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Low Sec FW Meetings

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Subsparx
Crimson Serpent Syndicate
#41 - 2014-08-20 06:44:35 UTC
lord xavier wrote:
The main issue I see with faction warfare is it is being farmed by carebears who run full a rack of stabs and warp out if anyone comes into the site. Maybe make a 15k warp disruption field around the actual capture point, As it gets closer to being capture expand out the field. Making people have to be relatively commited to it. The current system the way it is and warp core stabs are part of the reson why alot people "blob" single ships in sites.

I mean why waste time trying to look for stuff solo if all that is going to happen is they are going to warp out anyways? Why not just get 3 or 4 friends together and go look for stuff and all point it before it gets out?


Alternatively, instead of this cloak nerf, which did nothing whatsoever to fix the farming problem (and in fact made it worse), you could fix it just as easily by disabling entry to the plex if you have warp stabs equipped to your ship. This would likely also be much less load on the server side as it's no longer having to project out a warp scramming effect in a radius like a bubble and instead simply deny entry.

Disabling cloaks within 30km of the beacon was the opposite move in my opinion that CCP should have done to fix farming. One of the best ways to catch them was cloaky ships, like a Nemesis with multiple scrams. That is no longer possible. Additionally, you can't use things like a Pilgrim in a plex anymore, at least not as effectively. Now you have to be way off the beacon in order to use anything cloaky.

While the cloak nerf doesn't really hinder the usage of things like Falcons, Rapiers or Huginns, it does drastically diminish the usability of Pilgrims, Stratios and Asteros inside combat plexes. In essence, by disabling cloaks inside the plex, all they managed to actually accomplish was limit legitimate combat tactics from being used and make it safer to farm.

CEO of Crimson Serpent Syndicate - www.crimsonserpent.com

Chairman of Heiian Conglomerate - www.heiian.com

Owner of FWC - www.factionwarfare.com
Nameira Vanis-Tor
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#42 - 2014-08-20 08:26:54 UTC
lord xavier wrote:
Nameira Vanis-Tor wrote:
You have pirates and neutrals - anyone from the new player friendly guys in The Scope to the 'Hey look someone's flying a Stabber lets hot drop it with carriers' Shadow Cartel, PL etc.

First, I would like to see killmails to this accusation please.
Secondl If you take the time to go here. Considering what you just said, there is no difference between you, SC, PL, BL or any other entity with bigger or stronger ships. Just as PL drops their supercapitals on everything undocked, from a carier to a velotr. Shadow Cartel organizing and forming roams, 2-3 man fleets to go look for site runners or something to shoot at or even gatecamps. You take 6 people to kill a completely defenseless mining ship that couldnt attack back. Throwing around some silly slander like that doesn't help anyone and everyone, EVERYONE is in the same boat when it comes to PVP.


The main issue I see with faction warfare is it is being farmed by carebears who run full a rack of stabs and warp out if anyone comes into the site. Maybe make a 15k warp disruption field around the actual capture point, As it gets closer to being capture expand out the field. Making people have to be relatively commited to it. The current system the way it is and warp core stabs are part of the reson why alot people "blob" single ships in sites.

I mean why waste time trying to look for stuff solo if all that is going to happen is they are going to warp out anyways? Why not just get 3 or 4 friends together and go look for stuff and all point it before it gets out?


https://zkillboard.com/kill/40585798/ Props to you for letting someone roam with you in a Harbinger...

I dont want to hijack this thread with an off topic mud slingling fest, if someone wants to fly a 200 Mil ISK Exhumer in low sec then thats them being silly and they will die. My views are my own - I am not a diplo for my alliance.

The difference between Shadow Cartel and PL in the Amarr/Mini warzone is that you are too big for it - you have simply become an environmental hazard, like CODE in highsec. When most of the other factions in your area of low sec have to make the choice of "Well do we undock anything bigger than a dessie fleet and risk a drop by bored super pirates?" then thats a warning sign you are depriving yourself of content. I have been in fleets where we are sitting blasting it out in T1 cruisers or HACs, battleships etc against a similar sized fleet and the clear undertanding in fleet is that we are on an invisible timer with the engagement before you guys or PL notice and crash it. Or where a large engagement on a gate is seeing the enemy losing but they are not deagressing and keeping on field - e-honour? No, here comes the batphoned PL/SC cyno alt into local and the order to de-agress is swiftly given.

