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Request for a clone swap POS module for Hyperion release.
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Jack Miton
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#21 - 2014-08-08 13:27:34 UTC
Rek Seven wrote:
The people who are against this never have a good argument that counter the benefits of this feature.

the only benefit of this feature is that you dont lose as much isk when you die...
it makes it way too easy to exploit WH anomalies and means people can be at zero risk of losing implants when PVPing and then plug their virtue/crystals back in for scanning or PVE.
it's purely something for risk averse people, there's no way around that fact.

There is no Bob.

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Phoenix Jones
Small-Arms Fire
#22 - 2014-08-08 13:42:15 UTC
Jack Miton wrote:
Rek Seven wrote:
The people who are against this never have a good argument that counter the benefits of this feature.

the only benefit of this feature is that you dont lose as much isk when you die...
it makes it way too easy to exploit WH anomalies and means people can be at zero risk of losing implants when PVPing and then plug their virtue/crystals back in for scanning or PVE.
it's purely something for risk averse people, there's no way around that fact.


That is a valid point, and many would do that.

Many would also consider bringing their clones into the wormhole itself as it would be more "useful' when here VS going to the ends of Kspace to jump into a clone. Fact is I want people to bring in more implanted clones into wormhole space. I also want them to make a choice regarding "which" one they will use for a specific task just like we make a choice regarding which ship we'll bring in.

Would people do the above setup you suggested? Yes they would. Would they be able to do that repeatedly in 1 day? No, as I asked for the jump clone timer to initiate whenever a person swaps clones (so at most they can swap clones once every 19 hours on a maxed skill char).

It is both a creature comfort nobody in wormhole space has never been afforded, but it is also a potential kill pinata having something like this mobile structure destroyable and those people who decided to bring in their crystal set and store it in there be at risk for an eviction. I do not want this to be some "freebie" thing for wormholers. I want this to give people the opportunity to try out new methods and meta's, while keeping higher end clones virtually "stuck" inside of a pos, at danger of being oblitherated if some other wormhole entity decides to go after them.

Yaay!!!!
Rek Seven
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#23 - 2014-08-08 14:21:11 UTC  |  Edited by: Rek Seven
Jack Miton wrote:
Rek Seven wrote:
The people who are against this never have a good argument that counter the benefits of this feature.

the only benefit of this feature is that you dont lose as much isk when you die...
it makes it way too easy to exploit WH anomalies and means people can be at zero risk of losing implants when PVPing and then plug their virtue/crystals back in for scanning or PVE.
it's purely something for risk averse people, there's no way around that fact.


That's one benefit not the only, as we have discussed before... Phoenix Jones gets it.

The wishlist is pretty much complete...
Alundil
Rolled Out
#24 - 2014-08-08 14:24:37 UTC
+1

I support this (having suggested a similar idea (#2) some time back) and this would make fights in wspace more likely to happen, not less.

I'm right behind you
Traba Regina
Serene Vendetta
#25 - 2014-08-08 18:49:30 UTC
This is a necessity if we're going to be involved in these small ship skirmishes. +1

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=5171792#post5171792
Verran Skarne
4 Marketeers
#26 - 2014-08-08 19:46:40 UTC
+1. Especially if you can do it with a Rorqual. Those ships need a purpose again.
Saisin
Chao3's Rogue Operatives Corp
#27 - 2014-08-08 20:58:52 UTC
Jack Miton wrote:
Do not want.
I realize that I'm in the minority on this but I still hate this idea.
It makes WHs more and more like kspace which is something im never going to get behind.

Do not want either. Implants are close enough to pay-to-win, and should be a huge risk to take in WH space.

Vote Borat Guereen for CSM XII

Check out the Minarchist Space Project
GetHighNow
Perkone
Caldari State
#28 - 2014-08-08 22:33:03 UTC
WH0RE Approves this message
Var D'ovoli
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#29 - 2014-08-08 22:33:15 UTC
Jez Amatin wrote:
Phoenix Jones wrote:

Basic request would be a module in a pos that can store one "clone" for a pilot. If people want to store more than one clone, they need another module.

People cannot jump clone to these.
Swapping a clone enables your jump clone cooldown.
Directors and CEOs cannot remove or destroy clones (functions just like the personal storage array).
If these modules are destroyed, the killmail lists all the clones and implants destroyed.


Nice idea +1, but I'm not sure about some of the limitations suggested.

Directors and CEO's cannot remove... - so what do you do if the guy leaves the corp, are you stuck with his clones? I'd say dirs / ceo should be able to destroy clones to free up space for new peeps.

A limitation of one clone per pilot is fine, but does that mean one module per person living in POS? I'm fine with being limited to storing one clone per person... but I would prefer having one module to store all people living in POS (as in each hangar, which i think is max 7 for CHA). I guess it depends on CPU / PG reqs on POS, and also on whether you want more structures to shoot at in a pos.


