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PVP Solo Missions

First post
Author
Bullock Brawn
Doomheim
#1 - 2014-08-08 17:16:16 UTC  |  Edited by: Bullock Brawn
Shoot me down, or thumbs me up..... either way.... I want it.

I solo game play, but I like being a part of the big picture universe.

Problem:
1) I can't join a player corp and be a good team player due to family life timing. Can't be on a certain time as others.
2) I can't use a microphone because my wife and kids are sitting next to me in our media room making noise and being a family.
3) I like a challenge, but it should be reasonable and have a attempt at balance. PVP as is, is not interesting to me at all due to the random nature of finding a fair challenge.
4) I get bored with PVE content.

Solution:
1) PVP Balanced Missions. (All boosts and fleet adds are void, like Incursion areas. Can't be in a fleet)

a) Single Deadspace pocket. Different Gates and only combatants are allowed in.
b) Different Ship levels. I.E...T1 Frigates, Destroyers, Cruisers, etc.. for different mission levels.
c) You can't get into the pocket with Cruiser, if it's for Frigates.
d) Each player puts up a stake to play. Level 1 = 5m, Level 2 = 10m, etc..
e) Once a player accept the Mission at the station, they have X number of minutes to enter the pocket, once both players accept. If they don't make it in time, the forfeit the pot.
f) Winner gets to loot the wreck.
g) No pod kills or it's concord time.
h) Risk Faction mods if you got them, if that's your thing...just the ship hull is the limiting factor. I won't go in with a ship I can't afford to lose. Level 4 Missions for example would allow any ship type in the gate and have a stake of 50m to pony up. So 100m Pot, plus Loot. level 1 missions would only allow frigates to enter gate.
i) Mission spawn is in High Sec to keep it fair.

This would fix the game for me.

Big smile Give me a reason to PVP and I'm in. If I lose, which will be often, I will have a great time and most likely learn something.
epicurus ataraxia
Illusion of Solitude.
Illusion of Solitude
#2 - 2014-08-08 17:23:11 UTC  |  Edited by: epicurus ataraxia
Bullock Brawn wrote:
Shoot me down, or thumbs me up..... either way.... I want it.

I solo game play, but I like being a part of the big picture universe.

Problem:
1) I can't join a player corp and be a good team player due to family life timing. Can't be on a certain time as others.
2) I can't use a microphone because my wife and kids are sitting next to me in our media room making noise and being a family.
3) I like a challenge, but it should be reasonable and have a attempt at balance. PVP as is, is not interesting to me at all due to the random nature of finding a fair challenge.
4) I get bored with PVE content.

Solution:
1) PVP Balanced Missions. (All boosts and fleet adds are void, like Incursion areas. Can't be in a fleet)

a) Single Deadspace pocket. Different Gates and only combatants are allowed in.
b) Different Ship levels. I.E...T1 Frigates, Destroyers, Cruisers, etc.. for different mission levels.
c) You can't get into the pocket with Cruiser, if it's for Frigates.
d) Each player puts up a stake to play. Could be a 5m ISK reward to winner or 100m reward. Higher stakes make it more fun.
e) Once a player accept the Mission at the station, they have X number of minutes to enter the pocket, once both players accept. If they don't make it in time, the forfeit the pot.
f) Winner gets to loot the wreck.
g) No pod kills or it's concord time.
h) Risk Faction mods if you got them, if that's your thing...just the ship hull is the limiting factor. I won't go in with a ship I can't afford to lose.
i) Mission spawn is in High Sec to keep it fair.

This would fix the game for me.

Big smile Give me a reason to PVP and I'm in. If I lose, which will be often, I will have a great time and most likely learn something.


Whilst I see no reason why it should not be, I have to raise the following points.
Who will actually do these? Naturally highly skilled players will win, and less so will not. Does it actually mean that people will do it?
Now countering that, anyone will risk a couple of million on a t1 fit frigate, so if it was limited to T1 and meta fit ships, hell why not, one might get lucky! I think we'd all play that from time to time.

