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Crius Issues

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Macaya
Little Builders
#261 - 2014-07-22 20:46:08 UTC
Roll back now... this is fail
Ivan Isovich
Clutter Conglomerate
CAStabouts
#262 - 2014-07-22 20:47:33 UTC
In Station Services window, the "Guests" tab is showing the correct count of players in station, but isn't updating the guest list automatically...When I click on the Guests tab title, it refreshes and shows the full list.
Ivan Isovich
Clutter Conglomerate
CAStabouts
#263 - 2014-07-22 20:49:59 UTC
FireLiar wrote:
Pavlakakos wrote:
So, as a former proud owner of a caldari station with 2 upgrades that costed several billions, i used to have slots for people to research and invent. The job cost was defined by me and it helped pay for the sov costs.

Now all the money goes to "Secure Commerce Commision", even my own that use my own labs.... You're trolling me apparently yes? What's the point in owning station in 0.0?

Well, time for War Thunder i guess. Or maybe Star Citizen if it ever goes public.


This goes almost the same for POS owners. I used POS's in empire to not only get away from the insane research time in stations but was also nice not having to worry about any taxes. Owning a POS now has no benefit besides the quicker time to finish the job. In my opinion thats not worth the insane taxes!!

Be nice if they didn't wait till the 17th to tell everyone about this and not even give any examples of the costs! H*ll i would of taken down the POS's sooner.... oh well. back to deconstructing my isks makers. enjoy all the benefits T2 builders. this patch seems to just benefit you.


Except for post after post after post that showed this as well as access to the test server. Things change. Change with it or become obsolete.
Ivan Isovich
Clutter Conglomerate
CAStabouts
#264 - 2014-07-22 20:53:21 UTC
Antihype2 wrote:


Bug 2:

Reprocessing ore at a pos doesn't show any window about how many minerals are coming out of the ore. The ore is directly reprocessed without any further note.


Also saw this issue when testing an Intensive Reprocessing Array.
Theodore Knox
Ducks in Outer Space
#265 - 2014-07-22 20:56:29 UTC
One of the biggest issues I'm struggling with it the number of so-called Industrialists who appear to have not read the Dev Blogs about massive industry changes.

I thought we were a smarter breed of player...

Also, forcing all POS jobs to use the master wallet sux. lots. of. ass. Can we at least get a change wallet option, or better yet, a personal wallet option?

/Theo
chmeee kzin
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#266 - 2014-07-22 20:56:37 UTC
Ivan Isovich wrote:
In Station Services window, the "Guests" tab is showing the correct count of players in station, but isn't updating the guest list automatically...When I click on the Guests tab title, it refreshes and shows the full list.




Same here. Thought the dev blog said that this issue would be resolved with the release of Crius. Just made it worse.
Davethethird
Kayama Technology
#267 - 2014-07-22 21:02:46 UTC
OMG why am I looking at an invention time around 7 times longer than before at my own POS and you are even charging me for it.

"Thanks to all the players for getting us to where we are today, we really appreciate what you have done, every one of you, the time you have all invested in our game, not to mention the money is unprecedented"

zzzxxzccxgczxzz\x........ FUBAR translation into CCP speak.............

Whaaahahahaha... what a bunch of idiots, did they really think we would do something that actually works well and doesnt screw over all those players that have spent loadsamoney and time building their accounts just to see it all handed to newbs and big alliances in one night, just wait for the next installment of "screw the loyal customers"

Can you tell that I am a little upset after spending 8 years playing this game.... I don't know which is more sad, me for playing the game for so long or me for caring about it this much to rant the way I am. Maybe I need to sack this game off and get a life.

Evil
Jed Clampett
Doomheim
#268 - 2014-07-22 21:03:13 UTC
Moo Moocow wrote:
Correct me if I'm wrong but you now have to pay for research and copying in your own pos...

Doesn't that bypass the point of having your own pos and paying its set up and fuel bill?

And the requirement for corp wallet access to pay for jobs in your pos is just mindboggling


Have not looked at changes yet. But I always had to have corp wallet access (we have an account division with no ISK in it). And POS allowed Corp to set charges for industry to any level ( including zero charge), Such fees for POS industry was paid to corp.