+1 great ideas
Rroff
Antagonistic Tendencies
#30 - 2014-08-09 02:15:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Rroff
People would point and laugh if someone fitted officer mods to a frig for a disposable roam, yet often the same people are against being able to clone swap into something more appropriate for that kind of action :s

Not bothered by the risk or isk side myself but its not in my nature to treat things as disposable in that way not to mention can completely tip the balance in the isk war of a fight while in many cases bringing nothing to the fight (which again is likely to get people pointing and laughing and the ire of your CEO).

Given the assumption that someone plugged an expensive implant set in to actually use when the appropriate time came i.e. when in a capital in pvp you can hardly call them risk averse or do we call everyone risk averse if they don't do headlong stupid things?
Xuixien
Solar Winds Security Solutions
#31 - 2014-08-09 02:57:33 UTC
+1

You make the clones at the Rorqual and store them in a "Mobile Clone Reanimation Unit". You can update your clones here and jump between them (with the cooldown from skills). This is vitally needed. Really it's been my only complaint about WH quality of life.

Epic Space Cat, Horsegirl, Philanthropist
Lajos Perseus
False Profits
#32 - 2014-08-09 03:30:36 UTC
We were just talking about this last night on comms. I believe this is something that should seriously be looked at by ccp. Why can't we have a mobile clone storage array. Make the cool down a bit longer though as a luxury for using it.
Kirasten
Perkone
Caldari State
#33 - 2014-08-09 06:35:47 UTC
+1
Orange Aideron
Voidlings
V0IDLINGS
#34 - 2014-08-09 06:57:22 UTC
+1 good idea. Pro's outway cons.
Kireitsugu Secheh
Les chips electriques
#35 - 2014-08-09 08:12:02 UTC
Okay, i think people doesnt know that but i'll tell all of you the simple way to get a clone without implants in your pos

Step 1: If you are in a C4-C6 wh, go to a C1-C3 .
Step 2: Go to k space
Step 3: Find a station, install a jump clone
Step 4: Find another station, and jump to the clone created in Step 3
Step 5: Go back to your wspace

How to clone swap in worm holes
Aiyshimin
Shiva Furnace
#36 - 2014-08-09 09:28:15 UTC
Implants actually have a significant effect in small ship fights as well, and you are much better equipped to get out of bubbles than when sitting in a capital. Losing or winning a fight is also not dependant on ship class. I get the feeling that most people here only fight when they are guaranteed to win, and that they fear always losing in smaller ships.

Lack of clone swapping in wormholes has not and will not affect my decisions about ship choices for a roam, if there's fun to be had I'm in.
Alundil
Rolled Out
#37 - 2014-08-09 14:04:51 UTC
Rroff wrote:


Given the assumption that someone plugged an expensive implant set in to actually use when the appropriate time came i.e. when in a capital in pvp you can hardly call them risk averse or do we call everyone risk averse if they don't do headlong stupid things?


This appears to be exactly the case. The chest beating over choice to waste or not to waste and the implication that those who would choose not to waste being risk averse.

It's a slightly derpy position since it would mean many who risk (and die) those same ships and implants daily in cruisers etc and who are therefore not risk averse are labeled risk averse over wanting the choice to not stupidly fly virtues(for example) in squishy combat ships (any frigate) in the land of HIC/dic bubbles.

But such is Eve where HTFU is the mantra even when it's dumb.

I'm right behind you
T0SHI KONI
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#38 - 2014-08-09 22:28:13 UTC
Xe'Cara'eos wrote:
my 0.02 isk - as long as you can't jump from k-space to W-space or from W-space to k-space, I like this idea.


To take this a step further, you shouldn't be allowed to jump between different Wspace systems or even different POSes in the same system. This only allows you to swap heads at the particular POS that the modual is at.
Rroff
Antagonistic Tendencies
#39 - 2014-08-09 22:34:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Rroff
T0SHI KONI wrote:
Xe'Cara'eos wrote:
my 0.02 isk - as long as you can't jump from k-space to W-space or from W-space to k-space, I like this idea.


To take this a step further, you shouldn't be allowed to jump between different Wspace systems or even different POSes in the same system. This only allows you to swap heads at the particular POS that the modual is at.


It doesn't really need to be complicated at all as I see it for most uses this would cover it:

+If your 24 hour* clone jump timer isn't in effect
+Pause training
+Right click on POS control tower, select swap clone
+Implants stored on POS are swapped with your current ones, 24 hour cooldown timer starts as per normal clone jump
+Resume training
+24 hours* later if you want, repeat to get back to the original implant set

If its the first time doing it you basically store current implants and end up in a blank clone - so plug in the extra implants you brought with you if applicable.

+If the POS is RF'd all stored implants are locked.
+If the POS is popped all currently stored implants show as per container items on the killmail

No jumping between systems or POSes permitted.

Technical issues aside uncomplicated and relatively simple.



* Or whatever cool down time your skills allow for.
Mr Floydy
Questionable Ethics.
Ministry of Inappropriate Footwork
#40 - 2014-08-09 23:02:02 UTC
I'm for this change. However Jack Miton does make a solid point that it's for risk adverse who don't want nasty pod losses when pvping....
Guess I'm risk adverse!
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