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Gambling is apparently illegal in Iceland

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Adrie Atticus
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#21 - 2014-08-27 09:26:52 UTC
CCP itself cannot create a casino system where users can use real money only to win real money only as long as they're an Icelandic company. InterStellar Kredits are defined in EULA/ToS to have no monetary value and the sections you linked cannot be applied.
Ramona McCandless
Silent Vale
LinkNet
#22 - 2014-08-27 09:33:00 UTC
New Eden is set in Iceland?

Wat

"Yea, some dude came in and was normal for first couple months, so I gave him director." - Sean Dunaway

"A singular character could be hired to penetrate another corps space... using gorilla like tactics..." - Chane Morgann
Jake Warbird
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#23 - 2014-08-27 10:32:48 UTC
Chopper Rollins
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#24 - 2014-08-27 11:01:56 UTC
Adrie Atticus wrote:
CCP itself cannot create a casino system where users can use real money only to win real money only as long as they're an Icelandic company. InterStellar Kredits are defined in EULA/ToS to have no monetary value and the sections you linked cannot be applied.


Still, listening to some sad-sack burble about how he's wasted the 24 PLEX he bought on gambling, or worse, hearing a list of ingame crap he's won, makes my damn skin break out.
That's because i've always equated gambling with being a self-destructive, self-indulgent fool and all my experience with gamblers has reinforced that. MMOs, stamp collecting, LARPING, whatever a person spends too much time or energy on, nothing has the same capacity for robbing you of your home and clothes.
It gets wearing when the activities suggested for WiS seem to be strip clubs and casinos, are you people that dull and sheltered?






Goggles. Making me look good. Making you look good.
Ramona McCandless
Silent Vale
LinkNet
#25 - 2014-08-27 11:09:41 UTC
Chopper Rollins wrote:
Adrie Atticus wrote:
CCP itself cannot create a casino system where users can use real money only to win real money only as long as they're an Icelandic company. InterStellar Kredits are defined in EULA/ToS to have no monetary value and the sections you linked cannot be applied.


Still, listening to some sad-sack burble about how he's wasted the 24 PLEX he bought on gambling, or worse, hearing a list of ingame crap he's won, makes my damn skin break out.
That's because i've always equated gambling with being a self-destructive, self-indulgent fool and all my experience with gamblers has reinforced that. MMOs, stamp collecting, LARPING, whatever a person spends too much time or energy on, nothing has the same capacity for robbing you of your home and clothes.
It gets wearing when the activities suggested for WiS seem to be strip clubs and casinos, are you people that dull and sheltered?


It is written "When Ramona and Chopper's opinions align on a subject, Great Cthulhu will awaken from his eons-long slumber."

I think I just heard a rumble.

"Yea, some dude came in and was normal for first couple months, so I gave him director." - Sean Dunaway

"A singular character could be hired to penetrate another corps space... using gorilla like tactics..." - Chane Morgann
Mithandra
B.O.P Supplication For Glorious
Dracarys.
#26 - 2014-08-27 11:15:35 UTC
bacon lettuce tomato wrote:
Quote:
According to Articles 183 and 184 of the Criminal Code, in effect since 1998, “it is a punishable offense to engage in gambling and betting on a professional basis, to encourage others to participate in these activities and to derive direct or indirect income from having the activities take place on one’s premises.”


So this means we'll never see ingame casinos right?


You seriously took time away from playing the game to wade through the Icelandic criminal code?

Words for once fail me.

Eve is the dark haired, totally hot emo gothchild of the gaming community
Vortexo VonBrenner
Doomheim
#27 - 2014-08-27 11:48:31 UTC
Jarod Garamonde wrote:

Murder is illegal in Iceland, too. Yet, behold...... PvP in EVE.

Note that swearing a bloodoath and slaying the offender in single combat is not considered murder in Iceland but rather justifiable against someone who insults one's boat. Strange holdover from the past, evidently. Explains a bit of EVE...




Jarod Garamonde wrote:
..assets in EVE are not taxable (for those who were worried that the American IRS was going to tax our spaceships)?