Once you get into bling, its just rich noob farming unlimited. We all know that someone will believe that all purple fittings on an Atron is just going to win! Right?Roll

So tl;dr could be fun if limited to cheap fits, t1 ships and T1 and meta only, otherwise it would just not be desired useful or pleasant.

There is one EvE. Many people. Many lifestyles. WE are EvE

Bullock Brawn
Doomheim
#3 - 2014-08-08 17:27:32 UTC
I'm not smart enough in EVE to know the Facton Mod mechanics and how much they improve the win, but it would be perfectly acceptable to limit the field to

T1 and Meta mod fits only.

As long as there's an equal opportunity for both players to gear up.

It doesn't take that long to skill a frigate toon to be effective for T1 fits.

I want this .......Twisted
Bogna Markowska
Jeb z Dzidy
#4 - 2014-08-08 17:32:05 UTC
epicurus ataraxia wrote:
Bullock Brawn wrote:
Shoot me down, or thumbs me up..... either way.... I want it.

I solo game play, but I like being a part of the big picture universe.

Problem:
1) I can't join a player corp and be a good team player due to family life timing. Can't be on a certain time as others.
2) I can't use a microphone because my wife and kids are sitting next to me in our media room making noise and being a family.
3) I like a challenge, but it should be reasonable and have a attempt at balance. PVP as is, is not interesting to me at all due to the random nature of finding a fair challenge.
4) I get bored with PVE content.

Solution:
1) PVP Balanced Missions. (All boosts and fleet adds are void, like Incursion areas. Can't be in a fleet)

a) Single Deadspace pocket. Different Gates and only combatants are allowed in.
b) Different Ship levels. I.E...T1 Frigates, Destroyers, Cruisers, etc.. for different mission levels.
c) You can't get into the pocket with Cruiser, if it's for Frigates.
d) Each player puts up a stake to play. Could be a 5m ISK reward to winner or 100m reward. Higher stakes make it more fun.
e) Once a player accept the Mission at the station, they have X number of minutes to enter the pocket, once both players accept. If they don't make it in time, the forfeit the pot.
f) Winner gets to loot the wreck.
g) No pod kills or it's concord time.
h) Risk Faction mods if you got them, if that's your thing...just the ship hull is the limiting factor. I won't go in with a ship I can't afford to lose.
i) Mission spawn is in High Sec to keep it fair.

This would fix the game for me.

Big smile Give me a reason to PVP and I'm in. If I lose, which will be often, I will have a great time and most likely learn something.


Whilst I see no reason why it should not be, I have to raise the following points.
Who will actually do these? Naturally highly skilled players will win, and less so will not. Does it actually mean that people will do it?
Now anyone will risk a couple of million on a t1 fit frigate, so if it was limited to T1 and meta fit ships, hell why not, one might get lucky!

Once you get into bling, its just rich noob farming unlimited. We all know that someone will believe that all purple fittings on an Atron is just going to win! Right?Roll

So tl;dr could be fun if limited to cheap fits, t1 ships and T1 and meta only, otherwise it would just not be desired useful or pleasant.




well i'm all for it but it should not be limited to t1 ships just make it aviable to all types
and make it not set ship type but max ship type that u can go in a cruser to a bs mission then to balance it t2 and t3 should be consider 1 and 2 tier highter
t2 cruser as a BC and t3 cruser as BS and so on

it won't allways be the more expensive fit win cause of the way eve is set up (that there is counter to everything)
it can hapent that a (relative) noob get a exact counter to a vet whith a faction fit and kill it.
as allways going blink is help but don't meen insta win.

if that is implemented and actualy works maybe then try to expand it to 2v2 or even more


if thats get implemented i will be there every day
epicurus ataraxia
Illusion of Solitude.
Illusion of Solitude
#5 - 2014-08-08 17:33:24 UTC  |  Edited by: epicurus ataraxia
Bullock Brawn wrote:
I'm not smart enough in EVE to know the Facton Mod mechanics and how much they improve the win, but it would be perfectly acceptable to limit the field to

T1 and Meta mod fits only.

