EVE General Discussion

At any rate, foxfour posted in the reddit thread, so someone at CCP noticed the concern and will hopefully address it soon.

So, if what james & co say is true, it implies several things.

First, you have to understand that siphons were quite literally the first and only real tool ccp ever gave to smaller entities to screw larger entities. And it worked, kinda. You can find posts from every major alliance, but goonswarm and PL in particular have quite a few bitching about the little things. Both organizations instituted policy specifically to deal with siphons.

Second, removing the immunity to api detection basically castrates the bloody thing. The point of the thing was that you needed people in space to know if you were being siphoned. No people = no intel = your goo gets jacked. Since the blocs have way more space than they ever use, this makes siphons an ideal tool against them, again assuming no api detection. It also *may* explain why we've been able to siphon goo off with impunity off of the shittier (aka non-goonswarm) cfc entities but any siphon operations on goonswarm towers are quickly shut down outside of a particular time bracket.

Third, backtracking on the api detection represents a full cave-in to the whims of the blocs. This was the first and only thing that could actually f*ck blocs a tiny bit that they themselves can't use. Goons and PL don't siphon, because in most cases doing so would violate their existing treaties. But goons (and to a lesser extent PL) were most of the people that opposed siphons.

If true, to me it sends the message that CCP will cater to the whims of the blocs on just about every f*cking issue under the sun, even when that issue is specifically designed to hurt said blocs (a tiny bit). Further, because CCP themselves suggested the API immunity, it means they damn well understand what happens if you don't have said api immunity. And that just makes it shittier

So, if what james & co say is true, it would pi*ss me off something fierce, and it would disappoint a whole lot of the player base.

And, as such, was born out of the half baked ideas and plaintive wails of the have-nots, frustrated with their own impotence on the large scale.

It is literally the anklebiting module. All of Dinsdales crying given form. Much like the ESS, another excellent example of flawed conceptualization.

So yeah, I have absolutely no sympathy if it turns out that it doesn't work.

In my own humble opinion it is a far, far better thing to be an anklebiter than dude #53,221 that joins the winning side because he wants to think he's winning too. Eve is in stagnation in no small part because of people that represent the latter. And that applies to BOTH the CFC and N3PL.

And the siphon does work if it has api immunity. Because than you need people, or a the every least alts spread across all of your space. And that takes ~effort~

I disagree. At least so far as one person is doing what they want to do to have fun, and the other is spitting vitriol at them out of envy, rather than just go and have fun themselves.

One of those kind of people is just fine, playing the game. The other is a bitter waste of a subscription fee.





And the reason we're here in the first place is because this is either impossible, if they intended to do it, or unwanted, if they intended to not do it.



Defending the siphon, a zero effort way of taking what others have earned, is not a great time to bring up ~effort~.

HAHAH as if you need to look at api. if you see one of these on scanner in a friendly system its probably a bad guy one so you shoot it.

Now if they did'nt show on dscan they may actually work.

Just remove siphons from API, notifications (not sure, if they get a notification) and d-scan.

Would require you to actually be on-grid to see them. Then maybe, the siphon would be an interesting little thing.

But yeah, I have no idea what I'm talking about and never really use them, besides the occasional I steal from in space.

If you think that the people who "grr nullsec" day in and day out do it because they enjoy fighting the most people, you're the one making assumptions.

There are no grapes more sour than the have-nots.



Mines can be used for camping, like you would not even imagine. They used to exist, by the way, and they got turned into the current drone system since they were such an awful idea. Sometimes you can buy space mines as an old legacy item, but they don't do anything anymore.

As for tunnels, you have cloaking devices and you have cynos to move around with. You also have wormholes.

But what it all boils down to is that organization > no organization. The fact of the matter is that no outside force worth even a tenth of a damn has bothered to put in the effort to try and fight the nullsec blocs in years. The last group to actually do it were the Goons themselves, back in the heyday of BoB and the great war.

So what you really have is people who want to win without having to put in anywhere close to as much effort or organization as their opponent. That will never happen.

And that's not going to change any time soon, nor should it.

In the sandbox, there's no right or wrong. Some people like to play Don Quijote just for fun.

The siphon is not a zero effort way of taking what others have earned. You have to buy the thing and bring it to a tower which is more effort than I was ready to put in...

Basically I'm shooting down the arguments of anyone calling for bans by saying that yes, both everyone in nullsec using towers & CCP have been aware of this since week 1. It's business as usual for the former & the latter don't really seem to care.