If you form a cruiser roam I would be surprised if anyone chooses to engage you toe to toe in any numbers - because they realise if they start winning the most likely response will be an upshipping/cyno drop all the way up to capitals which no one else is going to put on the line. This is why corps who like low sec sub cap fleet pvp drop out of alliances like yours - potential enemies see the Shadow Cartel/PL/BL tag and think no way - instant lose why bother?

I apologise for the exageration about the Stabber vs Carriers but the point I highlighted remains the same.
Theroine
Pew Pew Pirates
#43 - 2014-08-20 09:11:29 UTC
Like it has already been mentioned, the last change to rat strength has already greatly reduced the issue of afk offensive plexing, so let's move past issues that aren't really a problem anymore. One mistake of the last change was the cloak change in a plex. As much as people whine on the forums, and we love our whine as much as some love the tears, limiting how people fit their ships and choose to play the game is a mistake in my opinion.

I also think all of the talk of sec status hits or making plexes sec status free zones is a bad idea. I understand not wanting to lose sec status. It's a b**ch to get back up. So you have a choice, shoot first and take the hit, or wait to aggress and maybe lose the fight. HTFU and live with the consequences.

Join in on the pew
lord xavier
Rubbed Out
#44 - 2014-08-20 11:33:14 UTC
Nameira Vanis-Tor wrote:
https://zkillboard.com/kill/40585798/ Props to you for letting someone roam with you in a Harbinger...

I dont want to hijack this thread with an off topic mud slingling fest, if someone wants to fly a 200 Mil ISK Exhumer in low sec then thats them being silly and they will die. My views are my own - I am not a diplo for my alliance.

The difference between Shadow Cartel and PL in the Amarr/Mini warzone is that you are too big for it - you have simply become an environmental hazard, like CODE in highsec. When most of the other factions in your area of low sec have to make the choice of "Well do we undock anything bigger than a dessie fleet and risk a drop by bored super pirates?" then thats a warning sign you are depriving yourself of content. I have been in fleets where we are sitting blasting it out in T1 cruisers or HACs, battleships etc against a similar sized fleet and the clear undertanding in fleet is that we are on an invisible timer with the engagement before you guys or PL notice and crash it. Or where a large engagement on a gate is seeing the enemy losing but they are not deagressing and keeping on field - e-honour? No, here comes the batphoned PL/SC cyno alt into local and the order to de-agress is swiftly given.

If you form a cruiser roam I would be surprised if anyone chooses to engage you toe to toe in any numbers - because they realise if they start winning the most likely response will be an upshipping/cyno drop all the way up to capitals which no one else is going to put on the line. This is why corps who like low sec sub cap fleet pvp drop out of alliances like yours - potential enemies see the Shadow Cartel/PL/BL tag and think no way - instant lose why bother?

I apologise for the exageration about the Stabber vs Carriers but the point I highlighted remains the same.

I would like to note I am not a diplo or official public relations person for shadow cartel. I have been flying with SC for a little over a month now.

That looks like a gate camp, given what Emfive died in and the fact there is a solo guardian. Could be wrong as I was not there.

Faction warfare has always drawn people to it. Especially since the revamp and addition of POCOs. A lot of the SC people I see go out solo or in small gangs. I say small as in anywhere from 2 to 7 with nothing bigger than cruisers. Which is normal sizes even from the FWers. Yes, some single kills get 6-7 people on it, but that is true for both sides. Denying all entities in Eve do the "Need more people!" is silly and you're just lying to yourself.

