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Suicide to fly Raven Navy Issue without a target painter?
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Capt Acid
7th Flotilla
#1 - 2014-07-27 15:58:28 UTC
So the TLDR question: Can I fly a Raven Navy Issue without a target painter if I fit her with two or three Rigor Catalysts? Also would my Hornet II’s be able to deal with any web/scram frigs or would I be at their mercy?

I am kicking around the idea of flying a Raven Navy Issue as I am a missile flinger and shield tanker it seems to be logical to pick her over the Scorpion Navy Issue. Now I dislike having to use target painters due to the abominable cycle time and range issues so that got me to drooling over the RNI’s 5% bonus to Cruise Missile and Torpedo explosion radius, that adds up to a 25% bonus as I have Caldari Battleship 5. So here is my question if I shove x3 Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst I or X2 Rigor IIs and a Flair would the RNI be able to apply DMG to Cruisers well enough to one or two shot them without target painters or is it lunacy to fly a RNI without a TP? Also if a TP is mandatory is one enough or do I need two?

Thanks and fly safe.
Rankan
State War Academy
Caldari State
#2 - 2014-07-27 16:22:22 UTC
I used a normal Raven with 3 Rigors and T2 Drones and never lost it. Train up Guided Missile Precision and Target Navigation Prediction and get the implants for them.
Nosub Boomer
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#3 - 2014-07-27 17:08:09 UTC
In an update quite a while back TP's had their cycle time reduced from 10 seconds to five seconds which cuts out most of the annoyance, Plus the RNI has more than enough mids to use two TP's without gimping the tank.

The RNI's inherent application hull bonus's & Rigors will ensure good application but the use of TP's will ensure great application with a good chance of one-shotting most cruisers..

Two Rigors & one flare plus TP works great for me.
Myriad Blaze
Common Sense Ltd
Nulli Secunda
#4 - 2014-07-27 17:20:49 UTC
When I still did missions I used to have a CNR with 2 Rigor II and 1 Flare II and still used a TP for most missions because it made a difference and helped me kill stuff faster. (For a few missions I preferred to fit ECCM instead.)

And if you bring T2 light drones you shouldn't have to worry about frigates scramming you.


Here's the fit I used then (hardeners and ammo were changed accoring to the enemy faction, of course):
You might notice, that there is no prop mod. With the exception of very few missions that can easily be avoided, most missions do not require you to move much. I used to warp in, set the ship to orbit the warp in beacon and then killed the rats.


High power
8x Cruise Missile Launcher II

Medium power
1x Pith C-Type X-Large Shield Booster
1x Heavy Capacitor Booster II
2x Dread Guristas EM Ward Field
1x Dread Guristas Thermic Dissipation Field
1x Caldari Navy Shield Boost Amplifier
1x Phased Weapon Navigation Array Generation Extron

Low power
1x Damage Control II
4x Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System

Rig Slot
1x Large Warhead Flare Catalyst II
2x Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst II

Charges
600x Mjolnir Precision Cruise Missile
18x Navy Cap Booster 800
3.260x Mjolnir Fury Cruise Missile

Drones
15x Hobgoblin II
5x Hornet EC-300
Jeanne-Luise Argenau
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#5 - 2014-07-27 18:07:20 UTC
im going with the pve idea here

this is what i used to great effect
1 to 2 salvos on elite frigates with precision
1salvo non elite cruiser and bc
2 to 3 salvos on elite cruisers
3 salvos on bs on average
cycle time i never had problems
PS as i used it it was with a full 5% missile implant set

[Raven Navy Issue, Unnamed loadout]
Ballistic Control System II
Ballistic Control System II
Ballistic Control System II
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Signal Amplifier II

Large Micro Jump Drive
Heavy Capacitor Booster II, Cap Booster 800
Phased Weapon Navigation Array Generation Extron
Phased Weapon Navigation Array Generation Extron
Domination EM Ward Amplifier
Domination Thermic Dissipation Amplifier
X-Large C5-L Emergency Shield Overload I

Cruise Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Fury Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Fury Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Fury Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Fury Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Fury Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Fury Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Fury Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Fury Cruise Missile

Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst II
Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst II
Large Warhead Flare Catalyst II
IIshira
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#6 - 2014-07-27 19:16:08 UTC
Capt Acid wrote:
So the TLDR question: Can I fly a Raven Navy Issue without a target painter if I fit her with two or three Rigor Catalysts? Also would my Hornet II’s be able to deal with any web/scram frigs or would I be at their mercy?

