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Community Concerns Regarding SOMERblink

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Enaris Kerle
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#901 - 2014-08-20 10:20:51 UTC
Tao Dolcino wrote:
What about ... our dignity ?

you play eve, I think that ship may have sailed

Gallente born and raised, and tutored as a pleasure slave and courtesan to the exotic tastes of the Amarri court. Jade's career veered violently off course when a diplomatic envoy's transport was blown to pieces in mysterious circumstances and she was rescued from the escape pods by the enigmatic genetic mastermind Athule Snanm.
Drago Shouna
Doomheim
#902 - 2014-08-20 10:21:50 UTC
Sniper Smith wrote:
Thatt Guy wrote:
So since Somer can't use Eve to print RL money anymore, he closes up shop.

This should tell you all you need to know. He never cared for the community, or the players or Eve, just blinded by the almighty dollar.

To Somer:
Take your ball and go home then, may the IRS bless you with an audit.

I can't blame him for leaving.. You can argue both sides to if he crossed that vague line CCP has about when is it RMT and when isn't it.. But the simple fact is, Somer has been screwed by CCP 3 times now.

First time was the first "RMT" deal, that he did for YEARS, no complaints, then some outcry and CCP shuts it down. It's not like CCP never knew what he was doing, some covert act, he was a site advertised by CCP several times.. suddenly it was wrong.
Second time was the drama about the Scorps, and the gifts for the big celebration.. Somer didn't DO anything. Even if they asked for the stuff, which they didn't (at least not the Scorps) CCP was the one that gave it all out.
Third was this.. Was Somers proposal fake or not.. I donno.. But he asked them if it needed to go through legal, where you'd expect them to ask common sense questions like HOW are you going to set the PRICE.. Highsec Average? Jita? Monthly Average? HOW.. Basic questions. No CCP just said yes. It's fine.. and didn't even pass it by Legal. I doubt they even read the document.

I can't blame him for not wanting to deal with CCP anymore. If CCP could pull their heads out of their asses and become consistent, with some common sense questions and procedures for their actions, all of these events (and many, many others with other communities and sites) could all have been avoided.


Is Somer sponsoring your posts by any chance?

Just asking.

Solecist Project...." They refuse to play by the rules and laws of the game and use it as excuse ..." " They don't care about how you play as long as they get to play how they want."

Welcome to EVE.
Arrendis
TK Corp
#903 - 2014-08-20 10:23:09 UTC
Myriad Blaze wrote:
Maybe it's just me, but I think this is most obvious and both sides - CCP and Somer - should have avoided leaving this open.


Unless, of course, Somer wanted it open so as to justify the RMT framework.
Deka Ekato
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#904 - 2014-08-20 10:24:23 UTC
CCP Falcon wrote:
Hey guys,



In the same respect however, we believe that the promotion that caused this issue was not representative of the original proposal that was brought to CCP.



While we will be monitoring this closely, we have no intention of interfering with this process, as we feel that allowing players to be able to have their assets and / or ISK returned by SOMER Blink of their own free will is an important part of bringing this situation to a solid resolution.

We’ll have more information for you guys tomorrow, once myself and CCP Leeloo get back into the office and speak to the relevant people, including the CSM.

This remains a top priority for the community team, those involved in other parts of CCP, and the CSM.

Thanks for your patience while we work on bringing this to a close.





Note : Quote has been edited.

CCP, just a friendly reminder to do, (the right), something about Somer's RMT activity.
James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#905 - 2014-08-20 10:32:13 UTC
Adrie Atticus wrote:
This thread is the sole reason USA needs military vehicles for their police forces.

The fact that you say this, especially in the context of current events which you surely know about unless you live under a rock, is absolutely appalling.

Enjoying the rain today? ;)
James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#906 - 2014-08-20 10:34:24 UTC
Arrendis wrote:
RubyPorto wrote:
Abrazzer's post, maybe.


It was a damn good one, huh?

It made Mittens log into the forum. I'd say it was.

Enjoying the rain today? ;)
Baneken
Arctic Light Inc.
Arctic Light
#907 - 2014-08-20 10:36:20 UTC
Also should be noted that casino in any form is a scam to begin with, it's just the way that you have to run a casino to make any money out if.
Same goes for most things that are sold to us be it cars or movie tickets for the latest block busters, heck selling anything for a good profit is a scam once you spin it enough.

But all of the above have rules and those rules have to be followed or you get busted for doing so.