As for dropping capitals; honestly as a person with far too many capital capable pilots that have their capitals. Yes, there are times you want to just drop them. I have not made a habit out of it personally and I know several others who have not as well. At the same time I know people that will drop their nyx/hel on a velator, venture, cyno kestrel or whatever. We don't invest the 1b to 150b to POS/Station spin the capitals and wait for a "fair fight" because they do not exist in the Battleship+ warfare. They just do not exist. The second a capital (or faction battleship) is undocked it gets a massive target over its head. That is the risk every capital pilot deals with when fielding a capital regardless of alliance. If you are putting 2-3 carriers on field you are vulnerable, if you are putting 10 dreads on field, you are vulnerable because there is always someone bigger than you.

Being too big for FW: Do you guys use your Militia chat? I mean, how hard is it to be like "Hey bros, got a carrier tackled. We can only hold out so long. Bring armor logis." Running everytime 1-3 carriers are dropped is silly. Also fearing to undock your BCs is kind of weird, not in the aspect of "Hey undock that harbinger so I can drop it." but aiming more towards the, why not setup a militia Battlecruiser roam with 6-8 logi or something? You would be surprised the amount of people that will actually give you a good fight without capitals. Battleships I can see given their terrible warp speed.

I remember recently being on a fleet of 30 or 40 or something and we were fighting some people at a POS. So, under POS defenses, pretty equal numbers and then Easily Excited dropped a carrier in support of their fleet. We were in cruisers. We killed their fleet and the carrier without using anything but the ships we had in fleet and on field already. This whole ideal of "OMG A CARRIER WE NEED SUPERS TO WIN!" is absurd and needs to be abolished from the minds of every pilot in eve.

Not sure if I missed anything, this is my second time typing this out. #ThanksCCP
Gully Alex Foyle
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#45 - 2014-08-20 11:53:59 UTC
A small suggestion.

We all noticed how the FW Complex beacons have been 'virtually bloated' to 30km radius to enable the 'no-cloaking inside capture range' feature.

Myself and, I guess, several others are now using the warp-in 'button' (technically, a 'large collidable object') as a reference point, to have an accurate readout of the distance to the warp-in point of a plex. And/or as an object to orbit/keep at range while setting up at optimal distance.


Problem is, large complexes do not have a 'button', so it's slightly annoying to gauge distance from the large beacon when on-grid.


Could CCP include a 'button' in the large complexes, too?


Unless, of course, they do away with the 'no cloaking' feature altogether and go back to the previous 'normal-sized' beacons, which would be perfectly fine for me (and almost everybody else, from what I read/hear).

Make space glamorous! Is EVE dying or not? Ask the EVE-O Death-o-meter!
lord xavier
Rubbed Out
#46 - 2014-08-20 12:14:03 UTC
Subsparx wrote:
lord xavier wrote:
The main issue I see with faction warfare is it is being farmed by carebears who run full a rack of stabs and warp out if anyone comes into the site. Maybe make a 15k warp disruption field around the actual capture point, As it gets closer to being capture expand out the field. Making people have to be relatively commited to it. The current system the way it is and warp core stabs are part of the reson why alot people "blob" single ships in sites.

I mean why waste time trying to look for stuff solo if all that is going to happen is they are going to warp out anyways? Why not just get 3 or 4 friends together and go look for stuff and all point it before it gets out?


Alternatively, instead of this cloak nerf, which did nothing whatsoever to fix the farming problem (and in fact made it worse), you could fix it just as easily by disabling entry to the plex if you have warp stabs equipped to your ship. This would likely also be much less load on the server side as it's no longer having to project out a warp scramming effect in a radius like a bubble and instead simply deny entry.

Disabling cloaks within 30km of the beacon was the opposite move in my opinion that CCP should have done to fix farming. One of the best ways to catch them was cloaky ships, like a Nemesis with multiple scrams. That is no longer possible. Additionally, you can't use things like a Pilgrim in a plex anymore, at least not as effectively. Now you have to be way off the beacon in order to use anything cloaky.

