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Incursions Start here.

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James Baboli
Warp to Pharmacy
#641 - 2014-07-10 07:53:28 UTC
Marc Callan wrote:
For incursions, J isn't a member of the fleet, but rather a special target tag indicating "DO NOT SHOOT THIS". Generally, the target-tagger will put the J tag on whichever ship serves as the trigger for the next wave. If the trigger goes off prematurely, someone in the site is probably going to have an ... interesting time.

(As in: "I don't suppose any of the logibros brought hull rep drones?")

From what I hear J used to be Jammer targets, and some old guides still list widow fits to jam out specific targets, which were tagged J to avoid fleet wasting DPS on them until later. This was changed as about once a week, a widow would pop and be worth almost as much as the widow pilot had made, as jammers, like scrams/points, rip massive aggro.

Talking more,

Flying crazier,

And drinking more

Making battleships worth the warp
Marc Callan
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#642 - 2014-07-10 09:13:53 UTC
James Baboli wrote:
Marc Callan wrote:
For incursions, J isn't a member of the fleet, but rather a special target tag indicating "DO NOT SHOOT THIS". Generally, the target-tagger will put the J tag on whichever ship serves as the trigger for the next wave. If the trigger goes off prematurely, someone in the site is probably going to have an ... interesting time.

(As in: "I don't suppose any of the logibros brought hull rep drones?")

From what I hear J used to be Jammer targets, and some old guides still list widow fits to jam out specific targets, which were tagged J to avoid fleet wasting DPS on them until later. This was changed as about once a week, a widow would pop and be worth almost as much as the widow pilot had made, as jammers, like scrams/points, rip massive aggro.


Wait, a Widow, not a T1 Scorpion? o.O

"We are what we pretend to be, so we must be careful about what we pretend to be." - Kurt Vonnegurt
James Baboli
Warp to Pharmacy
#643 - 2014-07-10 12:24:38 UTC
Marc Callan wrote:
James Baboli wrote:
Marc Callan wrote:
For incursions, J isn't a member of the fleet, but rather a special target tag indicating "DO NOT SHOOT THIS". Generally, the target-tagger will put the J tag on whichever ship serves as the trigger for the next wave. If the trigger goes off prematurely, someone in the site is probably going to have an ... interesting time.

(As in: "I don't suppose any of the logibros brought hull rep drones?")

From what I hear J used to be Jammer targets, and some old guides still list widow fits to jam out specific targets, which were tagged J to avoid fleet wasting DPS on them until later. This was changed as about once a week, a widow would pop and be worth almost as much as the widow pilot had made, as jammers, like scrams/points, rip massive aggro.


Wait, a Widow, not a T1 Scorpion? o.O

From database dump, t1 scorpion doesn't have the jam strength to permajam most of the targets which are described as tag j, much less all of them simultaneously.

Talking more,

Flying crazier,

And drinking more

Making battleships worth the warp
Toshiro Hasegawa
Blackwater USA Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#644 - 2014-07-10 15:17:02 UTC
Awesome thread .. thanks for everyone's hard work putting it together, answering questions and keeping current. I tried to read the whole thing before posting questions .. although i will be honest and say i skipped page 24-28 ..anyhow.

I will preface my questions with a quick blurb on me, I am a on again, off again player since beta. I have done a little of a lot of things, mastered none of them and am looking to try out every part of EvE. I have never done incursions .. they didn’t exist for most of my eve career and once they were I was busy goofing around in null. Still havnt done LV4’s (I don’t think), SOE, WH (other than moving through them), T2 construction, Cap Fleet etc.. etc..

Incursions is on my list, and to get my character skills and equipment in place down the road I am doing leg work now. I have 90m SP but its spread all over from Industry, to Corp Management, to Caps, and not enough to gunnery .. I am in RvB atm and working gunnery hard, but going to take a while to get into T2 Large + specialisations, to say nothing of some BS V (only have Caladri BS V atm). I am not looking to do Inc for isk .. I want to do to experience a part of the game, and to work together with other players to achieve a goal as quickly and efficiently as possible.