My initial stance which still stands to this issue (and gambling in general not just for EVE) however is that no betting or gambling should be allowed (in EVE or otherwise) but that's because my mother happens to be a gambling addict in RL and still visit her therapy group on regular basis.
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#908 - 2014-08-20 10:40:43 UTC
Baneken wrote:
My initial stance which still stands to this issue (and gambling in general not just for EVE) however is that no betting or gambling should be allowed (in EVE or otherwise) but that's because my mother happens to be a gambling addict in RL and still visit her therapy group on regular basis.


This is a ridiculous rule to even try to enforce. How is CCP going to stop two people from agreeing to give each other ISK if one team or another wins a football match? It's not even the point of this thread.

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
casperlolz
MinersOfTheWhiteflame
#909 - 2014-08-20 10:40:59 UTC
I want to say this yes I agree both sides are right, but why now, I remember a news post from CCP themselves in 2012 and did some research and found it, I will place a link on the bottom. Now I agree that They could be making real money and that can be bad, but on the other side they are following the terms buy selling time codes which was allowed by CCP. A story was told in the fanfest of 2013 about the CEO himself playing eve. He joined a miner corp and their goal was to get into battle ships. Now in eve you are going to be a pawn or a ceo of a marketing empire, To me I feel even scamming is a skill of its own, you have to find ways to make a player misread your contracts. Now we have gambling (Somer Blink) that gives a far chances for players to make profit, now yes Blink will always make profit on every bid but thats the point, players risk their ISK since day one of the game. There is a saying in eve saying never fly what you cant afford, at any point a player can steal everything, to a ship worked for months on or to a cargo ship holding 2,000 dollars worth of plex. so I ask CCP to look this over carefuly, is this really what they want to do or do they want to learn from this and better build the game. well thanks for every player or CCP that reads this I ask everyone to read every post on this form like I did no matter what side. Thank you

on bottom of the Spotlight post (thought this needed to be said before the link)
We will close this Spotlight with Somerset’s words about the EVE Community:

A community that, at its core, is comprised of a bunch of people who really love taking the sandbox building blocks, and making something larger than themselves. That is EVE for me. And that is what keeps me coming back long after missions and mining grow old.

2012 COMMUNITY SPOTLIGHT - SOMER BLINK- Link
http://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/community-spotlight-somer-blink/
Arrendis
TK Corp
#910 - 2014-08-20 10:43:16 UTC
casperlolz wrote:
I want to say this yes I agree both sides are right, but why now, I remember a news post from CCP themselves in 2012


Why now? Because Blink got caught RMTing a year after that news post (ie: last year) and got told to knock it off. Now they've been caught again. That's 'why now'.
James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#911 - 2014-08-20 10:43:34 UTC
Baneken wrote:
Also should be noted that casino in any form is a scam to begin with, it's just the way that you have to run a casino to make any money out if.
Same goes for most things that are sold to us be it cars or movie tickets for the latest block busters, heck selling anything for a good profit is a scam once you spin it enough.

But all of the above have rules and those rules have to be followed or you get busted for doing so.

My initial stance which still stands to this issue (and gambling in general not just for EVE) however is that no betting or gambling should be allowed (in EVE or otherwise) but that's because my mother happens to be a gambling addict in RL and still visit her therapy group on regular basis.

This doesn't really have anything to do with the thread.

Also taking the position that anything which is addictive should be banned (in real life or elsewhere) is absurd. Prohibitions of such behaviors are unenforceable, expensive, counterproductive, and damaging. The Prohibition in the United States proved that, and our current form of it (the War on Drugs) continues to drive the point home.

Enjoying the rain today? ;)
Baneken
Arctic Light Inc.
Arctic Light
#912 - 2014-08-20 10:44:21 UTC
Andski wrote:
Baneken wrote:
My initial stance which still stands to this issue (and gambling in general not just for EVE) however is that no betting or gambling should be allowed (in EVE or otherwise) but that's because my mother happens to be a gambling addict in RL and still visit her therapy group on regular basis.


This is a ridiculous rule to even try to enforce. How is CCP going to stop two people from agreeing to give each other ISK if one team or another wins a football match? It's not even the point of this thread.


Yes, I know quite well it cannot be enforced, shouldn't stop me from wishing it was true, now doesn't it ?
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#913 - 2014-08-20 10:46:30 UTC
Baneken wrote:
Yes, I know quite well it cannot be enforced, shouldn't stop me from wishing it was true, now doesn't it ?


