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Dev blog: Coming in Hyperion on August 26th

First post First post
Author
Kaeda Maxwell
Stay Frosty.
A Band Apart.
#121 - 2014-08-13 09:32:21 UTC
One minor concern :)

100MN meta 4 MWD would go from 720 to 360GJ for comparison T2 AB burns 352GJ.

Now obviously AB's are still scram immune, don't bloat your sig and have no innate cap penalty. And they already don't really get fitted to battleships anyway, but still you might want to also have a look at afterburners if you do this. Because I'd be very hard pressed to find a reason other then over sizing on cruisers to fit one now :)
Schmata Bastanold
In Boobiez We Trust
#122 - 2014-08-13 09:37:09 UTC
Aria Jimbojohnson wrote:
I guess they could design them to require a blinged frigate, but that would suck too because they're just be alpha thrasher magnets.


And where exactly those alpha thrashers would go after blinged frigs? I assume mission for frigs will have gate restrictions to allow only frigs otherwise what would prevent me from going with something bigger? And if frig hull on grid would be trigger for rat to appear why not frig + sentry VNI? So assuming gate restrictions only place to gank that blinged frig would be undock and last time I checked frigs align and warp out pretty fast. Also insta undock BM and I wish you good luck in catching that bling even in linked remote sebo'ed alpha thrasher. Sure, some would pop because they spend too much time exposed but those who don't pay attention deserve to be ganked as always.

Invalid signature format

Corraidhin Farsaidh
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#123 - 2014-08-13 09:59:36 UTC
Schmata Bastanold wrote:
De'Veldrin, thanks to your sig I learned today what 'corollary' means.

Now, basic set for unruly mob member (1 pitchfork + 1 torch), please.


You'll also need a hedge to be dragged through and an optional mobile gallows or stake and bushels.
Owen Levanth
Sagittarius Unlimited Exploration
#124 - 2014-08-13 10:42:01 UTC
Kaeda Maxwell wrote:
One minor concern :)

100MN meta 4 MWD would go from 720 to 360GJ for comparison T2 AB burns 352GJ.

Now obviously AB's are still scram immune, don't bloat your sig and have no innate cap penalty. And they already don't really get fitted to battleships anyway, but still you might want to also have a look at afterburners if you do this. Because I'd be very hard pressed to find a reason other then over sizing on cruisers to fit one now :)


To be honest, the existence of the MJD already killed the afterburner dead. Being 100km away from rats is better then trying to sig tank a goddamn battleship.

And then some battleships are so incredibly slow, doubling your speed doesn't do much. If you have good skills and use a dead space afterburner, you could come close to three times your normal speed and that's sometimes still slower then normal speed on some cruisers. At that point a MJD is still faster, even with a three-minute-wait time inbetween jumps.

There might be some edge cases in PVP, though. Maybe helping shield-tanking battleships survive more bombing runs or something?
Owen Levanth
Sagittarius Unlimited Exploration
#125 - 2014-08-13 10:47:27 UTC  |  Edited by: Owen Levanth
Schmata Bastanold wrote:
Aria Jimbojohnson wrote:
I guess they could design them to require a blinged frigate, but that would suck too because they're just be alpha thrasher magnets.


And where exactly those alpha thrashers would go after blinged frigs? I assume mission for frigs will have gate restrictions to allow only frigs otherwise what would prevent me from going with something bigger? And if frig hull on grid would be trigger for rat to appear why not frig + sentry VNI? So assuming gate restrictions only place to gank that blinged frig would be undock and last time I checked frigs align and warp out pretty fast. Also insta undock BM and I wish you good luck in catching that bling even in linked remote sebo'ed alpha thrasher. Sure, some would pop because they spend too much time exposed but those who don't pay attention deserve to be ganked as always.


As someone who occasionally does PVP with frigs in FW, it is possible to catch frigs, even when one side tries to avoid you actively. It happens all the time and is quite common, even.

So no, as soon as a mission happens outside of HighSec, good hunting. HighSec is different of course, since there aren't many frigates which can gank another frigate and none of them are cheap enough for ganks, since they would've to be as blingy as the mission running frigate in the first place to get them before CONCORD arrives. Nothing is preventing gankers from trying to play with aggresson mechanics, however. Pirate

Which is good, when both sides are in frigates, the playing field is a lot more level and some honest PVP may occur.

