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Raven Navy vs Scorpion Navy
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Sentinel Oramara
Oramaras Noob Miners Inc
#1 - 2014-08-06 10:47:44 UTC  |  Edited by: Sentinel Oramara
Hello There

First let me Thank all The Forum-Users for helping me along with my Problems. Always reeding the Forum if i don't know how to Fit a Ship. I've been using a Drake with Beginner Skills for LVL 2 Missions. I am going to keep Training the Drake until i get a Descent Tech 2 Fit.

Now My Question. I have two Ships in Mind. Raven Navy or Scorpion Navy. My Goal is to Do LVL 3 and 4 Missions in High and low sec. Although I maybe already have something here with the Drake. But what do you Guys think.

Thanks in advance.

(Just hope this is in the right place here in the Forum)What?What?
Elena Thiesant
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#2 - 2014-08-06 11:02:16 UTC
Drake for L3, a battleship won't be efficient
Marc Callan
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#3 - 2014-08-06 11:07:44 UTC
Level 3 missions are generally balanced around battlecruiser-level firepower; a Drake is probably close to perfect for those, while battleships (especially missile battleships) will have trouble with targets that are too small for their primary weapons to be effective against.

In high-security space, the Raven Navy Issue is generally held out as the superior ship for top-end mission running, because its hull bonuses all apply to its weapons (improving their range and their impact against smaller targets), while the Scorpion Navy Issue splits between offensive and defensive bonuses.

In low-security space ... I don't know. Flying a mission-fit faction battleship into low-sec, as far as I can tell, is a recipe for disaster. There are people who want nothing more than to count coup by killing a faction battleship, and a mission-fit battleship won't be able to fend off a player-pirate attack for long.

"We are what we pretend to be, so we must be careful about what we pretend to be." - Kurt Vonnegurt
Ralph King-Griffin
New Eden Tech Support
#4 - 2014-08-06 11:16:42 UTC
Marc Callan wrote:

In high-security space, the Raven Navy Issue is generally held out as the superior ship for top-end mission running.

The Machariel,Rattlesnake,Kronos,Vargur,Golem and Paladin would all like a word with you about that.

Murderers of Negotiable Motivations

=]|[=
Hakaari Inkuran
State War Academy
Caldari State
#5 - 2014-08-06 11:29:17 UTC
Marc Callan wrote:


In high-security space, the Raven Navy Issue is generally held out as the superior ship for top-end mission running, because its hull bonuses all apply to its weapons (improving their range and their impact against smaller targets), while the Scorpion Navy Issue splits between offensive and defensive bonuses.


The reason the RNI is preferred is because it has 8 launchers and a powerful application bonus, not range (who cares about range, you're using cruises and those hit to max lock range anyway). SNI has 6 launchers and the rate of fire brings you up to 8 effective, with no application bonus
Sentinel Oramara
Oramaras Noob Miners Inc
#6 - 2014-08-06 11:42:23 UTC
Ok ... ... recap.

RNI 8 launchers + Bonus
SNI 6 launchers (rof 8 launchers) no Bonus.

Seems to me that i've got some Skill learning to do. First i will keep with my Drake. Fit that to descent LVL 3 Killer. and then switch to the RNI. oh boy. The Skilplan for the next 3 Months is full. Thanks Everybody for your help.
Marc Callan
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#7 - 2014-08-06 13:00:14 UTC
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
Marc Callan wrote:

In high-security space, the Raven Navy Issue is generally held out as the superior ship for top-end mission running.

The Machariel,Rattlesnake,Kronos,Vargur,Golem and Paladin would all like a word with you about that.


OP was asking about the Raven Navy vs. the Scorpion Navy. Of those two, the Raven Navy seems to be perceived as superior (I didn't say supreme). The Machariel, the Rattlesnake, and the four Marauders weren't even part of the conversation at that point.

*facepalm*

"We are what we pretend to be, so we must be careful about what we pretend to be." - Kurt Vonnegurt
Ralph King-Griffin
New Eden Tech Support
#8 - 2014-08-06 13:59:26 UTC
Marc Callan wrote:
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
Marc Callan wrote:

In high-security space, the Raven Navy Issue is generally held out as the superior ship for top-end mission running.

The Machariel,Rattlesnake,Kronos,Vargur,Golem and Paladin would all like a word with you about that.


OP was asking about the Raven Navy vs. the Scorpion Navy. Of those two, the Raven Navy seems to be perceived as superior (I didn't say supreme). The Machariel, the Rattlesnake, and the four Marauders weren't even part of the conversation at that point.