As long as there's an equal opportunity for both players to gear up.

It doesn't take that long to skill a frigate toon to be effective for T1 fits.

I want this .......Twisted



It could be fun, faction in the hands of a skilled player (in both senses) do raise his chance of winning. In the hands of a new player they give the sense of invulnerability, which sadly is lacking.
So giving the opportunity for both to fit, is like giving tiger woods a free hole advantage.

If both types of players are limited to basic ships, skills have an advantage, but a smart newer player with good attitude, and one who can adapt and learn quickly, can develop and bloom, and become excellent.
And sometimes win.

If they were like this they would be popular and useful.
If they allow faction pirate and t2 (unless they were limited to both flying them) with mixed types allowed, then they would simply have gankers, those wanting easy kills, and good killing for lootz, not for the challenge.

There is one EvE. Many people. Many lifestyles. WE are EvE

Fer'isam K'ahn
SAS Veterinarians
#6 - 2014-08-08 17:56:33 UTC
This is basically an arena repost. Nice veil °°.

I said ´No' to those and will say it again. If you want to know why - read the other threads.
Linkxsc162534
Silent Scourge
#7 - 2014-08-08 17:59:27 UTC
Bullock Brawn wrote:

Problem:
1) I can't join a player corp and be a good team player due to family life timing. Can't be on a certain time as others.

Lots of pvp corps in lowsec are fairly reasonable about this, most of them post ahead of time whe they're going to have roams so you can plan out your time to perhaps be able to join in. And even if you can't, you can pop in and find someone to roam with.
Quote:
2) I can't use a microphone because my wife and kids are sitting next to me in our media room making noise and being a family.

Push To Talk has solved a lot of my family noisemaking problems. Then I refrain from cursing and such while speaking.
Quote:
3) I like a challenge, but it should be reasonable and have a attempt at balance. PVP as is, is not interesting to me at all due to the random nature of finding a fair challenge.

Can't help you much there, its always a job to find a fight these days, although just loading up a AF or ceptor or something and running down to low for a little bit it really doesnt take long to get a skirmish, If I weren't living out of hotels right now (work) I'd say PM me and I could drag you around with my PVP alt to get a fight or 2.
Quote:
4) I get bored with PVE content.

Dont we all.
Quote:

Solution:
1) PVP Balanced Missions. (All boosts and fleet adds are void, like Incursion areas. Can't be in a fleet)

a) Single Deadspace pocket. Different Gates and only combatants are allowed in.
b) Different Ship levels. I.E...T1 Frigates, Destroyers, Cruisers, etc.. for different mission levels.
c) You can't get into the pocket with Cruiser, if it's for Frigates.
d) Each player puts up a stake to play. Could be a 5m ISK reward to winner or 100m reward. Higher stakes make it more fun.
e) Once a player accept the Mission at the station, they have X number of minutes to enter the pocket, once both players accept. If they don't make it in time, the forfeit the pot.
f) Winner gets to loot the wreck.
g) No pod kills or it's concord time.
h) Risk Faction mods if you got them, if that's your thing...just the ship hull is the limiting factor. I won't go in with a ship I can't afford to lose.
i) Mission spawn is in High Sec to keep it fair.

This would fix the game for me.

Big smile Give me a reason to PVP and I'm in. If I lose, which will be often, I will have a great time and most likely learn something.

Seems like you might just join FW to get roughly what your looking for. Yeah its kinda lame right now because of stabbed ships, but scram/disruptoring your ship (1 of each) has great trolling potential from what I'm told.
Bullock Brawn
Doomheim
#8 - 2014-08-08 18:04:01 UTC
Fer'isam K'ahn wrote:
This is basically an arena repost. Nice veil °°.