Now in HighSec, the greatest danger for frigs would be the rats themselves, especially since a mission runner can't just MJD 100km away and plink them to death with his cruise missile Raven. A mission runner has to be a bit more proactive here. Big smile
Owen Levanth
Sagittarius Unlimited Exploration
#126 - 2014-08-13 10:53:42 UTC
Aria Jimbojohnson wrote:
Initially I was really excited about the new level 4 missions, as a more PVP-like way to make ISK would be nice. However, after thinking about it a bit, I have no real hopes for it being done well. I don't see how they plan to balance missions doable in frigates; either the rewards will be terrible, or you're basically getting an ISK printing machine that can be done in a ship that's worth under 10 mil. Neither option sounds like a good thing. I guess they could design them to require a blinged frigate, but that would suck too because they're just be alpha thrasher magnets. Bleh, guess I'll wait for the dev blog, but I'm not really feeling optimistic at this point.


I'm pretty sure they didn't have T1 frigates in mind, so no ship will be worth less then 10 million ISK. The cheapest T2 frigate alone costs almost twice as much and with a proper T2 fit, the price could easily double. And faction frigates go up to prices comparable to T2 cruisers and T1 battleships (I'm looking at you, Garmur).

Also, frigates are still flimsy enough you would occasionally lose a ship. Contrast this with L4 missions run with battleships: After a certain point, no enemy can even touch you. I remember doing missions with dozens of frigates, cruisers and battleships and no ship ever coming close enough to even shoot at me. This is luckily not possible with a frigate.
Claud Tiberius
#127 - 2014-08-13 11:50:05 UTC
Not very excited about the Hyperion release (most of it doesn't effect me).

Exceptions being for the new mission type, that sounds interesting. And the reduced cap cost on 100MW I will look forward to when using my BS.

Still feels underwhelming.

Once upon a time the Golem had a Raven hull and it looked good. Then it transformed into a plataduck. The end.

Schmata Bastanold
In Boobiez We Trust
#128 - 2014-08-13 12:05:16 UTC
Kaeda Maxwell wrote:
One minor concern :)


I also have one but major concern:
Geezus my sweet frakking god, what have you done to your face, gurl???

Invalid signature format

Ocih
Space Mermaids
#129 - 2014-08-13 12:43:06 UTC
Kaeda Maxwell wrote:
One minor concern :)

100MN meta 4 MWD would go from 720 to 360GJ for comparison T2 AB burns 352GJ.

Now obviously AB's are still scram immune, don't bloat your sig and have no innate cap penalty. And they already don't really get fitted to battleships anyway, but still you might want to also have a look at afterburners if you do this. Because I'd be very hard pressed to find a reason other then over sizing on cruisers to fit one now :)


Sig bloat will be the PvP killer for anyone in a battleship.

MWD Domi has more sig rad than an Archon so alpha popping them with Capitals will be a thing again.
Carniflex
StarHunt
Mordus Angels
#130 - 2014-08-13 15:47:43 UTC
Kaeda Maxwell wrote:
One minor concern :)

100MN meta 4 MWD would go from 720 to 360GJ for comparison T2 AB burns 352GJ.

Now obviously AB's are still scram immune, don't bloat your sig and have no innate cap penalty. And they already don't really get fitted to battleships anyway, but still you might want to also have a look at afterburners if you do this. Because I'd be very hard pressed to find a reason other then over sizing on cruisers to fit one now :)


The Afterburner takes also approx 25 less CPU. That can be quite a relevant amount of it in some fits.

Here, sanity... niiiice sanity, come to daddy... okay, that's a good sanity... THWONK! GOT the bastard.

Carniflex
StarHunt
Mordus Angels
#131 - 2014-08-13 15:57:11 UTC
Owen Levanth wrote:
Aria Jimbojohnson wrote:
Initially I was really excited about the new level 4 missions, as a more PVP-like way to make ISK would be nice. However, after thinking about it a bit, I have no real hopes for it being done well. I don't see how they plan to balance missions doable in frigates; either the rewards will be terrible, or you're basically getting an ISK printing machine that can be done in a ship that's worth under 10 mil. Neither option sounds like a good thing. I guess they could design them to require a blinged frigate, but that would suck too because they're just be alpha thrasher magnets. Bleh, guess I'll wait for the dev blog, but I'm not really feeling optimistic at this point.


I'm pretty sure they didn't have T1 frigates in mind, so no ship will be worth less then 10 million ISK. The cheapest T2 frigate alone costs almost twice as much and with a proper T2 fit, the price could easily double. And faction frigates go up to prices comparable to T2 cruisers and T1 battleships (I'm looking at you, Garmur).