I wish I had wings and could soar over the rest of the plebs but that's not going to happen so it's pointless to bring up

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
casperlolz
MinersOfTheWhiteflame
#914 - 2014-08-20 10:46:40 UTC
Arrendis wrote:
casperlolz wrote:
I want to say this yes I agree both sides are right, but why now, I remember a news post from CCP themselves in 2012


Why now? Because Blink got caught RMTing a year after that news post (ie: last year) and got told to knock it off. Now they've been caught again. That's 'why now'.


Yeah but eve let that happen with Game Time Codes
Katarina Reid
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#915 - 2014-08-20 10:47:23 UTC
CCP Falcon wrote:
Hey guys,

We’re aware that SOMER Blink has posted a message to state that their services are shutting down.

We’re also well aware that a lot of members of the community have enjoyed playing SOMER Blink over the course of the last four years, and it’s very unfortunate and saddening to see a source of enjoyment for our players closing its doors.

In the same respect however, we believe that the promotion that caused this issue was not representative of the original proposal that was brought to CCP.





They broke the rules scammed CCP and then RMT for the second time so punish them. Blink shutting them self down does not stop them from a reboot when this blows over. That is wrong if you RMT its a instant ban.
Josef Djugashvilis
#916 - 2014-08-20 10:56:33 UTC
I like the fact that SOMERblink tried to get around any problems by the use of 'clever' wording.

Did they get a lawyer to devise the wording for them?

Mittens perhaps?

The above is a joke by the way.

This is not a signature.
cpu939
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#917 - 2014-08-20 10:57:42 UTC
RMT'er should be banned, the isk removed and so on from all parties.

that said this is a hard one for ccp to deal with selling plex is allowed, with that said people should have looked at this more closely.

years go people got banned and isk removed for buying isk when jita was full of posters claiming that there isk selling site was backed by ccp. i'm not sure how i would deal with it but it need to be fair to all players even those who where banned before cos someone said it was ccp backed and it wasn't that is what looks like has happened here.

the isk amount i would take back wouldn't be the full amount it would be the extra, like i said you can sell a plex for isk.

i don't fancy being a ccp dev or gm right now.
Guillane Itaril
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#918 - 2014-08-20 10:58:08 UTC
I'm the one who started this investigation, with this post on reddit.com/r/eve 2 days ago.

Somerset Mahms continuous attempts to RMT was not the problem – His business has earned over a hundred thousand dollars from EVE thus far, of course he wants to continue.

The problem was CCP’s inability to fairly deal with this attitude, being extremely lenient with Somerset Mahm's RMT business, with no repercussions whatsoever thus far.

CCP treating important, rich players differently than 'the little guy' is what made me rage and post on reddit. They did not resolve Somer's last RMT scheme (the one shut down in October 2013) and just hoped for it to quietly go away. I didn't want that to happen this time. Let's see what will result in this time's investigation, I'm confident CCP has changed during the last year, evident by CCP Falcons posting.

Somer's ragequit and shutdown of Blink shows, that he was only in it for the money and not for the 'community' - CCP most likely told him that RMT will never be allowed again, so he shut it down.

I'm pretty happy on how this turned out. The butterfly effect is real
One post by a small player made the CSM become active. Devs got involved and alarmclocked for meetings. The executive producer herself got involved. In the end Somer ragequit and I can honestly say, that my actions had an impact on all of EVE.

In what other game would that be possible?
Arrendis
TK Corp
#919 - 2014-08-20 10:58:38 UTC
Josef Djugashvilis wrote:
I like the fact that SOMERblink tried to get around any problems by the use of 'clever' wording.

Did they get a lawyer to devise the wording for them?

Mittens perhaps?

The above is a joke by the way.


I didn't see any tildes in the proposal.
Cryo Kool
Tax Holiday
#920 - 2014-08-20 11:01:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Cryo Kool
I'd say SOMER had a fairly good idea to try and circumvent the RMT rule. There really is no way to determine if they were actually doing it on CCP's end though. It is a 2 step process: 1) create demand for GTC's by offering highest isk for the PLEX redeemed from GTC's. 2) negotiate a kickback with a GTC seller and advertise that seller. The SOMER proposal clearly states they will buy the PLEX resulting from GTC sales with ANY affiliate but we can safely assume that the bulk of those sales will be from the linked GTC seller as it would take the least effort to locate. Everything on CCP's side of the table will look above board and they could never know different. SOMERS side of the table and the deals they negotiate with the GTC affiliate are where the info we need is located to determine if it was RMT and we will never see that.

PS. This is how pachinko parlors in Japan circumvent the gambling laws. You gamble for these "prizes" and then walk around the corner to a shop that buys said prizes. The connection between that shop and the gambling establishment is where the related info can be found.