I said ´No' to those and will say it again. If you want to know why - read the other threads.



It's unfortunate that a semi-fair fight be looked down upon, as gaming should be fun for all and have purpose.
Although I understand that one might think of it as an arena, it is not. More simply a function to have the system
balance a solo interaction between two players. As is, the Duel function in game is broken and is far too random with no balance (before I shut it off, I would have dozens of HAC's trying to Duel my Freighter.).

Think outside the box and give Solo players something to PVP for. Otherwise the game is mostly broken for this subset group.
Iain Cariaba
#9 - 2014-08-08 18:12:40 UTC
Bullock Brawn wrote:
Problem:
1) I can't join a player corp and be a good team player due to family life timing. Can't be on a certain time as others.
2) I can't use a microphone because my wife and kids are sitting next to me in our media room making noise and being a family.
3) I like a challenge, but it should be reasonable and have a attempt at balance. PVP as is, is not interesting to me at all due to the random nature of finding a fair challenge.
4) I get bored with PVE content.

Solution:
1) Yes, you can. Just do what you can when you're on. The right corp will work with you.
2) Headphones and adjusting the gain of your mic. You talk like you're the only one with a family and a life that plays this game.
3) If it's balanced, than it's not a challenge. PvP is not random. The vast majority of the people who engage you are pretty sure they're going to win, otherwise they won't engage.
4) See 1-3.
Fer'isam K'ahn
SAS Veterinarians
#10 - 2014-08-08 18:16:13 UTC
Bullock Brawn wrote:
It's unfortunate that a semi-fair fight be looked down upon, as gaming should be fun for all and have purpose.
Although I understand that one might think of it as an arena, it is not. More simply a function to have the system
balance a solo interaction between two players. As is, the Duel function in game is broken and is far too random with no balance (before I shut it off, I would have dozens of HAC's trying to Duel my Freighter.).

Think outside the box and give Solo players something to PVP for. Otherwise the game is mostly broken for this subset group.

Aeh, I met a lot of solo pvplers ... some of the highest bounty guys are, and they are easy to find, cause they always hang out in the same areas, then you can find solo pvplers through the killboards and use that area information or a locator agent.
Ans you also get information about the ships they use, you can fit accordingly and see if you can still prevail with a counter over a vet.
I have still saved some I will bring vengeance upon.

Nothing keeps you from pursuing this goal that you have in mind. You can even manage those locations take bets, have visitors, has all been suggested ... betting services, spectators features etc etc ... all of the bottum of the forum pit ... or the ingame event forum.

Wrong forum, old suggestion, wrong game.
Bullock Brawn
Doomheim
#11 - 2014-08-08 18:34:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Bullock Brawn
Fer'isam K'ahn wrote:


Wrong forum, old suggestion, wrong game.


Wrong game for whom?

You are a single player looking at the game from your eyes with an understanding of what makes it fun for you.

Adding a balanced PVP solo experience doesn't take away all that you've said for your game style, other than perhaps the fear that players may enjoy the PVP missions more than the random PVP nature that is in current use, and this may somehow effect your fun.

The fact is obvious for the 3 years I've played this game, and that is the HUGE divide between those players who think the game is one thing only, and the rest are wrong.

This game has many, many angles to it.

For many it's a High Sec Game, others it's a PVP Bully fest, others think it's a Market Order Spreadsheet game..

Step away from your current view and add value to an otherwise stagnate solo game, and don't worry that you will lose something dear to you. The only thing that can come of a PVP mission is better and more PVP players emboldened to venture in to more dangerous areas of space.

