with the DCU II"


Oh, *fitting* advice. Yeah, I'm not really all that good at that, most of my fits are stolen, or unorthodox in the bad way, like armor tanked Worms.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
l0rd carlos
the king asked me to guard the mountain
#85 - 2014-08-27 12:38:23 UTC
If you fly the burner mission with 2 Pilots, the payout is cut in half, but the fly time probably is not. I think that is balanced.

Or OP could give us some better examples.

Youtube Channel about Micro and Small scale PvP with commentary: Fleet Commentary by l0rd carlos
Grog Aftermath
Doomheim
#86 - 2014-08-27 12:38:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Grog Aftermath
Ramona McCandless wrote:
Angeal MacNova wrote:
EVE is pay to win after all.


I understand these words individually, but in this order they make no sense




I'd say

PLEX is a form of pay-to-win, makes it easy to buy ships/skill books/implants although somewhat limited by what skills your character has trained.

Buying ready made characters via the bazaar is a form of pay-to-win.

Multiple accounts is also a form of pay-to-win, for obvious reasons, even CCP acknowledges this with their power of two adverts.



They're the only ones I can think of though.
Xuixien
Solar Winds Security Solutions
#87 - 2014-08-27 12:39:28 UTC
Angeal MacNova wrote:

2. You hit the nail on the head with alts. These will encourage the use of alt accounts. EVE is pay to win after all.


Or y'know you can just make friends.

Epic Space Cat, Horsegirl, Philanthropist
Zen Dad
Solitary Sad Bastard In Space
#88 - 2014-08-27 12:43:48 UTC
metalravenous wrote:

CCP stop trying to tell me I have to play with other people to have fun.


You're not wrong and you can see from my Corp that I'm with you.

BUT after posting in the same vein in the past I've come to realise 'we' can adapt.

I solo pvp succesfuly and explore solo ( especially now the loot spew = teamwork fiasco is over) , but when my iSK gets low I PVE with some great guys.

Running a 5/10 solo in a busy pipe is too hard for me, so I choose to do it with friends for security, speed and a goodly iSK share.

I don't need CCP to make the 5/10s easier , I just adapt my game and I'm pretty sure you will too.

Believe me, I'm with you, but being under pressure to play solo would be a worse option.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#89 - 2014-08-27 12:47:18 UTC
metalravenous wrote:


Now you are just being wordy for the sake of being wordy and trying to complicate something simple.

At worse case minority or people don't want all of these PVP corp or alliance interactions. You don't think these people deserve to have their views respected?


No.

They chose to play a game in which near all of the content involves other people. If they don't want that then there are a number of other games out there more suited to them.
Jenn aSide
Worthless Carebears
The Initiative.
#90 - 2014-08-27 12:51:26 UTC
metalravenous wrote:
Why is CCP so Hell bent on making people work together, be it missions, incursions, SOV etc in this game?

You can play EVE with minimal risk and interaction by avoiding any sort of PVP and being smart about things. It just makes sense if you want to get the job done right that you do it yourself. People already have multiple accounts in order to avoid having to deal with corp thieves and griefers or even having to rely on others to light cynos for you.

Personally I think the majority of the player base would prefer just to do their own thing. Burner missions are being used to force feed interactions that no one really wants to have and are just forcing people to get more accounts (tools for the job) and in turn making people use their hard earned isk to buy more expensive PLEX.

CCP stop trying to tell me I have to play with other people to have fun.


I've beaten every burner mission I've been offers so far with 1 account. Daredevil ftw.

This is nothing more than the imaginary "CCP why you try make me go null sec" BS in new clothes. No one is trying to make you do anything, in fact CCP went out of their way to make these new Burner missions 100% optional. you can decline them with no loss.

It is not CCPs fault, however, that you chose to play their game, a game that is an MMO and thus offers benefits to people who group up. As you are in a null sec corporation you should understand this.
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#91 - 2014-08-27 12:52:44 UTC
Well, Jenn is here so I'll tag out, and get some rest.

Good luck to the rest of you sorry bastards.

Daredevil ftw, also.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
Jenn aSide
Worthless Carebears
The Initiative.
#92 - 2014-08-27 12:53:48 UTC
metalravenous wrote:
That is poor customer service.
\

No...that's autism.
Ramona McCandless
Silent Vale
LinkNet
#93 - 2014-08-27 12:58:43 UTC
Grog Aftermath wrote:
Ramona McCandless wrote:
Angeal MacNova wrote:
EVE is pay to win after all.


I understand these words individually, but in this order they make no sense




I'd say

PLEX is a form of pay-to-win, makes it easy to buy ships/skill books/implants although somewhat limited by what skills your character has trained.

Buying ready made characters via the bazaar is a form of pay-to-win.

Multiple accounts is also a form of pay-to-win, for obvious reasons, even CCP acknowledges this with their power of two adverts.



They're the only ones I can think of though.