Now if you mean that Crius POS has industry fees which are not controlled by the POS owner and those fee are paid to NPCs...yeah there might a firestorm over that.

Although I can see an argument for such fees in Empire space based on CCP empire labor pool rationale for new industrial pricing (ROFLMAO reverse logic of automated AI robotic industry machines being replaced by humans - George Jetson button pushers at least). Maybe industrial fees go to sovereignty holder? But that should mean POS wh can use old union/welfare breaking full automation since no one has sovereignty or control over industrial labor pool.

Heh anyways just because CCP can come up with storyline to rationalize POS fees being paid to NPCs doesn't mean doing so won't make for protests and subscription cancellations dwarfing the original Burn Jita times. Hope you are wrong about new fees.
Pavlakakos
W.A.S.P
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
#269 - 2014-07-22 21:03:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Pavlakakos
Ivan Isovich wrote:
Things change. Change with it or become obsolete.


Well, i have always been under the impression that you change something that does not work well and try to improve it. Which apparently here is not the case.

Apart from the new trendy ISK sink (taxes) tell me who will actually benefit from those changes?
Null bears that pay now taxes on their own stations?
Empire bears that will buy a new bpo and throw billions researching them, only to find out that they'll never actually make enough money to break even?

Best part will be in a few months when a coercer with T1 mods will be costing 100 mil and everybody then will be crying about "inflation".

Besides, as i said... being a null station owner, where's my frikking rent from the secure commerce? They take money from the players to do their research in my station, but what do they pay me for having a representative in null? (which is supposed to be lawless and Concord does not exist).

As for obsolete, yes, i am already...... Just waiting for August 18th, when the plex on my 3 accounts expire.

*Edit: Typos (i'm so tilted).
Myriad Blaze
Common Sense Ltd
Nulli Secunda
#270 - 2014-07-22 21:04:40 UTC
Quote:
From the patchnotes:
"You no longer need skills to fit modules and rigs. You will not, however, be able to online modules you don‘t have skills for."

This works as noted (everyone can fit for example T2 rigs to their ship without having any rigging skill).
However, rigs need no skills to be effective. Attention
This means rigging skills only affect drawback now. If the change was intended to work this way the skill requirements for rigs should be removed from the Requirement tab in the Info Window as it makes no sense now.
Longinius Spear
Semper Ubi Sub Ubi
#271 - 2014-07-22 21:14:22 UTC
Jed Clampett wrote:
Longinius Spear wrote:
You guys may want to have a look at wormhole T2 manufacturing. Current build prices for a Paladin and Vagur are 750m+.

Thats on top of of material cost. This essentially doubles the cost of T2 marauder construction.

This must be a bug, because if its not, i'm at a loss for words.



Its my assumption that the increase is by design.

First I suspect CCP needs to increase NPC ISK sinks to replace all those NPC products now produced by players. LP stores and BPOs are about the only NPC ISK sinks remaining outside market and NPC Industry fees and taxes. Yet all the old NPC ISK faucets adding ISK into the economy still remain :missions etc. Too much money tends to make prices of big ticket items like PLEX rise. LOL - I for one am grateful CCP has not yet increased market taxes and fees based on Empire wartime economics.

I am sure CCP has other reasons too, though those reasons might be harder to guess. Perhaps CCP feels that T2 (high technology) prices should rise to simulate Empire NPC military demand or restrictions.

Also I am pretty sure CCP blogs said that they want to increase favorability of use of player facilities like POS and outposts. Note all those T2 build and research fees can instead be deducted from POS fuel and operating costs. Run some spreadsheets but I suspect its now actually PROFITABLE to run a pure T2 ship building or invention POS compared to many NPC stations given the right sized tower and ships.

But yeah I knew early on that some industry costs were about to see shocking change. So if change is not a mistake, I think CCP made major mistake in how they marketed the changes as "favoring the individual player". Instead they should have said "the impact may be unpleasant to individuals and old patterns of play but supports EVE's overall long term health and growth in the following ways..." then coughed up specifical why they really made the changes.