Anyhow on with the questions

My questions are hopefully simple.

a) I dont have a good handle on how long "things" take. Time is a concern for me due to RL commitments (work, children, wife unit, household chores, yada yada). Most nights i might only have 1.5 hrs to play at most. More on the weekends of course. Is it possible, once in with a regular group ( i would assume that is possible) to log in, move to where one is needed, and join a couple of Inc and then log ? Cant it be done, and is that "polite"... as i am sure there is an etiquette.

I am patient and will to accept that if can not provide the time myself I should not expect the Inc community to bend over backwards to accommodate me, but I am sure there are others in my boat – so I am sure where the is a will there is a way.

b) Logi v DPS. I would like to have started as DPS, as I figure it might easier to learn the ropes as one of many DPS ships, rather than one of a few critical Logi ships. But Skill wise I might be able to start in a Basi today (not that I want to start today), I have Logi V and shield and energy and armour emissions V + decent shield and armour resists. Lacking in some things like don’t have Cap Management V for some reason that I am not sure of.

Would it be easier to start as DPS and then move to doing logi some times? Or does it matter .. if I was to start with a training group anyhow which I am sure Is the norm.

c) Lastly just wanted to confirm ships type(s). Having read most of the thread I know I probably looking at Nightmare, or Vindi as the ultimate goad.. has that changed at all? I know that over time CCP changes things and what is in vogue one month or year is not FOTM now. I can link eveboard if needed. I have never been a player who is good at fits and such .. whether playing DnD as a kid or now as a 40 yr old gamer. I will have to rely upon others to tell me whats good and whats needed. As my skills in gunnery are lacking across the board I do not see an issue with picking 1 ship type and working it on up.

Thanks in advance for any and all wise words of wisdom you might have.

History is the study of change.

Goldiiee
Bureau of Astronomical Anomalies
#645 - 2014-07-10 17:36:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Goldiiee
Toshiro Hasegawa wrote:
...

Hey Toshiro Hasegawa,
First of all an hour at a time can work, but there will be times that there is no room in fleet or there is no fleet, so you could find yourself wasting a bit of time. The etiquette is to let the FC know as soon as you know you have to go, if he/she knows your here for an hour and gone they can get someone in the waitlist ready for when you drop out, but no one holds it against you, when you gotta go you gotta go RL is always more important than EVE. ( I will probably be flamed for that comment)

Logi or DPS is just a matter of choice on your side. What do you enjoy more, blowing up red dots or fixing violet ones, if you like both then do what everyone does, do both. Since you seem to have the Logi requirements already you can probably find a fleet willing to show you the ropes and get you up to speed pretty easily. Remember Logi is a trust issue with groups, so they might have some big and small hoops for you to jump through before they accept you. That being said I know of several players in the same boat, (time constraints) they do pretty well logging into TeamSpeak, and letting the FC know they will be available as a Logi/DPS from 'dot to dot' and the FC can work around that.

Pretty much every community out there has a set Fit for each and every ship in a fleet with small variances allowed, but for the most part they/we have figured out what can and can't survive and what does and does not work within each community. Each group has slightly different fits depending somewhat on skills, and mostly on how confident they feel in the Logi's, high confidence leads to thinner tanks, low confidence to heavier tanks, it will all make sense after you get in a few fleets. So you don't need to know a lot about fitting as long as you can fit T2 everything, be it Logi or DPS, you can pretty much rely on the community to tell you what to fit.

Finally a note on ships for DPS;

I love the Vindi though it is a very hands on ship you will have to keep range on spawns, move in anticipation of spawns, and sometimes push your heart back down your throat because they run the thinnest tanks of the DPS ships (I am talking Shield Vindi).

A Nightmare is the Swiss knife of DPS, with instant-swap crystals to cover every range they can be hitting in optimal almost the entire time without moving at all, but often in need of a cap buddy to keep the lasers rolling, the new bonus to AB speeds has helped a lot but only pays for itself after finishing BS-V (Well possibly IV, depends on who you ask).

I will still live and die in my Mach, a 15 second cycle time give me time to survey the field, watch others, and do things like grabbing MTAC's, positioning, scouting and the myriad of other things that come up during a fleet, the 2000m/s gets me to where I want to be with, no muss no fuss, and the only time I ever think about or need Cap is when the Rats nuet me.