To be fair...I wouldn't put it past governments to try something like that... ; )



EvE security zones in pictures

EvE quick reference pdf

EvE links
Wacktopia
Fleet-Up.com
Keep It Simple Software Group
#28 - 2014-08-27 14:30:21 UTC
bacon lettuce tomato wrote:
Should be paid attention to as CCP's PLEX model, may constitute 'indirect income' through ISK gambling if it were to ever happen.



ISK has no real world value. The conversion only works one way.

Kitchen sink? Seriousy, get your ship together -  Fleet-Up.com
Ramona McCandless
Silent Vale
LinkNet
#29 - 2014-08-27 14:35:02 UTC
Vortexo VonBrenner wrote:
Strange holdover from the past, evidently. Explains a bit of EVE...


Which bit?

"Yea, some dude came in and was normal for first couple months, so I gave him director." - Sean Dunaway

"A singular character could be hired to penetrate another corps space... using gorilla like tactics..." - Chane Morgann
Caviar Liberta
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#30 - 2014-08-27 14:37:54 UTC
Doc Fury wrote:
It all depends on what "a professional basis" means which is most likely defined elsewhere.


"derive direct or indirect income from having the activities take place on one’s premises.”"

Since the server if you want to define that as premises is located in England so that shouldn't cause a problem for CCP.
Jarod Garamonde
Jolly Codgers
Get Off My Lawn
#31 - 2014-08-27 15:58:09 UTC
Vortexo VonBrenner wrote:
Jarod Garamonde wrote:

Murder is illegal in Iceland, too. Yet, behold...... PvP in EVE.

Note that swearing a bloodoath and slaying the offender in single combat is not considered murder in Iceland but rather justifiable against someone who insults one's boat. Strange holdover from the past, evidently. Explains a bit of EVE...




Can a legitimate natural-born Icelander confirm this?
Because I have been searching for a reasonable country to expatriate to, if civil war breaks out in the US.

I am fine with a country that doesn't allow me to own guns, so long as it has swords and dueling. As for what I can offer to my new country.... I am pursuing a biology degree, and I plan to go into genetic research when my education is complete. I can also fix and modify cars, and I am a happy drunk.

That moment when you realize the crazy lady with all the cats was right...

    [#savethelance]
Remiel Pollard
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#32 - 2014-08-27 16:06:10 UTC  |  Edited by: Remiel Pollard
Jarod Garamonde wrote:
Vortexo VonBrenner wrote:
Jarod Garamonde wrote:

Murder is illegal in Iceland, too. Yet, behold...... PvP in EVE.

Note that swearing a bloodoath and slaying the offender in single combat is not considered murder in Iceland but rather justifiable against someone who insults one's boat. Strange holdover from the past, evidently. Explains a bit of EVE...




Can a legitimate natural-born Icelander confirm this?
Because I have been searching for a reasonable country to expatriate to, if civil war breaks out in the US.

I am fine with a country that doesn't allow me to own guns, so long as it has swords and dueling. As for what I can offer to my new country.... I am pursuing a biology degree, and I plan to go into genetic research when my education is complete. I can also fix and modify cars, and I am a happy drunk.


Before our current government, I would have said "Australia" hands down if you want to advance a career in genetics research.

But now all I can say is, stay the hell away, you don't wanna be here right now. With budget cuts to science of all fields except one that conveniently justifies privatizing health care, Iceland sounds like a perfectly suitable alternative though. Can't say I haven't seriously contemplated it myself given Australia's current direction.

That being said, it looks like people are starting to catch on to our government's BS and their approval ratings have dropped like a rock so, I'm holding out with some hope that things will come good again.

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104
Jarod Garamonde
Jolly Codgers
Get Off My Lawn
#33 - 2014-08-27 16:07:13 UTC  |  Edited by: Jarod Garamonde
Remiel Pollard wrote:
Jarod Garamonde wrote:
Vortexo VonBrenner wrote:
Jarod Garamonde wrote:

Murder is illegal in Iceland, too. Yet, behold...... PvP in EVE.

