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EVE(L) Stabb. Remove from game? Maybe?

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Jaime Gomes
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#1 - 2014-08-05 08:59:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Jaime Gomes
Hello everyone.

I was a FW pilot for about 6 months and i returned to Black Rise after i joined Waffles. Since i left, many welcome changes were added: the range between the beacon and the button was decreased and inability to use cloaking devices in proximity to it (although debatable since it was fun to trap people and....... you can imagine) are such examples.

However i believe the most important change was not implemented or even addressed: stabbed ships.

It is known that when you dscan a plex the likelihood of that small t1 frigate being stabbed is pretty high and most cases it is confirmed when you point the thing and slips trough your fingers.

It is indeed frustrating but the worst are the hours wasted(sometimes per day) trying to find a 1v1 or even a 1v2 and in the end you get 0. Since i got back i also noticed a rise in small gang fleets of 4 and 5 pilots where all of them are fitted with stabbs (including destroyers).

However lets see this from a "carebears" perspective:

Many players, during the week, do missions/mine and/or trade in HS but at weekends they go alone or with friends to fw areas were they know they have the possibility of a fight. They pay for a couple ships, modules, ammo and they are set to go in search for epic loot. They are prepared to go cgc, lose sec status and even get some kill rights against them.

Conclusion: stabbed ships do not produce any content to the game and in the end the only thing they cause is people to log off or simply stay away from activities that otherwise should be very fun to do alone or with other players.

Either way bla bla bla bla TL/DR cry me a river:


Possible solutions:

1. Remove stabbs from the game - although even I am not to kind of the idea since its fundamental to many pilots living in losec to restock their armory and markets. That would limit how you would do it and incite to a certain degree more gate camping.

2. Do not allow a pilot to go into a plex with stabbs fitted and/or with the said module in the cargohold.

Thanks for the attention. Feel free to leave a comment.
Sara Tosa
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#2 - 2014-08-05 09:06:27 UTC
everything need a counter, points get stabs, stabs get more points.
just use more points.
Jaime Gomes
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#3 - 2014-08-05 09:07:45 UTC
Sara Tosa wrote:
everything need a counter, points get stabs, stabs get more points.
just use more points.




Sorry thats not even................
chao226
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#4 - 2014-08-05 09:15:39 UTC
I have to agree. I never had an issue with stabs until FW and even at that its mainly been since the cloaking change. problem is a lot of people there want to farm lp and not fight. so first the fitted cloaks to there t1 frigs back then if you could catch them or de-cloak then you had a chance as not everyone would stab up with cloaks.

now wih the cloak out of the question they have all went to stabs and its a lot harder to catch any of them.

I agree that a good solution to the problem would be to limit stabs inside the plex's. one alternative would be within range of the becon -2 to warp core strength.
Sara Tosa
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#5 - 2014-08-05 09:15:51 UTC
Jaime Gomes wrote:
Sara Tosa wrote:
everything need a counter, points get stabs, stabs get more points.
just use more points.




Sorry thats not even................

not even what? you think that you and your friends cant outpoint a stabbed ship?
how many stabs can a frigate mount? just bring +1 frigates.
or just that everything should be an easy killmail for you?
Athryn Bellee
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#6 - 2014-08-05 09:21:02 UTC
Warp core stabilizers already have drawbacks to their usage. It takes longer to target, your targeting range is decreased and if you're giving up a slot that could be used for more tank or dps. If you're having trouble catching people with wcs fitted then either fit more points. It is a simple fact that you're not going to be able to grab all the ships all the time. Get over it.
Jaime Gomes
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#7 - 2014-08-05 09:23:04 UTC
Sara Tosa wrote:
Jaime Gomes wrote:
Sara Tosa wrote:
everything need a counter, points get stabs, stabs get more points.
just use more points.




Sorry thats not even................

not even what? you think that you and your friends cant outpoint a stabbed ship?
how many stabs can a frigate mount? just bring +1 frigates.
or just that everything should be an easy killmail for you?




If i am with friends there is no point in fitting multiple points in my ship. But alone are you really willing to sacrifice a mid for a second point? Unless you are 100% sure that guy is a plexer go for it! If not you don't even consider it since if the guy is there for pew pew like you he will 99% times kill you.

Jaime Gomes
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#8 - 2014-08-05 09:24:06 UTC
Athryn Bellee wrote:
Warp core stabilizers already have drawbacks to their usage. It takes longer to target, your targeting range is decreased and if you're giving up a slot that could be used for more tank or dps. If you're having trouble catching people with wcs fitted then either fit more points. It is a simple fact that you're not going to be able to grab all the ships all the time. Get over it.