There is NO way this is by design. No way.

With a material cost of 780m and a current sell cost of 940m, and with this software change adding ANOTHER 750million isk to even MAKE IT in wormhole space.

This puts the cost of a Paladin around 1.5b overnight. If this is by design, BUY PALADINS NOW!! Because there will NEVER be any made at that price again.

There is no way CCP could be this irresponsible with its economy. 10% here and there, sure, but not 100% here and there. No way. I have greater faith in them.


Read more of my ramblings on my blog www.invadingyourhole.blogspot.com
Rivr Luzade
Coreli Corporation
Pandemic Legion
#272 - 2014-07-22 21:16:16 UTC
Lines going all over the window and even outside.

How to create?

Select a BP for manufacturing with many materials. Double click the top bar (title bar) to contract the window and double click again to expand it again. Observe the lines go crazy.

UI Improvement Collective

My ridicule, heavy criticism and general pale outlook about your or CCP's ideas is nothing but an encouragement to prove me wrong. Give it a try.
tu pac
Tri Corp Solutions
#273 - 2014-07-22 21:18:11 UTC  |  Edited by: tu pac
Have been in game for many years and this is by far the biggest mess up in Eve history......It has been ill thought out and has done nothing other than to alienate individuals who have been loyal to indy Eve over the past years.

The whole indy mechanic has been ruined by individuals from CCP who are intent on making sure that new players and older players can compete at nearly the same level so as to make sure that 50K players can be online.

Its a real shame its got to this however of all the expansions there have been this will effect Eve more than any.... The price in players leaving the game will be high but if all CCP want is a shoot um up they've got it. Absolutly crazzy...Well done CCP

CCP stop trying to push players into low sec and 0.0, some players just don't want to be thereor have got bored of being there. Embrace what you have and improve the game for the individuals as opposed to trying to direct then where they don't what to go.

If players what to be in 0.0 or low sec they will migrate there

CCP saye this expasnsion is by design, this is a serious error in judgement .

Its time to seriously think about the council and look towards a balance of indy and PvP it seems a little one sided at the moment
Moo Moocow
Hard Knocks Inc.
Hard Knocks Citizens
#274 - 2014-07-22 21:21:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Moo Moocow
Jed Clampett wrote:
Moo Moocow wrote:
Correct me if I'm wrong but you now have to pay for research and copying in your own pos...

Doesn't that bypass the point of having your own pos and paying its set up and fuel bill?

And the requirement for corp wallet access to pay for jobs in your pos is just mindboggling


Have not looked at changes yet. But I always had to have corp wallet access (we have an account division with no ISK in it). And POS allowed Corp to set charges for industry to any level ( including zero charge), Such fees for POS industry was paid to corp.

Now if you mean that Crius POS has industry fees which are not controlled by the POS owner and those fee are paid to NPCs...yeah there might a firestorm over that.

Although I can see an argument for such fees in Empire space based on CCP empire labor pool rationale for new industrial pricing (ROFLMAO reverse logic of automated AI robotic industry machines being replaced by humans - George Jetson button pushers at least). Maybe industrial fees go to sovereignty holder? But that should mean POS wh can use old union/welfare breaking full automation since no one has sovereignty or control over industrial labor pool.

Heh anyways just because CCP can come up with storyline to rationalize POS fees being paid to NPCs doesn't mean doing so won't make for protests and subscription cancellations dwarfing the original Burn Jita times. Hope you are wrong about new fees.


I don't believe the fees are controlled by the pos owner.
(But as I'm a guest at the pos I can't be 100% sure. but I doubt it. I'm pretty sure its an isk sink)

I don't have corp wallet access atm so it seems I can't pay the fee's and put in research jobs. Which I was able to do before.
It would be a lot easier to have an option to pay the fee's from that alts wallet.