Im still having difficulty with this "win" concept you are talking about

"Yea, some dude came in and was normal for first couple months, so I gave him director." - Sean Dunaway

"A singular character could be hired to penetrate another corps space... using gorilla like tactics..." - Chane Morgann
Seven Koskanaiken
Shadow Legions.
SONS of BANE
#94 - 2014-08-27 13:08:13 UTC  |  Edited by: Seven Koskanaiken
Xuixien wrote:
Angeal MacNova wrote:

2. You hit the nail on the head with alts. These will encourage the use of alt accounts. EVE is pay to win after all.


Or y'know you can just make friends.


Alts > real people in almost all PVE apart from incursions.

With real people the rewards are halved. With alts you get all rewards after the alt pays for itself. (In fact the alt is accruing value that can be sold on the bazaar later).

With real people you have to wait on gate for 45 minutes for them to sort their **** out. Alts come when you want. Even in other MMO I can teleport to the nearest waypoint instead of taking 15 gates.

Even with the loot spew which was intended to be hard to do with alts CCP screwed up as your friend sat their twiddling his thumbs while you finished the hacking.

EVE is literally the worst MMO in the world for group PVE.
Grog Aftermath
Doomheim
#95 - 2014-08-27 13:10:25 UTC
Ramona McCandless wrote:
Grog Aftermath wrote:
Ramona McCandless wrote:
Angeal MacNova wrote:
EVE is pay to win after all.


I understand these words individually, but in this order they make no sense




I'd say

PLEX is a form of pay-to-win, makes it easy to buy ships/skill books/implants although somewhat limited by what skills your character has trained.

Buying ready made characters via the bazaar is a form of pay-to-win.

Multiple accounts is also a form of pay-to-win, for obvious reasons, even CCP acknowledges this with their power of two adverts.



They're the only ones I can think of though.



Im still having difficulty with this "win" concept you are talking about




Don't see why that should be.

We don't have gold ammo, but even if we did it wouldn't mean someone using gold ammo would automatically win a fight.

Those I listed previously are ways that give in-game advantages by using external funds.

The only way to win an MMO is to fulfil your own personal goals.
Xuixien
Solar Winds Security Solutions
#96 - 2014-08-27 13:10:58 UTC
Seven Koskanaiken wrote:
Xuixien wrote:
Angeal MacNova wrote:

2. You hit the nail on the head with alts. These will encourage the use of alt accounts. EVE is pay to win after all.


Or y'know you can just make friends.


Alts > real people in almost all PVE apart from incursions.

With real people the rewards are halved. With alts you get all rewards after the alt pays for itself. (In fact the alt is accruing value that can be sol on the bazaar later).


If you PLEX your accounts, then the reward is halved as well.

Epic Space Cat, Horsegirl, Philanthropist
Ramona McCandless
Silent Vale
LinkNet
#97 - 2014-08-27 13:13:06 UTC  |  Edited by: Ramona McCandless
Grog Aftermath wrote:

The only way to win an MMO is to fulfil your own personal goals.


Every time I do, I grow another.

Therefore, I cannot "win" at EvE.

But as you put "win" in inverted commas, I see we actually agree there is no win, and so this is an argument in semantics now, which I am happy to stop if you are.

"Yea, some dude came in and was normal for first couple months, so I gave him director." - Sean Dunaway

"A singular character could be hired to penetrate another corps space... using gorilla like tactics..." - Chane Morgann
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#98 - 2014-08-27 13:17:12 UTC
Grog Aftermath wrote:
Ramona McCandless wrote:
Angeal MacNova wrote:
EVE is pay to win after all.


I understand these words individually, but in this order they make no sense




I'd say

PLEX is a form of pay-to-win, makes it easy to buy ships/skill books/implants although somewhat limited by what skills your character has trained.

Buying ready made characters via the bazaar is a form of pay-to-win.

Multiple accounts is also a form of pay-to-win, for obvious reasons, even CCP acknowledges this with their power of two adverts.



They're the only ones I can think of though.


And they then get their bling raven killed by a t1 cruiser and podded..
Django Askulf
Black Rebel Death Squad
#99 - 2014-08-27 13:20:16 UTC  |  Edited by: Django Askulf
Everyday I get out of bed, I play an MMO, known as life. Somehow I can make it through my days fine, without ever having to see another persons face, or listen to their mindless babble, and stupidity.

Could do without it in a game, but there are things like income, and power creep, that CCP also considers. Dont be fooled into thinking its all about the people.
Seven Koskanaiken
Shadow Legions.
SONS of BANE
#100 - 2014-08-27 13:20:20 UTC  |  Edited by: Seven Koskanaiken
Xuixien wrote:
Seven Koskanaiken wrote:
Xuixien wrote:
Angeal MacNova wrote:

2. You hit the nail on the head with alts. These will encourage the use of alt accounts. EVE is pay to win after all.


Or y'know you can just make friends.


Alts > real people in almost all PVE apart from incursions.

With real people the rewards are halved. With alts you get all rewards after the alt pays for itself. (In fact the alt is accruing value that can be sol on the bazaar later).


If you PLEX your accounts, then the reward is halved as well.


Only if you make < 2 PLEX a month, which you really shouldn't be. One decent DED site a month make it worthwhile.

If the alt is trained in AFKtar it can pay for itself while you pvp.

If you really enjoy real people rather than alts in PVE you should be hassling CCP to pull their finger out and do it right, because they aren't right now.