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Should I give up on Null?
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Zappity
New Eden Tank Testing Services
#41 - 2014-07-26 21:07:54 UTC
Schmata Bastanold wrote:
It is a frakking game not a RL, just make a decision and all you can lose is pixels. I have no idea why people insist so much on making their playtime so horrible and not enjoyable.

The depth of the game means that it can become a hobby rather than just a game. That results in a greater time commitment and better organisation which is turn results in optimal solutions. Which might not be fun.

I have a lot of respect for the people who run the large alliances and coalitions. But it sure isn't a great advertisement for null: "Want to do it right? Join the bureaucracy! Or rent!" I look forward to seeing null options for people who have neither the time or inclination for that type of play.

Zappity's Adventures for a taste of lowsec and nullsec.
Zappity
New Eden Tank Testing Services
#42 - 2014-07-26 21:10:33 UTC
Otuk Andven wrote:
Rhes wrote:
Otuk Andven wrote:
I don't mind APIs and I did like the people in the corp.

What I don't like is the registering on 2 forums that I'll never post on just to be able to register on another website to be able to access the coalition coms and access doctrines. Then have to fill out multiple forms for SRP.

That's what I dislike about null

You poor thing. You had to put in a tiny bit of effort to get free ships. Roll


ok check to make sure your flying with a valid fleet commander, write down his name, find his SRP ID (which is not written down anywhere in-game). Make sure you were flying a doctrine ship. Find out there is another authentication thing you have to do, get authenticated. Send off application. Then wait and discover SRP is not paying out due to alliance drama, theft and leadership changes.

Never matter anyway as I never lost anything larger than a destroyer (at least on a alliance fleet), lost some stuff to importune anti-raiding action with isn't covered by SRP

whats your SRP programme?

Oh. How do people learn to fit ships if they only ever fly doctrine?

Zappity's Adventures for a taste of lowsec and nullsec.
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#43 - 2014-07-26 21:20:44 UTC
Well, at their peak apparently TEST considers something like a month or so to be a decent backlog of reimbursement

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Schmata Bastanold
In Boobiez We Trust
#44 - 2014-07-26 22:08:48 UTC
Zappity wrote:
Schmata Bastanold wrote:
It is a frakking game not a RL, just make a decision and all you can lose is pixels. I have no idea why people insist so much on making their playtime so horrible and not enjoyable.

The depth of the game means that it can become a hobby rather than just a game. That results in a greater time commitment and better organisation which is turn results in optimal solutions. Which might not be fun.

I have a lot of respect for the people who run the large alliances and coalitions. But it sure isn't a great advertisement for null: "Want to do it right? Join the bureaucracy! Or rent!" I look forward to seeing null options for people who have neither the time or inclination for that type of play.


Well, OP doesn't run alliance or coalition, he's a cog in machine as he said himself. So no big deal about packing pair of clean socks and warp through null to nearest hi/low in ceptor. Again, what can go wrong with that? Somebody will feel offended or betrayed or other silly emo over pixels? Even better!

Invalid signature format
Heinrich Erquilenne
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#45 - 2014-07-26 23:46:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Heinrich Erquilenne
Otuk Andven wrote:
I've been in Null for 6 months and I'm not sure if I want to give up or not.

I'll admit I've always been a PvEer at heart, I PvP but its not my main goal in the game.

In this time with my corp I've moved from 2 alliances, rented for 3 months and trekked up and down the map at least twice. Been in a few big fleet fights and a good number of small ones, generally died without many kills. Never seen an enemy capital.

While the ISK from PvE is great, a 100m from relic sites for example I just can't enjoy the null sec population.

Its the bureaucracy of it all, providing API for this, join forum/website X and Y, get this authenticated so you can use the channel. And that even before you get into alliance politics with people leaving, drama, constant doctrine changes, com and PvE/industrial people being looked down on. And then there is the bitterness of the enemy, cloaky hot droppers who are left in system 23/7 so you can't do anything with it, constant raids and fighting for the sake of it.

You never feel like anything more than a cog in a machine that doesn't really care about you.

So I have 2 choices either move with the corp to yet another alliance or leave and try something else, either W-space or FW.


Okay so the API thing with multiple websites to register on will happen in most of the nullsec alliances which are here to stay. Now if you enjoy pve why don't you join an alliance living in npc nullsec space? Missionning is safer than farming anomalies for quite obvious reasons. You won't get the shiny officer module you're looking for but LP stores may have an ok profitability and the rewards are around 3-4 times the highsec ones.