I am kicking around the idea of flying a Raven Navy Issue as I am a missile flinger and shield tanker it seems to be logical to pick her over the Scorpion Navy Issue. Now I dislike having to use target painters due to the abominable cycle time and range issues so that got me to drooling over the RNI’s 5% bonus to Cruise Missile and Torpedo explosion radius, that adds up to a 25% bonus as I have Caldari Battleship 5. So here is my question if I shove x3 Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst I or X2 Rigor IIs and a Flair would the RNI be able to apply DMG to Cruisers well enough to one or two shot them without target painters or is it lunacy to fly a RNI without a TP? Also if a TP is mandatory is one enough or do I need two?

Thanks and fly safe.


You can fly a Raven Navy Issue without a target painter. If you have decent drone skills it's not suicide either. Would I recommend it.. No!

Many things have changed. Target painters have a 5 second cycle time... Micro Jump Drive kicks you out 100 km even if you're being scrammed by an NPC.. You'll be able to kill the frigates before they even get close.


There are many ways to skin the cat. Here's one.

[Raven Navy Issue, Missions]
Damage Control II
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Ballistic Control System II

Kinetic Deflection Field II
Thermic Dissipation Field II
Pith B-Type Large Shield Booster
Shield Boost Amplifier II
Phased Weapon Navigation Array Generation Extron
Phased Weapon Navigation Array Generation Extron
Large Micro Jump Drive

Cruise Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Cruise Missile

Large Ionic Field Projector I
Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst II
Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst II

Hobgoblin II x5
Warden II x3
Claud Tiberius
#7 - 2014-07-28 04:29:04 UTC
You don't need a TP in pve. Your skills (if high) should be enough.

In pvp, a TP is always a good idea for the med-long range missile boats.

Once upon a time the Golem had a Raven hull and it looked good. Then it transformed into a plataduck. The end.
Caleidascope
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#8 - 2014-07-28 04:38:53 UTC
For PVE. These days I fit 1 tp. The only reason I fit it is because I need it to get agro for my auto targeting missiles.

Life is short and dinner time is chancy

Eat dessert first!
Chainsaw Plankton
FaDoyToy
#9 - 2014-07-28 04:43:38 UTC
Caleidascope wrote:
For PVE. These days I fit 1 tp. The only reason I fit it is because I need it to get agro for my auto targeting missiles.


the real reason to fly a cnr and fit a target painter.

@ChainsawPlankto on twitter
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#10 - 2014-07-28 04:47:06 UTC
Ravens have been doing missions without target painters for a decade.Blink
Luwc
State War Academy
Caldari State
#11 - 2014-07-28 06:45:54 UTC
dude its a 10min skill for the meta4 is is just as good as the T2. Big smile

why would overtank that piece of **** in the first place

http://hugelolcdn.com/i/267520.gif
Claud Tiberius
#12 - 2014-07-28 06:51:46 UTC
Caleidascope wrote:
For PVE. These days I fit 1 tp. The only reason I fit it is because I need it to get agro for my auto targeting missiles.