Drawback does not surpass the advantage. Being alive is pretty well considering the alternative: dead.
Athryn Bellee
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#9 - 2014-08-05 09:25:23 UTC
There are two types of point modules, the warp disruptor and warp scrambler. The disruptor has a longer range, but only one point, the scrambler has a shorter range but has the benefit of two points and disables microwarpdrives.
Sara Tosa
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#10 - 2014-08-05 09:29:25 UTC
Jaime Gomes wrote:
Sara Tosa wrote:
Jaime Gomes wrote:
Sara Tosa wrote:
everything need a counter, points get stabs, stabs get more points.
just use more points.




Sorry thats not even................

not even what? you think that you and your friends cant outpoint a stabbed ship?
how many stabs can a frigate mount? just bring +1 frigates.
or just that everything should be an easy killmail for you?




If i am with friends there is no point in fitting multiple points in my ship. But alone are you really willing to sacrifice a mid for a second point? Unless you are 100% sure that guy is a plexer go for it! If not you don't even consider it since if the guy is there for pew pew like you he will 99% times kill you.


and why you, alone, should be able with 100% certainly to kill any ship you encounter? some ship will be easy prey, some other will be a specific counter to your solo roaming, some else will kill you.
its the roll of the game.
lets say they remove stabs, next ship will elude you because it warp faster than you can point, then you'll want to remove agility modules, next will elude you as it can kite you, you'll want to remove props - this is just a stupid way to play.
just man up and chose your targets better or be better prepared.
Jaime Gomes
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#11 - 2014-08-05 09:30:17 UTC
Athryn Bellee wrote:
There are two types of point modules, the warp disruptor and warp scrambler. The disruptor has a longer range, but only one point, the scrambler has a shorter range but has the benefit of two points and disables microwarpdrives.




Sure especially if you are already inside the plex. You can do it. But likely a stabbed ship will not go inside with someone there already , alone.
Jaime Gomes
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#12 - 2014-08-05 09:38:25 UTC  |  Edited by: Jaime Gomes
Sara Tosa wrote:
Jaime Gomes wrote:
Sara Tosa wrote:
Jaime Gomes wrote:
Sara Tosa wrote:
everything need a counter, points get stabs, stabs get more points.
just use more points.




Sorry thats not even................

not even what? you think that you and your friends cant outpoint a stabbed ship?
how many stabs can a frigate mount? just bring +1 frigates.
or just that everything should be an easy killmail for you?




If i am with friends there is no point in fitting multiple points in my ship. But alone are you really willing to sacrifice a mid for a second point? Unless you are 100% sure that guy is a plexer go for it! If not you don't even consider it since if the guy is there for pew pew like you he will 99% times kill you.


and why you, alone, should be able with 100% certainly to kill any ship you encounter? some ship will be easy prey, some other will be a specific counter to your solo roaming, some else will kill you.
its the roll of the game.
lets say they remove stabs, next ship will elude you because it warp faster than you can point, then you'll want to remove agility modules, next will elude you as it can kite you, you'll want to remove props - this is just a stupid way to play.
just man up and chose your targets better or be better prepared.




Hold on. You have passed the marks. I am NOT a MAN. I am MANBEARPIG!

***** and giggles asside: obviously i want to kill a ship 100% times i engage. That is out of the question and like me....pretty much everyone else in New Eden. However since that is impossible it doesn't mean you can't have a hella good time getting killed.

Now let me adress you regarding the "he will warp before you therefore you are a pussy and should be blazed" or something like that.

Well normal people that give a shat about sec status (alot of people in highsec but especially FW warrior) probably don't like losing it for 0. In case of fw pilots they can steal the site and still make some doe. The rest....nope. No reward for him warping off and say hello to more killrights.
Ray Kyonhe
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#13 - 2014-08-05 09:40:56 UTC
Limit stab uses in FW - good one, supported.
Remove stabs from the game - okey dokey, but remove all points too, then. You claim that stabs ruins game for somebody. Well, but those somebodies ruin game for others by blocking gates with their camps.

Survey/voting system inbuilt to the game client: link_Reforming corp and taxation system: link_New PvE content (reward collective gameplay): link
Fer'isam K'ahn
SAS Veterinarians
#14 - 2014-08-05 09:41:10 UTC
Buhuhu, can't point.

Buhuhu, can't force another player to pvp with me.

Buhuhu, can't be bothered to fit adequately.

Ever had the thought that the person fitting stabs might not want to fight ? And you have no business being in a FW Plex if you don't want to fight ? And you are not even considering ppl that run Plexes and are bound to it visible for everyone 15+ min and ruining their invested time by jumping them ? And you are probably one of those neutral FW Griefers anyway.

Basically got no KM, nerf game for my advantage - my style of playing the game.

