Assembly Hall

Summary:

• The PLEX reseller system is still valid and valuable.
• Coherent policies are required, now.
• Shared oversight and a trust system is required, now.
• No side-deals between CCP employees and fansites/resellers.

Dear fellow EVE player:
CCP's PLEX system remains one of the best mechanisms for players to fund their game play. And when operated within both the letter and spirit of the rules, it's been the chief way that many community sites have been able to afford to build cool stuff for the players. In those respects, it's been a win-win for all involved.

Recent events clearly show what happens when the hunt for that revenue on both sides --CCP's and site owners-- goes too far. And understandably, it raises questions about the legitimacy of the entire program itself.

BattleClinic calls on the CSM to consider the following:

1. Reseller Promotion Guidelines
The CSM together with CCP's Sales, Legal, and Community Management departments, and together with representatives from the major resellers and wholesalers of PLEX, should draft acceptable guidelines/rules for reseller promotions.

2. CSM Oversight of Reseller Promotions, with Certification
The CSM together with CCP's Sales Department and Community Manager meet to review Reseller Promotions on a regular basis. Resellers earn a "Trusted Reseller" certification with a link to an official CCP page. Resellers who comply with promotional rules will be continually re-certified, each time the CSM meets.

3. Coherent, proactive, and community-based 3rd Party revenue licensing model
The CSM together with CCP's Sales, Legal, Marketing (branding) and Community Management departments together with representatives from the major resellers and wholesalers of PLEX AND major fansite operators, should immediately convene to review the 3rd party licensing scheme that's currently underway, to determine if the standards and oversight are sufficient to prevent/deal with future controversy. And further, to require any PLEX reseller and fansite operator to file a business plan which describes how they will conduct promotions, sales, and marketing, which will be subject to approval by CCP and potentially the CSM.

4. Relationships between CCP devs and fansite operators/resellers
The CSM should request a review of the policy which clearly defines how CCP developers who are not part of sales, legal, or marketing may make contact with fansite operators and resellers. If one does not exist, request that it be created and reviewed. These rules should clearly articulate the type of interaction between the groups, and how communication will be monitored for adherence.

Finally, this:
We at BattleClinic have watched recent developments very closely. We believe that it's time to bring appropriate oversight to resellers and when they create deals or promotions with fansites, hold them accountable not only to contract standards, but also to community standards and expectations. Because clearly, internet spaceships are serious business!

Chris C.
"SghnDubh"
Founder, BattleClinic

*Grabs Popcorn*

No one will ever give, nor has there ever been ANY fucks given...

Sites who make CCP the most cash VIA PLEX will always.........ALWAYS receive preferential treatment (and backdoor deals.) If you have an issue with this, then sell moar PLEX.

I would of thought that CCP would of had an official contact for all matters relating to 3rd Parties, is this not the case?

I mean if you run a 3rd Party site who do you contact for matters relating to promotions and such?

As Doc Fury so rightly points out, this really isn't the appropriate place for this post. The Assembly hall is. GD can move pretty quickly, burying posts into the second or third page, meaning it's less likely to be seen by the appropriate people.




At least for now, Fansites are to not conduct promotions and sales. Sources of income are:
Plex referrals. (with no benefits to the person buying the plex)
Advertising (as per the rules https://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/EVE_Online_Fansite_AdSense_Guide )
Donations (which aren't required to gain access to bits of the site)

That's it.


I am interested in getting the rules more hammered out. I don't want to see people able to leverage in game resources, for out of game financial benefit. (Sure, pay people ISK for writing articles for you. Sure, get advertising revenue. Don't give people isk when they donate to you. Not rocket science.)

I'm not particularly concerned with having a hammered out public set of rules to allow people to profit from CCP's IP. If you have an idea, and you want to do it, that's when you need to talk to CCP and have a contractual agreement with them. Like the PLEX resellers do. That's not an arrangement to be covered by the EULA. That's a commercial agreement.



I am not a lawyer, I can't speak for CCP, this is purely my interpretation, if it gets you banned, you should have spoken to CCP.

I'd start with the CCPer who manages fansites (When you run a fansite, you have a contact. There's a form on the community site to get started) Or CCP Falcon, as community manager.

Either of them, should be able to start you talking with the appropriate people.

(Long term, you'll also be talking with Legal. As I've not tried to form a commercial arrangement with CCP, I don't know exactly who the right people are. I suspect it depends on exactly what kind of arrangement you want.)

We can definitely discuss this during the Community and\or Marketing session.

However,

This may take all of the time that our CSM reps have. Let's not forget that they are just volunteers and can't spend 8 hours every day on stuff like this.

#nolife4life

But seriously, I do appreciate how you guys have been so very on top of things this year. This is shaping up to be a very good CSM season. I know I wouldn't have been able to do it.

The questions in the OP should have been answered after the Somer nonsense last year. If they had been, it is unlikely the latest incident would have occurred.

The questions in the OP should be clarified openly to avoid similar occurrences in the future.

Unfortunately this is the dark side of companies embracing social networking to talk to their customers.

As long as people have CCP folk on their Skype, or their personal email addresses, and those people willingly engage with players on matters they ought to channel elsewhere (as per Somer and "Lisa in Sales"), this is always going to be a problem.

Where is CCP Internal Affairs these days? The whole iScorps dished out to Somer team on the down low got brushed under the carpet and it seems once again nothing was learnt from it.

As counter intuitive as it sounds CCP needs to learn that directly engaging with third party developers is fraught with risk, especially when it's casual and informal on external channels like Skype, email, etc. There shouldn't be anything being proposed or agreed upon that either party wouldn't want the community knowing about. If there is - chances are it's another Somer waiting to blow up.

Transparency has to be foremost in all dealings, and if that means eschewing cool new "direct access to the devs!" tools like Skype in favour of communication on forums that at least the CSM can supervise, if not the community as a whole, then so be it.

I realise though that's probably just a fantasy and devs and other CCP staff that have swapped Skype etc details on previous pub crawls are having all kinds of "wink nudge you didn't hear it from me but keep an eye out for X" convos on a regular basis. At least, events like Somer that seem to keep happening over and over without important lessons being learnt would suggest they are.

I actually feel sorry for the people that are respecting the rules to the letter, or don't have a dev batphone, as they're the ones that seem to suffer most from it through no fault of their own.