*facepalm*

actually you have a point there, ill apologise Oops

Murderers of Negotiable Motivations

=]|[=
The Djego
Hellequin Inc.
#9 - 2014-08-06 14:29:09 UTC
The navy Raven got a velocity bonus that increases the speed of missiles, not only giving Torps higher range but also reducing the chance of wasting a full volley on a target within 70km to zero(because your first volley will hit the target before the next one is in space). This is important since target painters are chance based beyond 45km, making it harder to predict if one volley for a BC or Cruiser will be sufficient or not.

The application bonus of the navy Raven in combination with the higher alpha of 8 launchers also makes it the easier ship to handle and will produce one volley kills even will lower missile skills, no T2 2x rigor 1x flare rig setup or sub optimal painting(again also affected by tanking skills and painting skills how many you can fit and how effective they are).

Overall the navy Raven is a lot better in damage application on paper and beyond it in practice since it can archive 1 volley kills a lot easier than the navy Scorpion and more predictable.

The only advantage of the navy Scorpion is the extra tank by the resist bonus and the extra med slot, what makes it easier to tank what is preferred by some people, however it shouldn't be a big issue with sufficient missile and tanking skills to do L4s with a navy Raven.

Improve discharge rigging: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=246166&find=unread
IIshira
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#10 - 2014-08-06 18:43:57 UTC  |  Edited by: IIshira
Sentinel Oramara wrote:
Hello There

First let me Thank all The Forum-Users for helping me along with my Problems. Always reeding the Forum if i don't know how to Fit a Ship. I've been using a Drake with Beginner Skills for LVL 2 Missions. I am going to keep Training the Drake until i get a Descent Tech 2 Fit.

Now My Question. I have two Ships in Mind. Raven Navy or Scorpion Navy. My Goal is to Do LVL 3 and 4 Missions in High and low sec. Although I maybe already have something here with the Drake. But what do you Guys think.

Thanks in advance.

(Just hope this is in the right place here in the Forum)What?What?


This should be great for level 3 missions. It's cap stable so perfect for AFK.. I recommend Sisters Of Eve since you will make more LP Twisted

[Raven Navy Issue, SOE Missions]
Capacitor Flux Coil II
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System

Pithum B-Type Adaptive Invulnerability Field
Pithum B-Type Adaptive Invulnerability Field
Pith A-Type Shield Boost Amplifier
Pith A-Type Shield Boost Amplifier
Gist A-Type X-Large Shield Booster
True Sansha Cap Recharger
True Sansha Cap Recharger

Caldari Navy Cruise Missile Launcher, Caldari Navy Scourge Cruise Missile
Caldari Navy Cruise Missile Launcher, Caldari Navy Scourge Cruise Missile
Caldari Navy Cruise Missile Launcher, Caldari Navy Scourge Cruise Missile
Caldari Navy Cruise Missile Launcher, Caldari Navy Scourge Cruise Missile
Caldari Navy Cruise Missile Launcher, Caldari Navy Scourge Cruise Missile
Caldari Navy Cruise Missile Launcher, Caldari Navy Scourge Cruise Missile
Caldari Navy Cruise Missile Launcher, Caldari Navy Scourge Cruise Missile
Caldari Navy Cruise Missile Launcher, Caldari Navy Scourge Cruise Missile

Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst I
Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst I
Large Capacitor Control Circuit II

'Augmented' Hobgoblin x5
'Augmented' Hammerhead x5
Caldari Navy Scourge Cruise Missile x3000
Paranoid Loyd
#11 - 2014-08-06 18:54:59 UTC
^ Confriming this is the way to go

"There is only one authority in this game, and that my friend is violence. The supreme authority upon which all other authority is derived." ISD Max Trix

Fix the Prospect!
Lady Naween
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#12 - 2014-08-06 20:23:58 UTC  |  Edited by: Lady Naween
dear lord that horrible overtank, and gank magnet. Please don't troll poor players into flying something that bad.