NO!
chao226
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#15 - 2014-08-05 09:48:28 UTC
I think the problem here is that in the specific area of FW the stabs benefits far outstrips the rewards.

a t1 frig with some guns and stabs can run plexes make and make a lot of lp with little risk. turning a part of the game designed to stimulate PvP into an isk farm. People plexing have plenty of advantage over an attacker without stabs. the accelerate gate is within 100,000km of the beacon for for the person inside d-scan will let them know whats coming. and if they don't run d-scan for a minute then they got there stabs.

cloaks were removed from FW plex's to stimulate more PvP between factions and I think stabs need to go as well for this to happen.


stabs have fairly balanced drawbacks in other areas of the game its just this unique situation that they are overused and overpowered.
Jaime Gomes
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#16 - 2014-08-05 09:52:24 UTC
Fer'isam K'ahn wrote:
Buhuhu, can't point.

Buhuhu, can't force another player to pvp with me.

Buhuhu, can't be bothered to fit adequately.

Ever had the thought that the person fitting stabs might not want to fight ? And you have no business being in a FW Plex if you don't want to fight ? And you are not even considering ppl that run Plexes and are bound to it visible for everyone 15+ min and ruining their invested time by jumping them ? And you are probably one of those neutral FW Griefers anyway.

Basically got no KM, nerf game for my advantage - my style of playing the game.

NO!



0 risk. To much reward and that is my point and the many times the aggressor takes to toll for it. And even if he warps off without any stabbs you can still catch him with a ceptor. With them...no.


If i wanted to change the style of the game for my advantage i would start a website and post some stuff so my minnions would obey my command......wait.....oh yea already done....shaisse.
Jaime Gomes
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#17 - 2014-08-05 09:53:10 UTC
Jaime Gomes wrote:
Fer'isam K'ahn wrote:
Buhuhu, can't point.

Buhuhu, can't force another player to pvp with me.

Buhuhu, can't be bothered to fit adequately.

Ever had the thought that the person fitting stabs might not want to fight ? And you have no business being in a FW Plex if you don't want to fight ? And you are not even considering ppl that run Plexes and are bound to it visible for everyone 15+ min and ruining their invested time by jumping them ? And you are probably one of those neutral FW Griefers anyway.

Basically got no KM, nerf game for my advantage - my style of playing the game.

NO!



0 risk. To much reward and that is my point and many times the aggressor takes to toll for it. And even if he warps off without any stabbs you can still catch him with a ceptor. With them...no.


If i wanted to change the style of the game for my advantage i would start a website and post some stuff so my minnions would obey my command......wait.....oh yea already done....shaisse.

Fer'isam K'ahn
SAS Veterinarians
#18 - 2014-08-05 10:01:35 UTC
Quoting yourself doesn't make your point more valid Shocked

And its the same shaissee (or whatever) argument this will come down to again, the risk vs reward misconception you will address next (or already have with your '0' note). RvR does not mean exposure and committing to a PvP fight. A player also risks his time and fun for the reward of getting some LP. Being interrupted continuously by neutrals for 2 hours running plexes and not getting either looks really bad on that subject too.

But Nooo, nohoho... he no stay, he no blow up, he no risk: Nerf. - Argument, dumb as they come.

Am done with this rubbish.
Jaime Gomes
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#19 - 2014-08-05 10:09:24 UTC
Fer'isam K'ahn wrote:
Quoting yourself doesn't make your point more valid Shocked

And its the same shaissee (or whatever) argument this will come down to again, the risk vs reward misconception you will address next (or already have with your '0' note). RvR does not mean exposure and committing to a PvP fight. A player also risks his time and fun for the reward of getting some LP. Being interrupted continuously by neutrals for 2 hours running plexes and not getting either looks really bad on that subject too.

But Nooo, nohoho... he no stay, he no blow up, he no risk: Nerf. - Argument, dumb as they come.

Am done with this rubbish.


I don't know how to delete posts :P.

Yea you are totally right. The good old argument: risk vs reward is ********. Oh lord! What have i done! please forgive me for the horrible sin i have committed. Oh Lord please save me from the fires of hell for i have been finally, enlightened!

Such a shame CCP made the fw changes last year to address that matter. CCP are evil people and you should be their leader so they can change their ways.

Don't let the door hit your face on the way out.
Fer'isam K'ahn
SAS Veterinarians
#20 - 2014-08-05 10:20:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Fer'isam K'ahn
Well, leave the imagined authority out of it...

My FW toon is 9 months old, never has been caught, has just the basic 58K SP and I never fit any stabs on it ever. So you are saying I play the game wrong cause I don't explode for the vanity of others ? Sure, I am the one butthurt here°°

Forcing game mechanics for the laziness of some onto the rest is not good game design and luckily won´t happen here.

Cheers for your tears.

And I am still surprised to see whine threads of the like 'can't get stuff to explode' from the likes of Goons and PL ... surprises me very time. Your ignorance has soured the taste of that Waffles song for me now ... tzzz
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