Also, frigates are still flimsy enough you would occasionally lose a ship. Contrast this with L4 missions run with battleships: After a certain point, no enemy can even touch you. I remember doing missions with dozens of frigates, cruisers and battleships and no ship ever coming close enough to even shoot at me. This is luckily not possible with a frigate.


My usual FW farming bombers cost approx 50 mil/pop. I do lose them occasionally (on alt). In hi sec, if the rewards are good enough I might actually put some bling on them. A faction fitted AF with links in system can do pretty sick things.

As far as L4 missions being "totally safe". Depends really - I have lost far more ships in hi sec lev 4 missions over the past 5 years than doing PvE in null sec. Including, for example, a Drake with proper hardeners with max skill Scimi boosting it with everything it got. That is btw equivalent of running four T2 XL boosters locally. Existing L4 missions do have some quite spectacular tripwires in them and can kill quite blingy ships if you mess up. That drake btw had 6 points on it when it pulled the full stage agro and had still 3 points left on it when it went down.

Here, sanity... niiiice sanity, come to daddy... okay, that's a good sanity... THWONK! GOT the bastard.

Lady Rift
His Majesty's Privateers
#132 - 2014-08-13 18:03:23 UTC
Owen Levanth wrote:
Aria Jimbojohnson wrote:
Initially I was really excited about the new level 4 missions, as a more PVP-like way to make ISK would be nice. However, after thinking about it a bit, I have no real hopes for it being done well. I don't see how they plan to balance missions doable in frigates; either the rewards will be terrible, or you're basically getting an ISK printing machine that can be done in a ship that's worth under 10 mil. Neither option sounds like a good thing. I guess they could design them to require a blinged frigate, but that would suck too because they're just be alpha thrasher magnets. Bleh, guess I'll wait for the dev blog, but I'm not really feeling optimistic at this point.


I'm pretty sure they didn't have T1 frigates in mind, so no ship will be worth less then 10 million ISK. The cheapest T2 frigate alone costs almost twice as much and with a proper T2 fit, the price could easily double. And faction frigates go up to prices comparable to T2 cruisers and T1 battleships (I'm looking at you, Garmur).

Also, frigates are still flimsy enough you would occasionally lose a ship. Contrast this with L4 missions run with battleships: After a certain point, no enemy can even touch you. I remember doing missions with dozens of frigates, cruisers and battleships and no ship ever coming close enough to even shoot at me. This is luckily not possible with a frigate.



links will either break the new missions or be required to run them. If they are 1v1 it gets worst as some assault frigs get very good active tanks for very little isk.

Lv 4's are only hard if you go in willy-nilly and pop all the triggers at the same time.
Galmas
United System's Commonwealth
#133 - 2014-08-13 19:43:34 UTC
Oh dear, the wormhole mass-spawn range thing still seems to be there. I hope we can get rid of it before the expansion goes live. I've somehow got the feeling that in that particular feedback thread almost nobody liked it even a bit.
Owen Levanth
Sagittarius Unlimited Exploration
#134 - 2014-08-13 22:55:15 UTC
Carniflex wrote:
Owen Levanth wrote:
Aria Jimbojohnson wrote:
Initially I was really excited about the new level 4 missions, as a more PVP-like way to make ISK would be nice. However, after thinking about it a bit, I have no real hopes for it being done well. I don't see how they plan to balance missions doable in frigates; either the rewards will be terrible, or you're basically getting an ISK printing machine that can be done in a ship that's worth under 10 mil. Neither option sounds like a good thing. I guess they could design them to require a blinged frigate, but that would suck too because they're just be alpha thrasher magnets. Bleh, guess I'll wait for the dev blog, but I'm not really feeling optimistic at this point.


I'm pretty sure they didn't have T1 frigates in mind, so no ship will be worth less then 10 million ISK. The cheapest T2 frigate alone costs almost twice as much and with a proper T2 fit, the price could easily double. And faction frigates go up to prices comparable to T2 cruisers and T1 battleships (I'm looking at you, Garmur).

Also, frigates are still flimsy enough you would occasionally lose a ship. Contrast this with L4 missions run with battleships: After a certain point, no enemy can even touch you. I remember doing missions with dozens of frigates, cruisers and battleships and no ship ever coming close enough to even shoot at me. This is luckily not possible with a frigate.


My usual FW farming bombers cost approx 50 mil/pop. I do lose them occasionally (on alt). In hi sec, if the rewards are good enough I might actually put some bling on them. A faction fitted AF with links in system can do pretty sick things.

