Player Features and Ideas Discussion

Time to discuss something that is often just brushed off and really not all that talked about. Its an exploit that is so common that honestly, I'm not certain whether CCP is endorsing it or just simply hasn't gotten around to fix it. The bottom line is the use of courier contracts to hide items in the cargo hold through the creation of a double wrapped courier contract IS an exploit.

To start this thread is the direct result of a petition that was made to CCP asking whether Double Wrapping courier contracts was considered an exploit or not, in which it was determined by a GM to be a non issue

For those who are less aware of the situation being discussed, this thread will go into full detail of the creation of a double wrapped courier contract, how its done, what it does, how it effects eve, and the reason it SHOULD be considered an exploit by CCP, or atleast something that needs to be fixed.

The term double wrapped courier contract refers to a courier contract in which, an already made courier contract is created and then couriered again, essentially putting a plastic wrap within a plastic warp. This differs from a normal courier contract in a very important way. In a normal courier contract, the courier itself consists of items set aside by a specific player, corporation, or Alliance, in which to be moved around high sec. A simple courier wrapped package can be scanned, and when it is scanned items inside of the courier contract will appear onto the cargo scan. In a double wrapped courier contract, the only thing that will appear on the cargo scan is the wrapped package from the initial courier contract.

This is where the exploit comes into play, it basically breaks the cargo scan mechanic, allowing people to transport items with the security of people not being able to know what is inside of the cargo. This essentially turns any active ship in the game into a blockade runner, it can be done on any ship in the game, allowing freighters to move around cargo without the disadvantages of being able to be cargo scanned by would be pirates, or war targets, or whomever has interest in knowing what they are carrying, as is their right through the cargo scan mechanic.

CCP's views, as per my petition spoken by GM Dagon are that

Removed GM Correspondence. -ISD Dorrim Barstorlode

I then responded about posting on the forums and further details on views on the topic and was encouraged to post here by GM Pyro where the community can give CCP their opinion on the matter. My view on this is very clear as it should be to anyone who has read what I just posted, double wrapping is an exploit whether you do it or not, EVEN if you don't support high sec piracy or mercenaries, you can not deny that the use of a double wrapped courier isn't a way of getting around cargo scanners, and essentially making any ship into a blockade runner.

Feel free to post your views, if you agree simply say you agree, or if you don't agree feel free to post, I just ask that no one uses the excuse of "well its always been allowed, why change it now" because that isn't a valid arguement, the mechanic is broken, and simply was never fixed. I mean realistically speaking, orca's hiding stuff in corperate hangers was an exploit but this isn't? Lets get real.

EDIT: PROBABLY THE SECOND BIGGEST POINT : In addition double wrapping packages takes away from all value of the killmail, if you kill a double wrapped courier it shows up as a 0 isk kill. Wartargets can transport things with double wrapped to avoid kills with cargo showing up on their war report.

In addition,


http://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/73995

" (We're not making any changes to plastic wrap right now, but it has significant technical issues which will likely see it being reworked at some point down the line.)"

In this dev blog, the last line talks about how courier wraps need to be redone, so it IS on CCP's agenda to fix this, now just to encourage them to fix it sooner than later.



YET another comment to add, and this one wins this forum post.

Ever try placing a can within a can? NO OBVIOUSLY you cant. WHY? Because its a Planck generator.

AND I QUOTE FROM THE ERROR MESSAGE.

"You cannot place a Planck generator container within another Planck generator, as it will cause a graviton harmonics chain reaction whose end cannot be determined."

SO WHY....

Can you put a courier within a courier?

Well obviously, it is putting a Planck generator inside of a Planck generator, and I think we have figured out what the graviton harmonics chain reaction results in, the breaking of the cargo scanning mechanic, killmails, and war reports. Thats what happens, and CCP needs to fix this.

I win. Victory is mine.

"YOU GET NOTHING, YOU LOSE!
GOOD DAY SIR!" - Willy wonka

NOW CCP FIX THIS EXPLOIT. PLEASE. :D

I agree with this message. Give us honest gankers a break.

I am not a ganker but tend to agree there is grounds for further input by CCP. Yes double wrapping is a protection against gankers...something that is plausible however, adaption of the forgotten 'Black Market Trading' skill (which is now obsolete) could be utilised instead.

Therefore, allowing pilots to at least train a skill to enable them a greater chance from being scanned. Should meet both ganker and gank targets requirements per se?

I agree, theres market for either another ship (t2 freighter with these roles) or a skill in which only part of your cargo shows up, but realistically this double wrapping is getting out of hand recently and needs to be fixed...

I didn't say that, I said you can see it is actually hauling something whereas the old fleet hangar mechanic made anything in there invisible entirely.

I acknowledge what you said, I'm simply saying it makes no difference its practically like seeing nothing at all.

Gankers aren't infinite pools of cash who gamble on ganking random people, the overall point being is its still an exploit NO ONE HERE can deny its an unintended mechanic that is being used for some players gain...

Han Solo had smuggler areas within his 'Millenium Falcon'...

The 'Black Market Trading' skill should be reintroduced, allowing a pilot a % chance of his cargo not showing on a scan. The greater the skill level trained, the greater defence against scans. CCP should also consider adding 'Smuggler' cargo expander modules. Again, the module allowing a % protection against cargo scanners.

What absolutely should be fixed is the Orca's ship maintenance bay being a safe way to transport any ships, modules or drones.

EDIT: anything in the charge category too.

My atrocious KB needs all the help it can get. CCP plz.