While the cloak nerf doesn't really hinder the usage of things like Falcons, Rapiers or Huginns, it does drastically diminish the usability of Pilgrims, Stratios and Asteros inside combat plexes. In essence, by disabling cloaks inside the plex, all they managed to actually accomplish was limit legitimate combat tactics from being used and make it safer to farm.
I have been able to use an alt in an arazu, but even then I still have to log on a Skirmish booster to even be able to cloak and be able to point them (At best with closest possible range to them, if they are on the other side of the beacon I am screwed.)

But yes, an alternative would be to not allow activation of any gates with Warp core stabs which would work as well.
Moglarr
Operation Meatshield
#47 - 2014-08-20 13:43:56 UTC
Subsparx wrote:
... Alternatively, instead of this cloak nerf, which did nothing whatsoever to fix the farming problem (and in fact made it worse), you could fix it just as easily by disabling entry to the plex if you have warp stabs equipped to your ship. This would likely also be much less load on the server side as it's no longer having to project out a warp scramming effect in a radius like a bubble and instead simply deny entry...


I don't like this idea, because:

Theroine wrote:
... limiting how people fit their ships and choose to play the game is a mistake in my opinion.


I agree that it is annoying that people who are in a plex aren't always waiting for a fight and some of them just want to plex. However, as someone who has at times just wanted to plex, you can't force me to fight you if I am paying attention and don't want to fight you. Just like just about every other situation in EVE. People wont take the fight if they don't think they can win and there is no point getting mad at people who have different objectives than you do.

Theroine wrote:
I also think all of the talk of sec status hits or making plexes sec status free zones is a bad idea. I understand not wanting to lose sec status. It's a b**ch to get back up. So you have a choice, shoot first and take the hit, or wait to aggress and maybe lose the fight. HTFU and live with the consequences.


Now, given that I was a pirate level sec status before joining FW I have to admit I don't know what it is like to be a pilot in good standing with the law and in the militia. However, with the number of roaming neutrals I can see how it can be difficult for a pilot to remain in good standing with the law. If people don't want to accept that all of FW (in fact all of low sec) is a free-fire war zone that is cool. Everyone should agree that a neutral warping into a FW complex is looking for trouble, though. Neutrals have no place in a war zone, you're either a threat or you're not. If you jump into my plex I have to assume you aim to do me harm. Yet with current sec status rules if I engage first, I am the bad guy, despite this fact this random dude just came running at me in the middle of a war.

Hence why going into a FW complex should make you a suspect. Because it is suspect behavior.

Operation Meatshield! GETUP and fight!
Cearain
Plus 10 NV
#48 - 2014-08-20 14:14:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Cearain
lord xavier wrote:

The main issue I see with faction warfare is it is being farmed by carebears who run full a rack of stabs and warp out if anyone comes into the site.


The problem you have is that you believe what you see with your own eyes, instead of what certain gallente pilots say. Start drinking more Kool-aid and you will see alts effect nothing and the occupancy war is all about pvpers.


Why are certain Gallente arguing against the obvious and huge impact of alts d-plexing? They are down to 5 systems and want to "win" fw again. The last thing they want in their subsequent circle jerk thread is anyone to claim these mechanics favor rabbit plexing. And they definitely don't want ccp to change the mechanics so that when their defensive plexing alts run from the plex the timer rollsback.

Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
lord xavier
Rubbed Out
#49 - 2014-08-20 14:28:57 UTC
Cearain wrote:
lord xavier wrote:

The main issue I see with faction warfare is it is being farmed by carebears who run full a rack of stabs and warp out if anyone comes into the site.


The problem you have is that you believe what you see with your own eyes, instead of what certain gallente pilots say. Start drinking more Kool-aid and you will see alts effect nothing and the occupancy war is all about pvpers.


Why are certain Gallente arguing against the obvious and huge impact of alts d-plexing? They are down to 5 systems and want to "win" fw again. The last thing they want in their subsequent circle jerk thread is anyone to claim these mechanics favor rabbit plexing. And they definitely don't want ccp to change the mechanics so that when their defensive plexing alts run from the plex the timer rollsback.

Well, what I see is an almost risk-free environment. You don't even have to d-scan. Just wait for something to warp in then start to warp off. Unless they are packing 2-3 scrams, your chances of getting out are 100% because the vexor has 4-5 stabs. This is common.