Now if the issue is that the doctrines are always changing and people are looking down haulers and people bringing the **** they play with from highsec or god-knows-where, the issue is people in your alliance, not nullsec itself. I don't get the issue about cloaky hot dropper either, just go 3-4 systems away and fly a fast aligning T2 cruiser... This isn't a nullsec issue either. If you want to fly battleships to shoot at red crosses you're indeed in the wrong place.

If the issue is the lack of blue standing with the local inhabitants then again the issue is your alliance. There will be neutrals and reds no matter what you do but a good alliance will do its best to allow people to farm because that's where the money comes from, and the abundance of money greatly reduces drama. Fighting with people who live in the same region is stupid. If your alliance doesn't provide the right standings to avoid unwanted pvp then leave it. PvP is fun only if you're ready for it and not fighting for your life 24/7. Pirate
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#46 - 2014-07-26 23:55:09 UTC
The new Mordus ships are...

wow, pretty goonrushed. amazing, what's the isk per hour on those now

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Super spikinator
Hegemonous Conscripts
#47 - 2014-07-27 00:32:29 UTC
Zappity wrote:
Otuk Andven wrote:
Rhes wrote:
Otuk Andven wrote:
I don't mind APIs and I did like the people in the corp.

What I don't like is the registering on 2 forums that I'll never post on just to be able to register on another website to be able to access the coalition coms and access doctrines. Then have to fill out multiple forms for SRP.

That's what I dislike about null

You poor thing. You had to put in a tiny bit of effort to get free ships. Roll


ok check to make sure your flying with a valid fleet commander, write down his name, find his SRP ID (which is not written down anywhere in-game). Make sure you were flying a doctrine ship. Find out there is another authentication thing you have to do, get authenticated. Send off application. Then wait and discover SRP is not paying out due to alliance drama, theft and leadership changes.

Never matter anyway as I never lost anything larger than a destroyer (at least on a alliance fleet), lost some stuff to importune anti-raiding action with isn't covered by SRP

whats your SRP programme?

Oh. How do people learn to fit ships if they only ever fly doctrine?


It has been my experience that generally speaking, nobody knows how to fit ships in EvE.
Otuk Andven
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#48 - 2014-07-27 07:49:42 UTC  |  Edited by: Otuk Andven
Heinrich Erquilenne wrote:


Now if the issue is that the doctrines are always changing and people are looking down haulers and people bringing the **** they play with from highsec or god-knows-where, the issue is people in your alliance, not nullsec itself. I don't get the issue about cloaky hot dropper either, just go 3-4 systems away and fly a fast aligning T2 cruiser... This isn't a nullsec issue either. If you want to fly battleships to shoot at red crosses you're indeed in the wrong place.


Problem is all my skills are focused around caldari missile ships and the local rats were weak to EM, the raven was the only ship that isn't bonused to kinetic. So I could never do and ratting so I just did relic sites. Didn't matter because even with the raven with EM mods at 100km off they still melted my shields Also they had the entire pocket camped, the only systems that wasn't where pipeline systems and I wasn't going to risk that.
J'Poll
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#49 - 2014-07-27 08:18:40 UTC
Otuk Andven wrote:
I've been in Null for 6 months and I'm not sure if I want to give up or not.

I'll admit I've always been a PvEer at heart, I PvP but its not my main goal in the game.

In this time with my corp I've moved from 2 alliances, rented for 3 months and trekked up and down the map at least twice. Been in a few big fleet fights and a good number of small ones, generally died without many kills. Never seen an enemy capital.

While the ISK from PvE is great, a 100m from relic sites for example I just can't enjoy the null sec population.

Its the bureaucracy of it all, providing API for this, join forum/website X and Y, get this authenticated so you can use the channel. And that even before you get into alliance politics with people leaving, drama, constant doctrine changes, com and PvE/industrial people being looked down on. And then there is the bitterness of the enemy, cloaky hot droppers who are left in system 23/7 so you can't do anything with it, constant raids and fighting for the sake of it.

You never feel like anything more than a cog in a machine that doesn't really care about you.

So I have 2 choices either move with the corp to yet another alliance or leave and try something else, either W-space or FW.


So, you went to null to expect you could PvE on furtile grounds without defending them etc...ReallyRoll.


And now you are considering W-Space or FW...WHAHAHAHAHA.

Oh, wait, you will be stabbed-plex farmer number 2.493.359 in FWWhat?

Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy

Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded

Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar / The Content Club
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#50 - 2014-07-27 08:18:44 UTC
Otuk Andven wrote:
Its the bureaucracy of it all, providing API for this, join forum/website X and Y, get this authenticated so you can use the channel. And that even before you get into alliance politics with people leaving, drama, constant doctrine changes, com and PvE/industrial people being looked down on. And then there is the bitterness of the enemy, cloaky hot droppers who are left in system 23/7 so you can't do anything with it, constant raids and fighting for the sake of it.



Imagine if Eve went dark and all those alpha nerds were released back into society....

Bring back DEEEEP Space!
J'Poll
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#51 - 2014-07-27 08:20:07 UTC
Riot Girl wrote:
Hi, I used to live in nullsec until I realised it was populated by guys like you, people who want easy ISK from PvE. Shortly after that I decided I didn't need the help of alliances to do pretty much whatever I want in the game. SOV is meaningless, use whatever space you want and most people just dock up in fear (which makes getting kills easy).

Hope this information can be useful to you.


This.

The thing that I think is horribly wrong is all the carebears expecting others to defend their space so that they can bear in safety.

Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy

Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded

Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar / The Content Club
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#52 - 2014-07-27 08:29:04 UTC
J'Poll wrote:
So, you went to null to expect you could PvE on furtile grounds without defending them etc...ReallyRoll.

And now you are considering W-Space or FW...WHAHAHAHAHA.

Oh, wait, you will be stabbed-plex farmer number 2.493.359 in FWWhat?

My my, is that what FW is now?

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Heinrich Erquilenne
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#53 - 2014-07-27 08:56:23 UTC  |  Edited by: Heinrich Erquilenne
Otuk Andven wrote:
Heinrich Erquilenne wrote:


Now if the issue is that the doctrines are always changing and people are looking down haulers and people bringing the **** they play with from highsec or god-knows-where, the issue is people in your alliance, not nullsec itself. I don't get the issue about cloaky hot dropper either, just go 3-4 systems away and fly a fast aligning T2 cruiser... This isn't a nullsec issue either. If you want to fly battleships to shoot at red crosses you're indeed in the wrong place.


Problem is all my skills are focused around caldari missile ships and the local rats were weak to EM, the raven was the only ship that isn't bonused to kinetic. So I could never do and ratting so I just did relic sites. Didn't matter because even with the raven with EM mods at 100km off they still melted my shields Also they had the entire pocket camped, the only systems that wasn't where pipeline systems and I wasn't going to risk that.


Okay, so maybe moving out of your current region would be a good start to improve your nullsec experience if you play caldari ships? Like, moving to a place having rats not doing a lot of EM damage... Since your corp and alliance seem to suck anyway it won't be a great loss.

I haven't skilled missile boats myself yet so I don't know caldari ships well beyond inties but using a raven in nullsec is suicidal, to say the least. Have you considered something like a Cerberus? It seems it has nice range bonuses and many rats won't fire beyond 80km (well except in the odd place you live in).
Otuk Andven
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#54 - 2014-07-27 09:19:08 UTC
Heinrich Erquilenne wrote:


Okay, so maybe moving out of your current region would be a good start to improve your nullsec experience if you play caldari ships? Like, moving to a place having rats not doing a lot of EM damage... Since your corp and alliance seem to suck anyway it won't be a great loss.

I haven't skilled missile boats myself yet so I don't know caldari ships well beyond inties but using a raven in nullsec is suicidal, to say the least. Have you considered something like a Cerberus? It seems it has nice range bonuses and many rats won't fire beyond 80km (well except in the odd place you live in).


I was in HERO in Catch so yeah. No offense HERO I've been trying not to mention you directly.

I've only recently finished training for the Cerberus, but I was too poor to buy one at the time and the situation there was falling apart already. So I've sold a lot of my junk I'd picked up and is trying to get into incursions with my lv5 basilisk. Which I never saw anyone using in null.
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#55 - 2014-07-27 09:41:38 UTC
Otuk Andven wrote:
So I've sold a lot of my junk I'd picked up and is trying to get into incursions with my lv5 basilisk. Which I never saw anyone using in null.

Level 5 Basilisk

Yeah, incursion are the way to go. Highsec ones, of course.