(I'm also hearing quotes of 2+ billion to research a capital blueprint ME to the next level... Really?)
tu pac
Tri Corp Solutions
#275 - 2014-07-22 21:23:23 UTC  |  Edited by: tu pac
Whow Moros prices will go through the roof

2.8B isk to improve a Moros BPO from -9 to -10 great to see your have this all sorted CCP
Lady Aesir
Ghost Recon Inc
#276 - 2014-07-22 21:27:51 UTC
CCP Contra wrote:
Fixy FixIT wrote:
When installing a job at a POS, the cost of installing the job is being taken from the Corp Master Wallet........

Surely, this cost should come from the member who is installing the job. Even better if it was deducted from the member and given to the Corp Master Wallet as charge for using corp labs.

Currently its given to Secure Commerce Commission.

Is this intentional or is it a bug ?

Regards.


By Design

Surely this is incorrect
If member install jobs in a corp POS and the fee is taken from the corp wallet then what is the point of having a corp tax rate on the jobs because it is being paid by the corp and not the individual. This makes no sense the corp gets charged twice.
Once to CCP ISK Sink
Second to Corp as a tax but paid by the corp to the corp.

Come on you must have replaced your economist with a competent replacement who would have pointed out such a crazy system.
Jed Clampett
Doomheim
#277 - 2014-07-22 21:28:55 UTC  |  Edited by: Jed Clampett
Jed Clampett wrote:
"Use Blueprint" right click menu option does not seem to do anything when used on BPC even when docked in station with suitable Invention or Manufacture facilities. (BPC is NOT in container and subject to that flaw.)

I sort of expected the new Industry and Research window to pop up & allow starting Invention or Manufacture jobs when the station where the BPC is located has such options.

P.S. If the station lacks such facilities I expect a warning message stating that lack at the very least or the Industry window showing the BPC with simply no options available to select.

P.P.S. I do not immediately see another way to select BPCs and start Invention jobs without "Use Blueprint" working as expected. That is any alternative UI means is NOT as intuitive as likely assumed and may depend on prior UI experiences which not everyone has.



OK "use Blueprint" still does nothing BUT with sufficient mouse key pounding and waiting selecting BPs in the industry UI does work. Awefully sluggish though.

And I did have to specifically switch to the Item hangar list. I assume that locked BP containers issue is also interfering with the whole station list of BPs when that list includes containers with BPs.
Captain StringfellowHawk
Forsaken Reavers
#278 - 2014-07-22 21:29:17 UTC
Pavlakakos wrote:
Ivan Isovich wrote:
Things change. Change with it or become obsolete.


Well, i have always been under the impression that you change something that does not work well and try to improve it. Which apparently here is not the case.

Apart from the new trendy ISK sink (taxes) tell me who will actually benefit from those changes?
Null bears that pay now taxes on their own stations?
Empire bears that will buy a new bpo and throw billions researching them, only to find out that they'll never actually make enough money to break even?

Best part will be in a few months when a coercer with T1 mods will be costing 100 mil and everybody then will be crying about "inflation".

Besides, as i said... being a null station owner, where's my frikking rent from the secure commerce? They take money from the players to do their research in my station, but what do they pay me for having a representative in null? (which is supposed to be lawless and Concord does not exist).

As for obsolete, yes, i am already...... Just waiting for August 18th, when the plex on my 3 accounts expire.

*Edit: Typos (i'm so tilted).


Outposts could easily be Taxed by the Empire. After all you pay SOV fees to who? In order to hold your SOV in "Lawless" space where Concord doesn't Exist. Fee's are paid regardless this is just the Empires now flexing more muscle. It's Not like your space was Free of Cost prior to Crius.
tu pac
Tri Corp Solutions
#279 - 2014-07-22 21:31:45 UTC  |  Edited by: tu pac
Duplicate post
Captain StringfellowHawk
Forsaken Reavers
#280 - 2014-07-22 21:31:57 UTC
Tech 2 Sentries and Sentries in General are still posting different damage ratings on ships. When I logged into Game my Rattle showed 1620.8 DPS with Inferno precision missiles and Garde II's with 3dda's and 3BCS. Now it is showing 1275.9 DPS after an ammo reload. Occasional relogs show the DPS back at 1620.8 But then once again an ammo reload occurs the damage drops down. This happens in other ships also like the Domi , Ishtar, pretty much any drone boat.