If the gallente want space back they should try that offensive thing sometime. Running from a point the second an atron comes really isn't going to gain them anything. All I have to do is come into local with my alt and all of a sudden plex running stops.
Cearain
Plus 10 NV
#50 - 2014-08-20 14:41:59 UTC
lord xavier wrote:
Cearain wrote:
lord xavier wrote:

The main issue I see with faction warfare is it is being farmed by carebears who run full a rack of stabs and warp out if anyone comes into the site.


The problem you have is that you believe what you see with your own eyes, instead of what certain gallente pilots say. Start drinking more Kool-aid and you will see alts effect nothing and the occupancy war is all about pvpers.


Why are certain Gallente arguing against the obvious and huge impact of alts d-plexing? They are down to 5 systems and want to "win" fw again. The last thing they want in their subsequent circle jerk thread is anyone to claim these mechanics favor rabbit plexing. And they definitely don't want ccp to change the mechanics so that when their defensive plexing alts run from the plex the timer rollsback.

Well, what I see is an almost risk-free environment. You don't even have to d-scan. Just wait for something to warp in then start to warp off. Unless they are packing 2-3 scrams, your chances of getting out are 100% because the vexor has 4-5 stabs. This is common.
If the gallente want space back they should try that offensive thing sometime. Running from a point the second an atron comes really isn't going to gain them anything. ...


Actually that is how the war is won. Plexing might stop in that system but they can just jump over a system or 2 and run different plex timers down. By the time they are run down you will be gone and they can finish whatever time remains on their plex timer. If we had rollbacks their running away would at least forfeit the time they spent in their stabbed frigates.

Under the current mechanics the gallente just need to outblob the caldari to take a system. (and they can) Once a system is taken then its d-plex alts take it from there.

Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
Estella Osoka
Cranky Bitches Who PMS
#51 - 2014-08-20 15:01:37 UTC
If the new Burner missions work out, I would like to see a mechanic where lowsec mission agents offer them more than the highsec agents. Say on a 50/50 basis. After all, they are basically PVP trainer missions and lowsec is full of PVP. I think that would solve some income issues with the new players who come to lowsec for PVP.
Master Sergeant MacRobert
Red Sky Morning
The Amarr Militia.
#52 - 2014-08-20 16:12:30 UTC
Cearain wrote:

If you think not having lots of plexes run in stabbed alts is stagnation then yes timer rollbacks will bring stagnation. But in terms of people really caring about tiers and warzone control as a whole (other than the occasional home system attack for lulz) it's already stagnant. Taht ship sailed on October 22 2012.


No I was anticipating CCP's stance. Stagnation is not truly present, offensively, it just now takes "effort" to take a system (which it should). Defensive plexing has conversely become too easy, hence whey most of Minmatar space is now below 10% contested.

Additionaly, if FW is rebalanced correctly then there should be a resultant population boom which would counter stagnation.

Cearain wrote:

If you are afraid there will be little plexing due to plex timer rollbacks then ccp should just dramatically slash the lp pay from level 4 fw missions. Problem solved. LP will increase in value and go to people who are willing to risk it in pvp related plexing.


If you fix the penalty / bonus for the FW Tier level (it is currently too high for tier 3, 4 and 5) then the LP payout for FW missions will too be reduced.

Cearain wrote:

As for the rest in the above quote it is pretty much the sort of changes that really wont effect anything. I'm not saying they are bad ideas. The last idea is really pretty good but its not going to change much. FW whill still be factionwhorefare.


The idea is to try and improve the gameplay for the various types of player that involve themselves in FW and furthermore, to incentivise a further repopulation of FW (currently the penalties are too great and are not outweighed by positive aspects (unless you come hunting LP).

"Remedy this situation or you shall live out the rest of your life in a pain amplifier"
Master Sergeant MacRobert
Red Sky Morning
The Amarr Militia.
#53 - 2014-08-20 16:26:14 UTC
X Gallentius wrote:

Farmers under control with latest changes to plex rats. Timer rollbacks not needed at this point in time.