So pick a ship you like, or think you'll like and have a go at it, from one 40+yr old DnD gamer to another the best part of Incursions is not the ISK, or the adventure it's the friends you make in fleet and on TeamSpeak.

Hope this helped, and I hope to see you out there.

Things that keep me up at night;  Why do we use a voice communication device to send telegraphs? Moore's Law should state, Once you have paid off the last PC upgrade you will need another.
Toshiro Hasegawa
Blackwater USA Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#646 - 2014-07-10 17:55:46 UTC
perfect .. thanks. I will pick one of those 3 DPS ships and sort out which one makes me feel good inside.

i can see that regardless of what i fly and how i fly it and with whom, it will all take time to build up the player skills, and the personal relationships until at such a point it all runs smoothly, and there is going to be no way to force either to happen more quickly.

I guess i should also come up with a good plan for what to do when i doesnt look like an incursion is going to happen that night for whatever reason.

I forgot to ask one thing though .

My timezone AST (GMT -4) seems to fall into a limbo land between late Euro / UK and Early NA.. always seems that fleets and such are either winding down or just done when i log in, and new ones forming or merely being planned as i am having to log off. I am usually on at 01:00-03:00 roughly .. is there an equivelant lull in Inc running at that time of day/night .. or could that work in my favour with there being a few less people on with which to fight over spots .. I am going to answer a little bit of my own question by saying it probably depends on the group and there is no way to really know until i get in a channel for a few weeks and see how it goes .. but thought id ask anyhow .. as sometimes what people know amazes you.

thanks again for taking time to write up such a detailed answer.

History is the study of change.

Goldiiee
Bureau of Astronomical Anomalies
#647 - 2014-07-10 19:23:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Goldiiee
Toshiro Hasegawa wrote:
perfect .. thanks. I will pick one of those 3 DPS ships and sort out which one makes me feel good inside.

i can see that regardless of what i fly and how i fly it and with whom, it will all take time to build up the player skills, and the personal relationships until at such a point it all runs smoothly, and there is going to be no way to force either to happen more quickly.

I guess i should also come up with a good plan for what to do when i doesnt look like an incursion is going to happen that night for whatever reason.

I forgot to ask one thing though .

My timezone AST (GMT -4) seems to fall into a limbo land between late Euro / UK and Early NA.. always seems that fleets and such are either winding down or just done when i log in, and new ones forming or merely being planned as i am having to log off. I am usually on at 01:00-03:00 roughly .. is there an equivelant lull in Inc running at that time of day/night .. or could that work in my favour with there being a few less people on with which to fight over spots .. I am going to answer a little bit of my own question by saying it probably depends on the group and there is no way to really know until i get in a channel for a few weeks and see how it goes .. but thought id ask anyhow .. as sometimes what people know amazes you.

thanks again for taking time to write up such a detailed answer.

I think you will find plenty of fleets available at that time, the real dead spot is over Australia. And the heavy contest time (Both for sites and fleet space) is EU TZ, so you should find ample room to fit in, in your TZ.

Look for a few VG fleets with some of the US TZ groups, you should find they are helpful and always happy to get new members. Additionally VG run a lot faster so they can turn over members in fleet on a shorter notice.

A good reference is to join 'Incursion Public' chat channel their MOTD has a list and links to most of the very active groups with details as to when and what they run.

Edit; BTW I find the Epic Arc's are good way to pass the time while waiting for an Incursion spawn, the missions don't expire and each one has a final reward worth 200 to 300 mil (Except Minmatar, paltry 25mil).

Things that keep me up at night;  Why do we use a voice communication device to send telegraphs? Moore's Law should state, Once you have paid off the last PC upgrade you will need another.
Jeremy Kamira
#648 - 2014-07-12 05:20:16 UTC
I am reading up guides, and they are stating that at logi 4 you need 2 cap transfers and at logi 5 you only need 1. (Basilisk) Is this stating that all other cap skills are maxed? Or is it when they are all at 4?
Goldiiee
Bureau of Astronomical Anomalies
#649 - 2014-07-12 10:14:25 UTC  |  Edited by: Goldiiee
Jeremy Kamira wrote:
I am reading up guides, and they are stating that at logi 4 you need 2 cap transfers and at logi 5 you only need 1. (Basilisk) Is this stating that all other cap skills are maxed? Or is it when they are all at 4?