Then go afk? Lol

Once upon a time the Golem had a Raven hull and it looked good. Then it transformed into a plataduck. The end.
IIshira
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#13 - 2014-07-28 13:31:29 UTC  |  Edited by: IIshira
baltec1 wrote:
Ravens have been doing missions without target painters for a decade.Blink

Yes I've done missions in a Raven without either target painters or rigor rigs. It will complete the mission but it's not ideal. You'll get more damage on smaller targets with target painters. More damage means the mission is complete faster. The semi AFK type of player might prefer more tank.
IIshira
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#14 - 2014-07-28 13:42:28 UTC
Luwc wrote:
dude its a 10min skill for the meta4 is is just as good as the T2. Big smile

why would overtank that piece of **** in the first place


This is true but if you get target painting to 4 you can train the secondary skill that helps. I'm not at my computer so I can't verify the exact training time but I think it's only a few days to get both to 4. Definitely not wasted training for a missile pilot. Also required for a mission Golem. I've seen pilots flying a Golem without target painters.... Roll
IIshira
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#15 - 2014-07-28 13:45:12 UTC
Chainsaw Plankton wrote:
Caleidascope wrote:
For PVE. These days I fit 1 tp. The only reason I fit it is because I need it to get agro for my auto targeting missiles.


the real reason to fly a cnr and fit a target painter.

Do they still work for AFK mission running? I thought they did something to nerf the missiles?
Nadine Jones
Holes with Worms
#16 - 2014-07-28 14:28:54 UTC
Just use a ship with guns, fit it with a micro jump drive and laugh manically as you blap the frigs from 100km.
I know I did. Never touched missiles ever again.
Jeanne-Luise Argenau
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#17 - 2014-07-28 18:32:23 UTC
Nadine Jones wrote:
Just use a ship with guns, fit it with a micro jump drive and laugh manically as you blap the frigs from 100km.
I know I did. Never touched missiles ever again.


i prefer missiles for missions tbh, thats the difference in playstyle
Caleidascope
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#18 - 2014-07-28 21:32:04 UTC
Claud Tiberius wrote:
Caleidascope wrote:
For PVE. These days I fit 1 tp. The only reason I fit it is because I need it to get agro for my auto targeting missiles.

Then go afk? Lol

Unfortunately no, but it does free up time for homework. ☺7

Life is short and dinner time is chancy

Eat dessert first!
Caleidascope
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#19 - 2014-07-28 21:36:38 UTC
IIshira wrote:
Chainsaw Plankton wrote:
Caleidascope wrote:
For PVE. These days I fit 1 tp. The only reason I fit it is because I need it to get agro for my auto targeting missiles.


the real reason to fly a cnr and fit a target painter.

Do they still work for AFK mission running? I thought they did something to nerf the missiles?

My opinion is that this tactic does not work for AFK. Often enough you would have some frigs or some battleships that keep dancing in and out, this means that auto targeting missiles (which always go for the closest target) keep switching targets, which results in neither target being killed. So I don't recommend this tactic for AFK. And carry some regular missiles when you want to concentrate your fire.

Life is short and dinner time is chancy

Eat dessert first!
NIFTYGetAtMe
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#20 - 2014-07-29 18:50:41 UTC  |  Edited by: NIFTYGetAtMe
It's not suicide to PvE without a TP if you have Cruise Launchers and 3 Rigors, it's just not smart. Always have a TP when using missiles. However, if you're worried about losing a Raven Navy Issue to PvE, then you should probably get the Scorpion Navy Issue as it can tank much better.

Something like this for the Raven:
8x Cruise Launcher II

2x Pithum B-Type Invuln
Pith X-Type Large Shield Booster
Pith X-Type Shield Boost Amp
Republic Fleet TP
2x Brokara's Cap Recharger

4x CN Ballistic Control Unit
Gravimetric Backup II

2x Rigor II
CCC

or something like this for the SNI:
6x Cruise Launcher II
Salvager/Tractor Beam

2x Pithum B-Type Invuln
Pith X-Type Large Shield booster
Pith X-Type Shield Boost Amp
2x Domination TP
MJD
Brokara's Cap recharger

4x CN Ballistic Control Unit
Cormack's Power Diagnostic System

CCC II
CCC
Rigor II

Both work extremely well.
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