Note that swearing a bloodoath and slaying the offender in single combat is not considered murder in Iceland but rather justifiable against someone who insults one's boat. Strange holdover from the past, evidently. Explains a bit of EVE...




Can a legitimate natural-born Icelander confirm this?
Because I have been searching for a reasonable country to expatriate to, if civil war breaks out in the US.

I am fine with a country that doesn't allow me to own guns, so long as it has swords and dueling. As for what I can offer to my new country.... I am pursuing a biology degree, and I plan to go into genetic research when my education is complete. I can also fix and modify cars, and I am a happy drunk.


Before our current government, I would have said "Australia" hands down if you want to advance a career in genetics research.

But now all I can say is, stay the hell away, you don't wanna be here right now. Iceland sounds like a perfectly suitable alternative though. Can't say I haven't seriously contemplated it myself given Australia's current direction.

That being said, it looks like people are starting to catch on to our government's BS and their approval ratings have dropped like a rock so, I'm holding out with some hope that things will come good again.



Oz or Kiwiland..... either one would be better than anywhere in the US that isn't Vegas.

Hell, Oz lets you have Skyline GT-Rs.... that already puts you blokes several paces ahead of my country.

That moment when you realize the crazy lady with all the cats was right...

    [#savethelance]
Remiel Pollard
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#34 - 2014-08-27 16:10:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Remiel Pollard
Jarod Garamonde wrote:



Oz or Kiwiland..... either one would be better than anywhere in the US that isn't Vegas.


I enjoy the fact that I can go for long walks after dark, even very late at night, without the threat of getting shot looming over every step.

But the CSIRO, the guys that brought us WiFi and lots of cool stuff in genetics, they just had massive budget cuts to the tune of 400+ research jobs, along with a number of other science institutes. You'd almost be forgiven for thinking this government had a problem with science and discovery...

As for the GT-R, so many people have them that they're not really considered anything special over here, and the kind of person that tends to drive them gives them a bad name. I love the GT-R, but I love the S-series coupes and hatches a lot more. AWD is too... idk, stable. Not enough 'sideways' to make me squee like an S13 does :p

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104
Jarod Garamonde
Jolly Codgers
Get Off My Lawn
#35 - 2014-08-27 16:16:22 UTC
Remiel Pollard wrote:
Jarod Garamonde wrote:



Oz or Kiwiland..... either one would be better than anywhere in the US that isn't Vegas.


I enjoy the fact that I can go for long walks after dark, even very late at night, without the threat of getting shot looming over every step.

But the CSIRO, the guys that brought us WiFi and lots of cool stuff in genetics, they just had massive budget cuts to the tune of 400+ research jobs, along with a number of other science institutes. You'd almost be forgiven for thinking this government had a problem with science and discovery...

As for the GT-R, so many people have them that they're not really considered anything special over here, and the kind of person that tends to drive them gives them a bad name. I love the GT-R, but I love the S-series coupes and hatches a lot more. AWD is too... idk, stable. Not enough 'sideways' to make me squee like an S13 does :p



I drive a 73 FairladyZ, here, and I'm perfectly happy with it. I would love to also have a Ken & Mary GT-R and an R32 in my stable, but, alas.... hype drives up the prices, here. Good luck finding either for under 10grand USD.
I used to have an S13, and I'd not mind owning another.

That moment when you realize the crazy lady with all the cats was right...

    [#savethelance]
Remiel Pollard
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#36 - 2014-08-27 16:29:09 UTC
Jarod Garamonde wrote:
Remiel Pollard wrote:
Jarod Garamonde wrote:



Oz or Kiwiland..... either one would be better than anywhere in the US that isn't Vegas.


I enjoy the fact that I can go for long walks after dark, even very late at night, without the threat of getting shot looming over every step.

But the CSIRO, the guys that brought us WiFi and lots of cool stuff in genetics, they just had massive budget cuts to the tune of 400+ research jobs, along with a number of other science institutes. You'd almost be forgiven for thinking this government had a problem with science and discovery...

