Player Features and Ideas Discussion

Make sentry drones a battleship only weapon. Not on carriers. Not on HACs.

What say you all?

Sentries are fine as they are. Sentries are a symptom of people's problems, not the cure.

For the problem, it might be in how you approach it.

I don't think the problem is sentries its certain ships that are the issue. once those ships are balanced sentries will be fine.

Give them battleship sig targeting, suddenly ishtars aren't the best counter for ishtars and they don't get nerfed in everyway as much as other people are demanding they do.

It seems to me that the problem with sentry drones doesn't really stem from the drones themselves. The Ishtar is just so fast, tough, and versatile that the drawbacks inherent to sentry drones can be mitigated. As for carriers with respect to the wrecking ball tactic the drawbacks of sentries can also be mitigated, though by different means. The strengths of the Ishtar and the Archon hulls is what makes sentries powerful.

People complained initially about the Dominix but now you don't see people mentioning it much anymore. I rarely, if ever, have heard anyone complain about any of the other drone hulls with respect to sentry drones. It seems to me that if sentry drones were overpowered people would use them on every drone hull as their primary damage source, but that really isn't the case.

I understand that you might be upset with the current state of affairs but too heavy a touch will turn sentries into the new heavy missiles. What we want is for sentries to be AN option on the Ishtar, not THE option. As for carriers, I'm not as sure. There are a lot of issues stemming from carriers and supercarriers right now. They all need to be considered together.

I've read posters complaints about carriers stating variously that they shouldn't be allowed to field sub-cap drones, that capital remote rep should be nerfed, that power projection via jump drive should be reduced, that supers should loose their EWAR immunity and so fourth. If the developers were to change all of these factors are once, carriers might cease to be a battlefield tool entirely. a light touch is required here as well. Carriers and supers should be a powerful force multiplier. They should even be a force in their own right in certain circumstances. What they shouldn't be though is the only force that matters.

We'll see what CCP does, but again, I really don't believe removing sentries from Ishtars and carriers is going to fix some of the issues with the current metagame.

And you find nothing wrong with needing 40 ships to kill one?


I have no issue with sentries themselves, (except maybe the HUGE variance in ranges across the types but that seems to be just me.) As has already been stated, it's the ships that are at fault.

Well, the trouble with blaming the ships is that if they are starting with a dorked system, they are impossible to balance around anything BUT that which kills versatility beyond said system.

In the wider meta sentries do need a look.

Taleden already demonstrated this with his data I've pinched below:


But for reference, here's what happens to medium damage when using ammo to match large/sentry range:

Sentries (S)
(S) Garde II: 421dps @ 30+18km, 0.036rad/s, 400m res
(S) Curator II: 396dps @ 52+12km, 0.0276rad/s, 400m res
(S) Bouncer II: 371dps @ 52+48km, 0.0192rad/s, 400m res
(S) Warden II: 346dps @ 75+42km, 0.012rad/s, 400m res

Medium Guns (M) - Max DPS ammo
(M) Heavy Beam Laser II (MF): 395dps @ 15+10km, 0.03712rad/s, 125m res
(M) 250mm Railgun II (AM): 406dps @ 18+15km, 0.02566rad/s, 125m res
(M) 720mm Howitzer Artillery II (EMP): 280dps @ 15+22km, 0.02612rad/s, 125m res

Medium Guns (M) - Comparable range ammo
(M) Heavy Beam Laser II (MW): 198dps @ 42+10km, 0.03712rad/s, 125m res
(M) 250mm Railgun II (Tu): 203dps @ 50+15km, 0.02566rad/s, 125m res
(M) 720mm Howitzer Artillery II (Pro): 117dps @ 48+22km, 0.02743rad/s, 125m res


So, as should be immediately obvious from the above, sentries stand tall over all other medium systems.

Of course they have their drawbacks, question is, are they enough?


Methinks medium and small sentries are the way to go.

Except the data is not relative. The ratio of guns to drones is not listed.

The drone DPS listed is for 5 drones. Reduce the numer of drones and the variance becomes a much smaller issue. So, as stated, the ships are primarily at fault, not the drones.

We can balance a dozen or more hulls that can use sentry drones around having them, or we can balance sentry drones themselves.

Or we can just make them require a role bonus, so that only battleships can use them, and not cruisers and carriers.

Any of those ways work for me.

Except that those 40 dreads need subcap support to not get eaten alive by other things. Subcap support that the slowcats will shred. Slowcats don't need any subcap support at all.