Does that threaten your game? I imagine there are many areas of this game that you do not participate in, such as mining...just a guess, but others find that a great game! Play the way you want, but don't discourage others from adding new content options.
Daichi Yamato
Jabbersnarks and Wonderglass
#12 - 2014-08-08 19:00:49 UTC
Bullock Brawn wrote:
The only thing that can come of a PVP mission is better and more PVP players emboldened to venture in to more dangerous areas of space.


how do you figure that?
fighting in controlled arena's with rules (which is what these are) wont help players fight in uncontrolled areas with no rules anymore than the duelling system does or fighting 1v1 in FW plexes.

EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided"

Daichi Yamato's version of structure based decs

Petrified
Old and Petrified Syndication
#13 - 2014-08-08 19:00:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Petrified
There are merits to this suggestion.

1 - it could be implemented in High Sec. Entering the arena is agreement to a duel for x time.
2 - It could easily prohibit fleet boosting by checking for fleet membership prior to entry and denying fleet membership after entry.
3 - It could be a regular area of space marked with a beacon
4 - winner is whoever is left "standing" at the end of x time. If both remain after the time limit it is considered a draw and site despawns and respawns in another area of the system.
5 - the site would have dead space effects to prevent people from interrupting the party.

Edit to add:
While the site can control the type of access: ship type, meta max, etc... there is still enough variance between ship types and fitting layouts that the outcome will be variable. The purpose is not so much to introduce 1v1 PvP to non-PvPers but to provide a more even PvP field for players participating in the arena.

Cloaking is the closest thing to a "Pause Game" button one can get while in space.

Support better localization for the Japanese Community.

Bullock Brawn
Doomheim
#14 - 2014-08-08 19:43:13 UTC  |  Edited by: Bullock Brawn
Daichi Yamato wrote:
Bullock Brawn wrote:
The only thing that can come of a PVP mission is better and more PVP players emboldened to venture in to more dangerous areas of space.


how do you figure that?
fighting in controlled arena's with rules (which is what these are) wont help players fight in uncontrolled areas with no rules anymore than the duelling system does or fighting 1v1 in FW plexes.



Rules are all over the place, and players adjust to them.

Let's take a stroll down the typical EVE players PVP experience as it is.

1) He tries to venture off into Low or Null and quickly realizes that it's unfair.
2) He realizes that he has to hide from gangs and look for strays.
3) He realizes that a stray could be boosted or have alts.
4) He loses often to the weighted odds.
5) He realizes that he HAS to join a group to PVP to even the odds.
6) He feels this is stupid since it's not player vs player, it's law of the exploit.
7) He refrains from participating in PVP or becomes one of the gang members.
8) He realizes ganging up on solo players is cowardly at best and doesn't represent a challenge and becomes bored.
9) Odd chance this PVP player thinks he is amazing because he is part of a gang..

It's obvious that the better someone gets at something the more they will do it and the bigger risks they are willing to take.
Anyone who opposes a fair fight is not a pvp player, just someone who exploits for some strange personal satisfaction.

I can't for the life of me figure out why someone would feel it's a win to use a exploit? Why even worry about balancing ships, when solo PVP is so rare in this game; just bring a friend or use an alt for the win.
Takari
Promised Victorious Entropy
#15 - 2014-08-08 20:27:47 UTC
Quote:
Anyone who opposes a fair fight is not a pvp player, just someone who exploits for some strange personal satisfaction.


Wat? You have an odd definition of the terms 'pvp player' and 'exploit'

There is no 'Fair' in EVE. Maybe you don't like it that way. That's fine. I'll not dictate your opinion.

There are a million other games where you can get an Arena PVP experience. EVE is not the game for this.

It's like suggesting they put MOBA deadspace zones into the game, or space dragons at the end of a 'space dungeon raid'.

It's not that they're bad ideas (though I'm iffy on whether MOBA is ever a good idea) it's just that EVE is not that kind of game.