As for the GT-R, so many people have them that they're not really considered anything special over here, and the kind of person that tends to drive them gives them a bad name. I love the GT-R, but I love the S-series coupes and hatches a lot more. AWD is too... idk, stable. Not enough 'sideways' to make me squee like an S13 does :p



I drive a 73 FairladyZ, here, and I'm perfectly happy with it. I would love to also have a Ken & Mary GT-R and an R32 in my stable, but, alas.... hype drives up the prices, here. Good luck finding either for under 10grand USD.
I used to have an S13, and I'd not mind owning another.


The Z series is a beast I'm yet to feel confident taking on. I'm a drifter, and I had a.... well, a bad experience in a 300ZX some time ago. It put a bit of a fear into me, and I'm getting a bit old for the track these days, so it's not likely I'll ever get to do this, but mastering a Z sideways was once a personal goal of mine. It's a natural drifter but unlike the S, it's something that you don't 'control' so much, you need to let it do its own thing for the most part, and only give it some general guidance. The S is a machine that you control - the Z is an extension of the body, and the mind, all at once, and you need to be a part of it as much as it needs to be a part of you or you're gonna have a bad day behind the wheel.

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104
Jarod Garamonde
Jolly Codgers
Get Off My Lawn
#37 - 2014-08-27 16:37:27 UTC
Remiel Pollard wrote:


The Z series is a beast I'm yet to feel confident taking on. I'm a drifter, and I had a.... well, a bad experience in a 300ZX some time ago. It put a bit of a fear into me, and I'm getting a bit old for the track these days, so it's not likely I'll ever get to do this, but mastering a Z sideways was once a personal goal of mine. It's a natural drifter but unlike the S, it's something that you don't 'control' so much, you need to let it do its own thing for the most part, and only give it some general guidance. The S is a machine that you control - the Z is an extension of the body, and the mind, all at once, and you need to be a part of it as much as it needs to be a part of you or you're gonna have a bad day behind the wheel.



The old straight-6 Zeds are a masterpiece. I just sold a Z31 300. It was my daily, and I wanted to devote more time to my S30 (I've owned the 73 Fairlady for most of my life... she pushes out around 400bhp after everything I've done to that old L28 engine).
The S30 and S130 are totally different animals from the Z-series Fairladies.
But, still..... there's something to be said for riding around Vegas in the summer with the T-tops off. I can't have that feeling in my 73. But what I can have is a wedge-shaped roadrocket that only wants one thing; to go faster. The classic Z is meant for highway driving. If I wanted to slingshot through the corners in something that could possibly make me blackout, I'd tune an FC RX-7.

That moment when you realize the crazy lady with all the cats was right...

    [#savethelance]
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#38 - 2014-08-27 17:12:18 UTC
RubyPorto wrote:

Can you give a citation please?


I recall something about WoW purple gear, a scam and possibly someone getting stabbed over it.
Maxpie
MUSE LLP
#39 - 2014-08-27 17:27:14 UTC
Clearly the Eve Online General Disucssion forum is the best place to obtain an accurate legal opinion of Icelandic law. We're going to put attorneys in Iceland out of business.

No good deed goes unpunished
Frostys Virpio
State War Academy
Caldari State
#40 - 2014-08-27 17:49:56 UTC
Maxpie wrote:
Clearly the Eve Online General Disucssion forum is the best place to obtain an accurate legal opinion of Icelandic law. We're going to put attorneys in Iceland out of business.


Even if we had 100% clear Icelandic laws, we would still be hosed because CCP probably also have to take into account the laws of every playing countries because we don't know what country X consider a monetary gain which could be taxable or not even if we here all agree ISK are not real money. A lot of place have some plain old laws still valid which are a pain to deal with because they don't really apply in this day and age but they were never made void. It only take one dude to file a court case against one other dude and CCP would end up being involved into a shitstorm for enabling it.

Having to hand out income paperwork to player because they won some ISK considered like a monetary gain is some banana republic is not something CCP want to deal with.
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