Do not agree. Farming on an offensive level has been addressed by the plex rat tanking changes but, there is still an population affecting Warzone control, utilising the same guaranteed (ok almost guaranteed I will admit - shall we say 99%) evasion methods.

These evasion methods (commonly known as "farming") reduce interaction in what is usually known as an MMORPG. Interaction and the incentivising of interaction should be one of the driving factors for the gameplay design of New Eden.

X Gallentius wrote:

Otherwise, FW has generated more content for more entities than any other part of the game this summer.


This was due primarily to some dedicated player driven content that worked despite the gameplay designs that supress this kind of activity.

I am glad Gallente Militia have been enjoying their heyday.

X Gallentius wrote:

If anything, CCP should investigate ways to make NPC 0.0 and/or non-FW low sec systems more attractive.


Agree there is more work to be done.

However, whilst I try to take the view of inclusion of all gameplay styles and am looking for answers to balance, I am fighting for action in the one place that supports (some what) casual play. FW is my zone and I want more work done on improving it.

Null sec is for second life (my game is my 2nd job) play style.

"Remedy this situation or you shall live out the rest of your life in a pain amplifier"
Master Sergeant MacRobert
Red Sky Morning
The Amarr Militia.
#54 - 2014-08-20 16:36:32 UTC
X Gallentius wrote:


Cearain wrote:
If you are fine with the war being won by alts in empty frigates d-plexing systems and running from every fight, then nothing needs to be done. That's true.



Yep your warzone appears to be quite different from Amarr / Minmatar.

I think most of the real "grinders" are part of your faction or Minmatar.

I think the excessive bonus on LP payout for high FW Tier and the fact that the most desirable LP Store items belong to these factions is a factor.

X Gallentius wrote:

This is patently false. The alts in empty frigs are left unattended so their main can pay attention to other things, and they purposefully get podded to sell the kill rights (nuetrals) as well as for quicker reshipping times.

Defensive plexing alts have not kept us from taking any system we want to take, btw.


So do you think that gameplay design that encourages use of low to non-interactive throwaway alts, using negligible and easily replaceable resources is a good thing for the Warzone?

Once again creating a false population figure and resulting in less fun gameplay.

"Remedy this situation or you shall live out the rest of your life in a pain amplifier"
Master Sergeant MacRobert
Red Sky Morning
The Amarr Militia.
#55 - 2014-08-20 16:40:11 UTC
Crosi Wesdo wrote:


You keep repeating the 2 year out of date impressions you have of faction war, even in min/amarr wz im pretty confident that most system captures are being driven by actual pvp'ers. You just live in a parallel dimension where facts are invisible.



I do not think the current crop of evasion offensive plexers from the Gallente Militia in the systems around Tzvi, Sifilar, Raa and Oyeman support your assumptions.

You just left them little room to work in your own Warzone.

"Remedy this situation or you shall live out the rest of your life in a pain amplifier"
Master Sergeant MacRobert
Red Sky Morning
The Amarr Militia.
#56 - 2014-08-20 16:42:19 UTC
Crosi Wesdo wrote:


Cearain wrote:
~~But IMO~~


Any post that includes this from you is bound to be worthless.



Pretty harsh considering that every post in this thread could be tagged with a pre-cursor with exactly that quote.

"Remedy this situation or you shall live out the rest of your life in a pain amplifier"
Subsparx
Crimson Serpent Syndicate
#57 - 2014-08-20 18:06:36 UTC  |  Edited by: Subsparx
Moglarr wrote:
Subsparx wrote:
... Alternatively, instead of this cloak nerf, which did nothing whatsoever to fix the farming problem (and in fact made it worse), you could fix it just as easily by disabling entry to the plex if you have warp stabs equipped to your ship. This would likely also be much less load on the server side as it's no longer having to project out a warp scramming effect in a radius like a bubble and instead simply deny entry...


I don't like this idea, because:

Theroine wrote:
... limiting how people fit their ships and choose to play the game is a mistake in my opinion.