As far as L4 missions being "totally safe". Depends really - I have lost far more ships in hi sec lev 4 missions over the past 5 years than doing PvE in null sec. Including, for example, a Drake with proper hardeners with max skill Scimi boosting it with everything it got. That is btw equivalent of running four T2 XL boosters locally. Existing L4 missions do have some quite spectacular tripwires in them and can kill quite blingy ships if you mess up. That drake btw had 6 points on it when it pulled the full stage agro and had still 3 points left on it when it went down.


Yeah well, different people have different experiences. I for example never lost a battleship in a mission. I lost a lot of battlecruisers doing stupid **** in DED-complexes, however.

My secret for doing L4s always was being 100-200km away and hitting the MJD when ships came close enough to actually hit my ship. Zero losses in ships, but much of my life time was spend uselessly waiting around to re-target ewar-ships 150km away. It's a toss up to decide what's worse. Lol
Etara Silverblade
Morex Group Inc.
Haven.
#135 - 2014-08-14 07:27:15 UTC
I do like the new release schedule but was hoping to see some things fixed that Crius messed up. I haven't played much since the release because of it.
Schmata Bastanold
In Boobiez We Trust
#136 - 2014-08-14 13:59:39 UTC
Excited about today live stream where devs will say a lot of nothing...

Where's that damn devblog about new L4s?

GIMME NAOW!

pliiiiiizzzz...

Invalid signature format

adriaans
Ankaa.
Nair Al-Zaurak
#137 - 2014-08-14 14:21:30 UTC
Lady Rift wrote:
Owen Levanth wrote:
Aria Jimbojohnson wrote:
Initially I was really excited about the new level 4 missions, as a more PVP-like way to make ISK would be nice. However, after thinking about it a bit, I have no real hopes for it being done well. I don't see how they plan to balance missions doable in frigates; either the rewards will be terrible, or you're basically getting an ISK printing machine that can be done in a ship that's worth under 10 mil. Neither option sounds like a good thing. I guess they could design them to require a blinged frigate, but that would suck too because they're just be alpha thrasher magnets. Bleh, guess I'll wait for the dev blog, but I'm not really feeling optimistic at this point.


I'm pretty sure they didn't have T1 frigates in mind, so no ship will be worth less then 10 million ISK. The cheapest T2 frigate alone costs almost twice as much and with a proper T2 fit, the price could easily double. And faction frigates go up to prices comparable to T2 cruisers and T1 battleships (I'm looking at you, Garmur).

Also, frigates are still flimsy enough you would occasionally lose a ship. Contrast this with L4 missions run with battleships: After a certain point, no enemy can even touch you. I remember doing missions with dozens of frigates, cruisers and battleships and no ship ever coming close enough to even shoot at me. This is luckily not possible with a frigate.



links will either break the new missions or be required to run them. If they are 1v1 it gets worst as some assault frigs get very good active tanks for very little isk.

Lv 4's are only hard if you go in willy-nilly and pop all the triggers at the same time.



Hopefully maybe they add a way to disable links in them, that would go a good way to make things interesting. Even better if they are low-sec based. Frigate pvp is fun.

----True oldschool solo pvp'er---- My latest vid: Insanity IV

Lucas Quaan
DEMONS OF THE HIDDEN MIST
TRUTH. HONOUR. LIGHT.
#138 - 2014-08-14 15:21:29 UTC
Dev Blog full of awesome wrote:
Lowered activation cost for 100MN Micro Warp Drives
Capacitor activation cost is cut in half for all 100MN Micro Warp Drives.

Now don't get any more ideas about making the Tempest and armour ship, ok?
Dersen Lowery
The Scope
#139 - 2014-08-14 15:21:51 UTC
adriaans wrote:
Hopefully maybe they add a way to disable links in them, that would go a good way to make things interesting. Even better if they are low-sec based. Frigate pvp is fun.


Now there's an idea: links don't work in deadspace ("that's why they call it dead"). Suddenly, beyond more easily balanced PVE, you have the option of introducing deadspace-for-its-own-sake as a terrain option for PVP.

The only downside, which I admit is not much of one, is that it's fun to link the daylights out of newbies in their little ships and watch their glee as they motor around like bosses in a mission they'd have no hope of running otherwise.

Proud founder and member of the Belligerent Desirables.

I voted in CSM X!

Hra Neuvosto
Party Cat Enterprises
#140 - 2014-08-16 12:58:26 UTC
Tarpedo wrote:
Glass helmets are the most important part of this patch. People asked for them since their removal in Incarna.

Next up: quafe station interior and transparent gallente suits.