"Roll the dice, don't think twice. This is the way of things. Welcome to EVE." ~ CCP Falcon

"Good luck, shoot straight and don't back down." - Serendipity Lost

Daichi Yamato
Jabbersnarks and Wonderglass
#16 - 2014-08-08 20:52:30 UTC
Bullock Brawn wrote:


Let's take a stroll down the typical EVE players PVP experience as it is.



nah, stop obsessing over tactical play. its as much a strategy game as a tactical space sim.

1) its not unfair. Everyone starts their first day of eve with exactly the same stuff (maybe a couple different skills that mean next to nothing). They then build upon that over time, but no one can do anything another player cant.

If hes made more friends than you, he should be rewarded for that effort.

2) or make friends

3) offgrid boosting aside, you can also do the same

4) or wins often if hes good at weighing the odds in his favour

5) he doesnt have to but this is a multi player, multi layered, sand box game. what one can do, two can do better.

6) sounds like a multi-layered multiplayer sand box to me

7) each to their own. ppl still 1v1 without boosts or alts successfully

8) then dont gang up on solo players. go solo v solo or gang v gang...what makes you think you should know the exact number of the enemy and their strengths before you fight? thats the fun challenging game the rest of us play.

9) amazing at teamwork, gang PvP and playing the meta game?


numbers are not an exploit, its good strategy. you said yourself that eve is played lots of different ways, so dont turn around and say other ppl are bad because they beat you with better strategic, social or economic game play. your not entitled to solo play. but you can get it.


and you didnt even address how giving someone only enemies within certain criteria only makes them experienced at fighting enemies within that certain criteria. It does nothing to help prepare them for the backhanded deceitful game that is eve.

EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided"

Daichi Yamato's version of structure based decs

Mario Putzo
#17 - 2014-08-08 20:54:09 UTC
Isn't this basically what FW is already.
LT Alter
Ryba.
White Squall.
#18 - 2014-08-08 21:05:57 UTC
While I'm not looking down on the spirit of fair fights, I find this to be a bad idea. Not because I don't believe in the fair fights as I said, but because an arena style area is against the overall spirit of eve and it's free form sandbox gameplay. Adding structure to pvp takes away from the sandbox of eve and for this fact I will go against the idea you are proposing.

Though doing solo pvp isn't all that hard to do, start small and work your way up. You'll get better and you'll tend to find that there are a lot of people who don't really know how to pvp well. They rely on fleets and numbers to get the job done, they are only good at knowing what to shoot and approach it while hitting f1. I'm not saying there is anything bad about these players, just that solo pvpers can take advantage of their lack of knowledge in areas such as positioning, damage application, and other finer points of pvp.
Bullock Brawn
Doomheim
#19 - 2014-08-08 22:14:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Bullock Brawn
Takari wrote:


There is no 'Fair' in EVE.



This statement is not correct, since CCP attempts to balance ships and the game in general all the time.... Yes I remember the RLML nerf.

let's look at what you can do in game and see if it's fair.

PVE Missions = Fair (Same boring rats)
High Sec PVP Ganks and Tricks = Fair (concord)
Market PVP = Fair (buyer beware)
Mining = Fair (smashing Rocks, know your variables)
Exploration = Fair (know the risks, get the reward)
Skill Training = Fair (everyone is the same)
Open world PVP = Fair (Don't go there if you can't except the rules)

Balanced Solo PVP = Duel's only at this time and they are not balanced.... let me challenge a freighter for the win.


I was born in this whole and I'll die in this whole..... is that the EVE way?

Come on, you can do better than to just quote the same stuff. Tell us why this will hurt the game, like mining, industry or PVE hurts the game. This idea would most certainly exist if EVE was real... have you ever watched Boxing? How entertaining would EVE open world Boxing be..... let's all just jump the first guy in the ring and call it a win.
Bullock Brawn
Doomheim
#20 - 2014-08-08 22:22:29 UTC
Mario Putzo wrote:
Isn't this basically what FW is already.



no...

FW is in low sec.
FW allows more players in the gate (just ship restrictions)
FW isn't a balance PVP experience.
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