I had to check in EVE-HQ but it looks like you can have the cap management skills at 4 and still manage to be stable enough. But be forewarned, most communities accept Logi 5 pilots only since there are so many of them nowadays. A Logi 4 pilot requires the other Logi pilot to have two energy transfers to feed him leaving no energy transfers for fleet request.

Edit; Take a look at this post and the links I copied there for some more involved answers to the Logi questions.

Things that keep me up at night;  Why do we use a voice communication device to send telegraphs? Moore's Law should state, Once you have paid off the last PC upgrade you will need another.
Jeremy Kamira
#650 - 2014-07-12 20:20:13 UTC
Goldiiee wrote:
Jeremy Kamira wrote:
I am reading up guides, and they are stating that at logi 4 you need 2 cap transfers and at logi 5 you only need 1. (Basilisk) Is this stating that all other cap skills are maxed? Or is it when they are all at 4?

I had to check in EVE-HQ but it looks like you can have the cap management skills at 4 and still manage to be stable enough. But be forewarned, most communities accept Logi 5 pilots only since there are so many of them nowadays. A Logi 4 pilot requires the other Logi pilot to have two energy transfers to feed him leaving no energy transfers for fleet request.

Edit; Take a look at this post and the links I copied there for some more involved answers to the Logi questions.


Thanks, i am somewhat familiar with Eve-HQ but how do you see if two cap transfers will make the fit cap stable? I don't remember seeing any option to add something like that last time i was using it.
Goldiiee
Bureau of Astronomical Anomalies
#651 - 2014-07-12 21:04:50 UTC
Jeremy Kamira wrote:
Thanks, i am somewhat familiar with Eve-HQ but how do you see if two cap transfers will make the fit cap stable? I don't remember seeing any option to add something like that last time i was using it.

When you have your ship open in EveHQ Fitter select the 3rd tab at the bottom labeled 'Remote Effects' select a 4/2 basi fit (One you have made and saved) and Pilot, Click add and then put a check mark in one or two of the Cap transfers.

You can also add a OGB booster, by doing the same thing in the 'Fleet Effects' tab so you can see the represented tank when in fleet from one Basi Buddy, or add a few more to see the total fleet rep power.

Things that keep me up at night;  Why do we use a voice communication device to send telegraphs? Moore's Law should state, Once you have paid off the last PC upgrade you will need another.
Lord BryanII
#652 - 2014-07-26 13:31:49 UTC
What are the good shield groups these days?

ISN is not busy enough (no HQ fleet up now)
TVP is too busy (HQ fleet active but 30 people in wait list)
Nolak Ataru
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#653 - 2014-07-26 14:38:56 UTC
Lord BryanII wrote:
What are the good shield groups these days?

ISN is not busy enough (no HQ fleet up now)
TVP is too busy (HQ fleet active but 30 people in wait list)


Could join WTM (Warp To Me Incursions). We run HQs as well.
James Baboli
Warp to Pharmacy
#654 - 2014-07-27 12:36:43 UTC  |  Edited by: James Baboli
Nolak Ataru wrote:
Lord BryanII wrote:
What are the good shield groups these days?

ISN is not busy enough (no HQ fleet up now)
TVP is too busy (HQ fleet active but 30 people in wait list)


Could join WTM (Warp To Me Incursions). We run HQs as well.

Helix is good, but very focused in US TZ and very inactive outside US TZ, with the exception of our occasional (i.e. when I have a full day off and not too too much RL stuff besides work) 24hr fleets. Similar fits to ISN, but generally higher percentage of max skilled toons with good player skills behind them, even without the formalized vetting process of primary vs. secondary etc. 4 logi TCRCs in shiny fits is great fun.