[Raven Navy Issue, Raven Navy Issue: Cheap(for a CNR) Level 4 Boat High DPS]
Co-Processor II
Ballistic Control System II
Ballistic Control System II
Ballistic Control System II
Ballistic Control System II

Sensor Booster II
Explosive Deflection Field II
Kinetic Deflection Field II
Large Micro Jump Drive
Phased Weapon Navigation Array Generation Extron
Phased Weapon Navigation Array Generation Extron
X-Large Ancillary Shield Booster

Cruise Missile Launcher II
Cruise Missile Launcher II
Cruise Missile Launcher II
Cruise Missile Launcher II
Cruise Missile Launcher II
Cruise Missile Launcher II
Cruise Missile Launcher II
Cruise Missile Launcher II

Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst I
Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst I
Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst I

Read more: http://eve.battleclinic.com/loadout/64410-Raven-Navy-Issue-Cheap-for-a-CNR-Level-4-Boat-High-DPS.html#ixzz39e63pdAv


there a cheaper and totally ok ship for you to start out with. later when you know what the hell you are doing you can add bling or a regular shield booster if you so prefer.
Jazmyn Stone
Perkone
Caldari State
#13 - 2014-08-06 20:32:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Jazmyn Stone
Dang, I wanted to be first to reply on Ilshira's CNR fit. It is so "over the top" it's actually silly. A fit like that is just not needed, and it just looks like some one was EFT warring.

(really thought what system do you actually fly in? It is truly a gank magnet.

-Jaz

Always remember Tovil-Toba, and what was done there.
Lady Naween
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#14 - 2014-08-06 20:42:33 UTC
Jazmyn Stone wrote:
Dang, I wanted to be first to reply on Ilshira's CNR fit. It is so "over the top" it's actually silly. A fit like that is just not needed, and it just looks like some one was EFT warring.

(really thought what system do you actually fly in? It is truly a gank magnet.

-Jaz



pretty sure it is a trollfit when combined with the sister comment and the horned smiley ^^
Paranoid Loyd
#15 - 2014-08-06 21:03:16 UTC  |  Edited by: Paranoid Loyd
Lady Naween wrote:
Jazmyn Stone wrote:
Dang, I wanted to be first to reply on Ilshira's CNR fit. It is so "over the top" it's actually silly. A fit like that is just not needed, and it just looks like some one was EFT warring.

(really thought what system do you actually fly in? It is truly a gank magnet.

-Jaz



pretty sure it is a trollfit when combined with the sister comment and the horned smiley ^^


You guys are no fun.

Capstable and perfect for AFK were also key indicators. Blink

"There is only one authority in this game, and that my friend is violence. The supreme authority upon which all other authority is derived." ISD Max Trix

Fix the Prospect!
Kosetzu
The Black Crow Bandits
Northern Coalition.
#16 - 2014-08-06 21:18:40 UTC
Paranoid Loyd wrote:
You guys are no fun.

Capstable and perfect for AFK were also key indicators. Blink

Pretty much what hooked most of the newbies. Seen way too many "err mah gawd, capstable is the best thing evar"...
IIshira
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#17 - 2014-08-06 21:37:36 UTC  |  Edited by: IIshira
Really... Only two people got it that me recommending a cap stable deadspace fit RNI for AFK level 3 SOE missions was a joke?...

A RNI is a terrible ship for level 3 missions in general. A Drake for level 3 and once the pilot got better skills a plain Raven for level 4 missions would be best.
Lady Naween
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#18 - 2014-08-06 23:39:10 UTC
IIshira wrote:
Really... Only two people got it that me recommending a cap stable deadspace fit RNI for AFK level 3 SOE missions was a joke?...

A RNI is a terrible ship for level 3 missions in general. A Drake for level 3 and once the pilot got better skills a plain Raven for level 4 missions would be best.


problem is, there are enough morons out there that actually DO fit their ships to such a degree ^^ makes it hard to tell the trolls from the morons at times :) some of the ships we have ganked in osmon.. yikes.
Mike Whiite
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#19 - 2014-08-07 10:15:31 UTC
I'll break a lance for the SNI.

The RNI has a great application bonus, that said lvl4 missions only have so many ships on which that is going to make a difference.
Especially if you're to lazy, like my self to split weapons all the time.

With proper skills, 2 Rigor and 1 Flare as rigs, the proper ammo and 1 or 2 target painters the number of times you really get an advantage isn't that high.

Because of the fact the SNI only has 6 launchers and a resistance bonus, it will have a surplus on the RNI conserning CPU and Powergrid.

making it possible for instance to fit it with 3 bcu's a drone damage mod a, drone link augmentor enough tp's, propulsion mods and tank to be the better choice in several missions. doing more damage than the RNI on big ships and have your drones doing more damage on the smaller ships having less need to fire on those small ships that will take more time to take down (requires some drone management with agro)

The SNI is cheaper a little less likely to draw gankers, is more veritable and looks better

Edwin McAlister
Empire Hooligans
#20 - 2014-08-07 12:17:38 UTC
SNI can fit an insanely brutal tank and was my fav for a long time running missions, as my defensive skills improved i shifted to the Navy Raven ... and last year switched to the Golem for mission running
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