I agree that it is annoying that people who are in a plex aren't always waiting for a fight and some of them just want to plex. However, as someone who has at times just wanted to plex, you can't force me to fight you if I am paying attention and don't want to fight you. Just like just about every other situation in EVE. People wont take the fight if they don't think they can win and there is no point getting mad at people who have different objectives than you do.


It's not the farmers that bother me so much as the ability to play the game without paying attention. I could multibox 3 accounts and hit multiple plexes and never lose a single defensive plexing alt. How?

Because you use drone boats. You get in an Incursus, or Navy Vexor, or whatever that has drones. You go in, you move 10-20 km in whatever direction away from the warp in point so they can't hit you with stabs, and you sit there. Your drones do the work. absolutely 0 input required as they auto aggress. Somebody comes in? You warp out. You don't have to watch Dscan, you don't have to pre-align, you barely have to play at all.

That is the gameplay that drives me nuts. I had more fights with Gallente droneboats with stabs in Asakai, Teskanen and Prism leading up to the campaign for them taking the system than I ever did with combat pilots. If somebody wants to farm, and they see me on dscan, align out, and warp as soon as I land, that's fine. They are paying attention, they saw me coming, they got out. When they can sit there and watch Netflix until they hear something landing (thanks to that new popping noise from warps), and then alt tab back and warp out, it becomes an issue. I'm all for mechanics that let people run from fights when actively paying attention, but not if it let's them do so while basically not playing the game. As it stands now, I have a choice of fitting for combat and having all the stabbed guys get away, or fitting to deal with them and eventually running into a combat pilot I can no longer deal with due to being in a triple scrammed Condor or something like that. I shouldn't have to tailor my fits so that I can catch people that aren't even paying attention to the game. That's as bad as botting in my opinion.

CEO of Crimson Serpent Syndicate - www.crimsonserpent.com

Chairman of Heiian Conglomerate - www.heiian.com

Owner of FWC - www.factionwarfare.com
Moglarr
Operation Meatshield
#58 - 2014-08-20 19:34:39 UTC
Subsparx wrote:
stabbed drone boats.



I clearly need better drone and Gallente ship skills then, because I can't do that. I never even thought of AFK oplexing. I can see how that can be annoying, but overall I feel like that is more of a problem with drones as a weapon system or the plex rat AI not having a counter to drones, of course if they spit enough DPS to kill drones they could be really annoying for non drone platforms to deal with. I am seeing a growing popularity of drone boats for oplexing but that is usually because they do awesome amounts of damage with no faction ammo required.

Operation Meatshield! GETUP and fight!
X Gallentius
Black Eagle1
#59 - 2014-08-20 21:55:11 UTC
Master Sergeant MacRobert wrote:
X Gallentius wrote:
Stuff
Good Response to Stuff
Now ask yourself if timer rollbacks would "solve" the issue of afk defensive plexing alts? Answer: Not really. The only way to "stop" a defensive plexing alt is to attack the system.
X Gallentius
Black Eagle1
#60 - 2014-08-20 22:10:59 UTC
Master Sergeant MacRobert wrote:
Crosi Wesdo wrote:


You keep repeating the 2 year out of date impressions you have of faction war, even in min/amarr wz im pretty confident that most system captures are being driven by actual pvp'ers. You just live in a parallel dimension where facts are invisible.



I do not think the current crop of evasion offensive plexers from the Gallente Militia in the systems around Tzvi, Sifilar, Raa and Oyeman support your assumptions.

You just left them little room to work in your own Warzone.

The difference now is that the timescale for system flips by the "evasion alts" is much slower and puts much less stress on players who actually live in the war zone. Timer rollbacks would have the same effect, but wouldn't "solve" the problem. You might be able to argue that timer rollbacks would be worse since
1. the dps check is always applied even if the defender is not logged in, and
2. The timer doesn't run until the rat is destroyed. The "evasion plexer" can't kill a rat quickly enough before an active defender runs him out. Timer doesn't count down.

So anyways, that's the argument for no longer needing a timer rollback feature. Take it for what it's worth.