Talking more,

Flying crazier,

And drinking more

Making battleships worth the warp
Nolak Ataru
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#655 - 2014-07-27 15:46:05 UTC
James Baboli wrote:
Nolak Ataru wrote:
Lord BryanII wrote:
What are the good shield groups these days?

ISN is not busy enough (no HQ fleet up now)
TVP is too busy (HQ fleet active but 30 people in wait list)


Could join WTM (Warp To Me Incursions). We run HQs as well.

Helix is good, but very focused in US TZ and very inactive outside US TZ, with the exception of our occasional (i.e. when I have a full day off and not too too much RL stuff besides work) 24hr fleets. Similar fits to ISN, but generally higher percentage of max skilled toons with good player skills behind them, even without the formalized vetting process of primary vs. secondary etc. 4 logi TCRCs in shiny fits is great fun.


Aye, I forgot about the VG fleets. Helix is another great community with good pilots.
James Baboli
Warp to Pharmacy
#656 - 2014-07-27 16:23:03 UTC
Nolak Ataru wrote:
James Baboli wrote:
Nolak Ataru wrote:
Lord BryanII wrote:
What are the good shield groups these days?

ISN is not busy enough (no HQ fleet up now)
TVP is too busy (HQ fleet active but 30 people in wait list)


Could join WTM (Warp To Me Incursions). We run HQs as well.

Helix is good, but very focused in US TZ and very inactive outside US TZ, with the exception of our occasional (i.e. when I have a full day off and not too too much RL stuff besides work) 24hr fleets. Similar fits to ISN, but generally higher percentage of max skilled toons with good player skills behind them, even without the formalized vetting process of primary vs. secondary etc. 4 logi TCRCs in shiny fits is great fun.


Aye, I forgot about the VG fleets. Helix is another great community with good pilots.

Uhm helix runs AS and HQs regularly. I won't say daily, and theres some weeks without an HQ or AS fleet, but we do run em man.

Talking more,

Flying crazier,

And drinking more

Making battleships worth the warp
Nolak Ataru
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#657 - 2014-07-28 13:52:39 UTC
James Baboli wrote:
Nolak Ataru wrote:
James Baboli wrote:
Nolak Ataru wrote:
Lord BryanII wrote:
What are the good shield groups these days?

ISN is not busy enough (no HQ fleet up now)
TVP is too busy (HQ fleet active but 30 people in wait list)


Could join WTM (Warp To Me Incursions). We run HQs as well.

Helix is good, but very focused in US TZ and very inactive outside US TZ, with the exception of our occasional (i.e. when I have a full day off and not too too much RL stuff besides work) 24hr fleets. Similar fits to ISN, but generally higher percentage of max skilled toons with good player skills behind them, even without the formalized vetting process of primary vs. secondary etc. 4 logi TCRCs in shiny fits is great fun.


Aye, I forgot about the VG fleets. Helix is another great community with good pilots.

Uhm helix runs AS and HQs regularly. I won't say daily, and theres some weeks without an HQ or AS fleet, but we do run em man.


You are 100% correct. This is what happens when I forumpost when sloshed.
James Baboli
Warp to Pharmacy
#658 - 2014-07-29 01:37:35 UTC
Protip: geting sloshed is for the FC's who aren't currently running the fleet. Not for forums, but for fleet and for those who don't have a vindi habit when sloshed.

Talking more,

Flying crazier,

And drinking more

Making battleships worth the warp
Nolak Ataru
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#659 - 2014-07-29 04:25:14 UTC
James Baboli wrote:
Protip: geting sloshed is for the FC's who aren't currently running the fleet. Not for forums, but for fleet and for those who don't have a vindi habit when sloshed.


I got a pod habit, does that count?
James Baboli
Warp to Pharmacy
#660 - 2014-07-29 06:09:19 UTC
Nolak Ataru wrote:
James Baboli wrote:
Protip: geting sloshed is for the FC's who aren't currently running the fleet. Not for forums, but for fleet and for those who don't have a vindi habit when sloshed.


I got a pod habit, does that count?

and a burning osprey addiction.

Talking more,

Flying crazier,

And drinking more

Making battleships worth the warp