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low sec POSing? worth the work??
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Adamus Kane
Kane's Imperial Eagles
#1 - 2011-09-12 14:39:41 UTC
i have always wanted to get into Posing. it sounds like high sec is a pain for not that much return. null sounds like it is the best but since i am not currently in an alliance with null territory so that is out. thus low sec seems to be the location of choice.

my question is this. is it worth it to setup a Pos? good profit in this endeavor??

if the above answers are yes then what will i need in terms of
-skills
-equipment
-know how
-fuel
-cash

also any input on what control tower and modules to get would be appreciated. (i play caldari if that makes a difference on teh control tower)

last question is what is the process involved with setting up a profitable low sec POS.

thanks in advance for any help

-Kane
Cyniac
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#2 - 2011-09-12 15:15:18 UTC
You can setup a POS in null NPC space if you like, no need to be in an alliance. Mind you it will probably be snuffed out if someone wants to bother snuffing it out.

I can say unequivocally that a lowsec POS can be profitable but there are so many variables involved in this that its hard to give you an adequate estimate.

Normally you don't POS for the joy of managing a POS (really - three months fuelling a few of those and you'll be moaning every time you have to think of ice products... but I digress). It's more normal for you to have a reason to setup a POS and then to go ahead and set one up to fulfill that need.


Stuff people do in lowsec POS

- Reactions
- Alchemy
- Moon mining
- Logistics (yes it can be used as a base or location for cynos or whatever)
- Research (though high sec is generally better for this)
- Nominally production - I say nominally because these in lowsec are rather niche applications.


Moon mining on its own will not be profitable - you'll not find a good free moon and if you do expect to have to fight off a cap fleet to keep it.

Alchemy is not profitable period, but sometimes needed.

Reactions - take your pick - T2 materials, gas reactions, boosters whatever. Some are more profitable than others - logistics can get tricky.

Logistics - use your POS as a base of operations. Depending on what you do and where you are this might be incidental or of high value. Note that this is a critical feature for POS in WH space.

Research - can be done but you are better off in highsec (labs on a POS in lowsec just scream TARGET)

Production - yeah .... well think hard on this one.

BTW - you can in theory refine also in a POS but aside from ice, anything else will result in at least a 25% loss of materials, so not worthwhile in lowsec.
VaMei
Meafi Corp
#3 - 2011-09-12 15:51:24 UTC  |  Edited by: VaMei
Cyniac wrote:
Normally you don't POS for the joy of managing a POS (really - three months fuelling a few of those and you'll be moaning every time you have to think of ice products... but I digress). It's more normal for you to have a reason to setup a POS and then to go ahead and set one up to fulfill that need.


This.

Like most of the expensive toys in Eve, if you need to ask how it's going to make you money, you're probably not ready for one. There's nothing wrong with doing the research, but by the time you have a business that'll profit from having a POS, you'll know how it'll make you money.

and before you ask... Yes, all the moons with good resources are taken and have been for years. There are plenty of available moons with less valuable stuff that can help mitigate costs of an otherwise profitable POS, but you'll have to fight for a good moon.
Adamus Kane
Kane's Imperial Eagles
#4 - 2011-09-12 17:11:40 UTC
so my best options then is either a research pos in high, profit off of BP's (need to do some research on how research works, yes noob stuff i know) or join an alliance and grab a decent moon in null.

in terms of the high sec pos, what is so special about researching in high? why not use the stations? is there a bonus to using a pos to do research??

thanks again for all the info

-Kane
Bado Sten
Republican Guard
Shadow Cartel
#5 - 2011-09-12 17:24:18 UTC
POS labs do ME, PE and copying faster than public labs, but the main bonus is availability. Finding available public labs with no wait-time in high-sec is hard
Adamus Kane
Kane's Imperial Eagles
#6 - 2011-09-12 17:30:30 UTC
so then a good plan might be to learn how to research, get a decent research op going and then set up a high sec research POS.

now can they be anchored anywhere? and if so what is a good place to set them where no one will find them or bother them except you.
VaMei
Meafi Corp
#7 - 2011-09-12 17:52:19 UTC  |  Edited by: VaMei
Adamus Kane wrote:
so then a good plan might be to learn how to research, get a decent research op going and then set up a high sec research POS.