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Malcolm Shinhwa
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#56 - 2014-07-27 13:01:13 UTC  |  Edited by: Malcolm Shinhwa
Otuk Andven wrote:


ok check to make sure your flying with a valid fleet commander, write down his name, find his SRP ID (which is not written down anywhere in-game). Make sure you were flying a doctrine ship. Find out there is another authentication thing you have to do, get authenticated. Send off application. Then wait and discover SRP is not paying out due to alliance drama, theft and leadership changes.

Never matter anyway as I never lost anything larger than a destroyer (at least on a alliance fleet), lost some stuff to importune anti-raiding action with isn't covered by SRP

whats your SRP programme?


Fill out form with:

My Name
Link to lossmail
Text of jabber ping describing fleet
Short funny joke (really "comment on death", but i put a joke in there for the SRP guys)
Stratop/Peacetime
FC/Not-FC

Click submit. 2 or 3 days later get paid.

TNT has their collective stuff together. As for the indy guy hate, I don't think you'll find anyone currently more loved in my corp than the guy who built, shipped, and put up on corp contracts a ton of ships for us in Delve. The only people I see in Northstar that might get hate are people who try to play solo and just use the corp for a chat channel to whine in when their ishtar is tackled in a Sanctum.

Find people you like flying with, and fly with them. If you want to be a solo player, then go to NPC nullsec, or better yet as someone suggested above, run L4s in hisec.

[i]"The purpose of fighting is to win. There is no possible victory in defense. The sword is more important than the shield and skill is more important than either. The final weapon is the brain. All else is supplemental[/i]."
Malcolm Shinhwa
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#57 - 2014-07-27 13:26:21 UTC
Zappity wrote:
Schmata Bastanold wrote:
It is a frakking game not a RL, just make a decision and all you can lose is pixels. I have no idea why people insist so much on making their playtime so horrible and not enjoyable.

The depth of the game means that it can become a hobby rather than just a game. That results in a greater time commitment and better organisation which is turn results in optimal solutions. Which might not be fun.

I have a lot of respect for the people who run the large alliances and coalitions. But it sure isn't a great advertisement for null: "Want to do it right? Join the bureaucracy! Or rent!" I look forward to seeing null options for people who have neither the time or inclination for that type of play.


They have those options already. NPC nullsec.

I really have no idea how N3/PL does things. But I don't understand all the bureaucracy stuff. When I joined Northstar I spent about 30min signing up for their, TNT, and CFC forums and coms. Then I never had to mess with it again. If I want to make isk I undock my ship and shoot red crosses. If I want to go shoot people, and don't care about the SRP, then I get a couple of buddies together and we go shoot stuff. If I'd like SRP, then I wait for a ping from an FC (they come about every 3 hours in Dek, in Delve sometimes once an hour), then join that fleet and go with 200 other cool guys and kill stuff.

At least for a line monkey like myself, there is no 'bureaucracy".

[i]"The purpose of fighting is to win. There is no possible victory in defense. The sword is more important than the shield and skill is more important than either. The final weapon is the brain. All else is supplemental[/i]."
Pertuabo Enkidgan
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#58 - 2014-07-27 13:58:19 UTC
Airdorn wrote:
Just quit and be your own boss.

I quit Snigg / PL 3 years ago and I've been solo ever since. Best thing I ever did.

There's always something new to do.

1. Ninja salvage player battlefield T2 wrecks, loot (fly to big blobs on map)

2. Explore w-space in a good ship like a Stratios and kill C1 - C3 sleepers

3. Kill low-sec belt pirates for the possible Mordu's BPC drop, valuable mining upgrade drop, clone soldier tags, etc. Low-sec has gotten much much better lately.

4. Do some occasional solo pirating

5. Drop siphons on random people's dyspro moon and count your MONEY"S

6, Run ghost sites for great MONEY"S

And on and on.

My life as well for the most part. Big smileIts pretty fun, although I'll have to try that siphon moon stuff. Now and then if I want I can head to syndicate and group up with CAS and engage in group pvp for faster pvp access, but the most things I do as well are listed here.
Hra Neuvosto
Party Cat Enterprises
#59 - 2014-07-27 14:02:07 UTC
FYI you can still do solo pvp, go wormholing or exploring even if you're in a null alliance; so really it just adds another layer of things you can do (large fleet fights) and doesn't restrict much.
Pertuabo Enkidgan
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#60 - 2014-07-27 14:25:23 UTC
Ashlar Maidstone wrote:

Nulsec is really much safer than hisec I can tell you that personally from the experience I gained. I wouldn't trade it for nothing.


I can't really agree with that, now, if you say Providence was more safer than Hisec, I'd say they're about the same.