Pretty much. Start with some cheap BPOs at a hi-sec station to get the feel for things. It may take forever, but there's no risk and minimal investment while you learn. Once you decide that the hi-sec station is too slow, grab a fast ship (one time when a shuttle is actually a good choice) and drag those CHEAP BPOs out to a low-sec station where you can get better times and increase your business. If you have a cloaky hauler or a cov-ops, you could consider more expensive prints, but that's your call.

If you have the Scientific Networking skill trained up, you can run your research from anywhere within the same region as the station you keep your prints in. The only time you even need to get back to that station is to move finished BPs.

Once you outgrow that business model, then it's time to think about a research POS.

Quote:

now can they be anchored anywhere? and if so what is a good place to set them where no one will find them or bother them except you.

They can only be placed at moons (one per moon), in systems where you have good standings with the local faction. You'll need a faction standing of 10 times the system security to place a POS. eg. 5.0 to place one in .5 space.

As for no one finding it, good luck with that. Anyone can find it by warping to that moon, or they can toss out a spread of probes and simply warp to each POS returned. Peeps do look for POSes owned by small corps that look like they'll be worth knocking off (or just to harvest the tears), so be prepared for the war dec.
Mad Shopper
Mad Industrial Consortium
#8 - 2011-09-12 19:17:07 UTC
The best way to avoid highsec wardecs with a small operation is to mot make anyone mad. Other then that, don't anchor a small tower and put up enough defenses to convince greefers that the undefended tower next door is a better target.
Adamus Kane
Kane's Imperial Eagles
#9 - 2011-09-12 21:23:34 UTC
thanks so much all.

Usurpine
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#10 - 2011-09-16 12:49:52 UTC
Enter an empty wh and anchor your pos there.
Join some people who know how to make isk with a pos.
Xtraneous
Sam's Space Guys
#11 - 2011-09-19 12:04:35 UTC
Adamus Kane wrote:


my question is this. is it worth it to setup a Pos? good profit in this endeavor??



I ran a reaction network in lowsec for almost 2 years, about 25 towers at it's peak and it can be insanely profitable.

There's a few things i'd suggest.

1. Use a Jump Freighter - hauling in a transport isn't practical if you've got more than a couple of towers
2. Use Gallente Towers - the silo bonus means you'll be topping up and emptying much less often.
3. Find a nice quiet 0.3 or lower sytem - dead end systems at least a few jumps from hisec are best.
4. Be prepared to change reactions depending on what's most profitable for a given week. Spreadsheets are a must.
5. Don't forget to use buy orders to purchase any goo you need.
6. There's plenty of lowend metal moons vacant. Titanium, Tungsten etc can help offset fuel bills or feed reactions.
7. Don't do any reseach in lowsec.

In 2 years I never had my lowsec towers attacked or been bothered at all.
My towers have all been pulled down now, i'm not playing as much since CQ, so if you'd like any vacant moon locations drop me a mail ingame.
Destamon
Azure Freelancers
#12 - 2011-09-19 14:46:20 UTC
Bado Sten wrote:
POS labs do ME, PE and copying faster than public labs, but the main bonus is availability. Finding available public labs with no wait-time in high-sec is hard


I'm late to the party but I'll just point this out: free PE, copying, and invention slots are available in ample quantities even very close to Jita. For ME slots you'll have to go to lowsec, where you can usually find some slots with a waiting time of under a week. Ship your BPOs there (shuttle, covops, scout ahead if necessary, look up system stats on map ahead of time (pilots in space, ships destroyed, pods destroyed, etc)) then sit in nearby hisec to direct the research as needed, once it's all done ship it back.