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Lasers- why?

Author
Derrick Miles
Death Rabbit Ky Oneida
#21 - 2014-07-22 08:13:51 UTC
Because lazors look bright and flashy and it's the next best thing to painting an abaddon neon pink.
Kaaeliaa
Tyrannos Sunset
#22 - 2014-07-22 08:17:10 UTC
PotatoOverdose wrote:
Scorch. That's a bout it.

Also some of the laser bonused hulls are really good. You can't really look at a weapon system without looking at the hulls that use said weapons.


This is the correct answer. Too many Pyfaphiles staring at the numbers and not enough trying the ships and pew-pewing.

"Do not lift the veil. Do not show the door. Do not split the dream."

Jake Warbird
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#23 - 2014-07-22 09:09:16 UTC
Tau Cabalander wrote:
Kuroi Aurgnet wrote:
Can someone enlighten me as to why lasers? Tons of people use lasers- and amarr ships are extremely popular. why? Basically- what do lasers have that set them apart from other guns, and make them so desirable?

One word: Scorch.

Read it too fast and got all excited. Dammnit.
Nalelmir Ahashion
Industrial Management and Engineering
Mouth Trumpet Cavalry
#24 - 2014-07-22 09:28:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Nalelmir Ahashion
Scorsigaar wrote:
Multicolor Disco Laserboat Lightshow in Space.

Cmon now...party like Amarr Big smile


damn! ninja'd

EDIT:
Regarding projection...
you realize people that with 1 click you are always on optimal range yes?
and I really hope that on any gun ship u use you install at least 1 tracking computer with 2 scripts (tracking\optimal) for the right moments.

Also... tracking? Apocalypse. nuff said.
Kagura Nikon
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#25 - 2014-07-22 09:38:53 UTC
Damen Apol wrote:
Extreme tracking with amazing damage projection.

What more is there to love?

Projectile weapons are complete and total ass so they're out. Hybrids can be p. good, blasters are the hands-down best ganking thing for catalysts and stuff, and railrax/raildeimos is p. dope too, but dat tracking and projection on lasers m8.

light missile launchers are p. dope too.

I'm speaking from the perspective of pvp btw



They have BAD tracking. Pulses are the worse tracking of the short range weapons.




Lasers advantage lies in range. THey have the lognest range without dmage mitigation from any short range weapon. THat measn they effectively can do more damage on any figght that is more than 2 people invovled before target explodes. Blasters have the best trackign and insane damage. AC are yet again with no reason to be sicne the minamtar ships and TE were nerfed several times in a row in a huge exageration while buffing blasters at same time (now you need to be insane to bring AC instead of blasters except if you can field an AC fallooff bonused ship)

"If brute force does not solve your problem....  then you are  surely not using enough!"

Arla Sarain
#26 - 2014-07-22 09:39:16 UTC
What tracking when you fly in a straight line...? What transversal when you shoot at stuff from 20k out or more? Surely you jest.


Lasers are used cos Scorch lets you reach out pretty far with what are essentially close range equivalent turrets. Ever heard of beam? Lol Aurora. Lol Gleam having less range and DPS and tracking and higher cap use than scorch pulse. Lasers are a joke and a trap.
T2 pulse lasers or biomass.
BrundleMeth
State War Academy
Caldari State
#27 - 2014-07-22 09:49:47 UTC
GreenSeed wrote:
the weapon system is not good, its full of problems. starting with scorch.

on medium energy guns scorch is so good it still outshines Beams even after a recent 25% percent damage buff.... that's not really a sign of Scorch being good, its a sign of how poorly thought through the whole weapon system is. it also brings some light on the T2 ammo problems, and the wall that they are to new players.

medium pulses are too easy to fit as expected, and deal a really nice damage, but with such a crap projection that you cant really use them unless you have the option of Scorch, so forget about meta guns, and forget about being competitive if you are new on the game. (and by crap projection im taking into account the speed of your average amarr ship along with their over reliance on overloading to keep point, keep webs, and keep range.)
medium beams are too hard to fit with too crappy of a projection on its medium and small sizes, turning things around on the tachs... so much in fact that people rarely care for pulses at the large size. -.-'

the whole weapon system is a mess... does it work? yeah... but there are no fitting choices really. "up until large make sure that whatever you are shooting with can load scorch." that's how far the thought process goes. the only people that care to switch crystals are incursion runners, and half the time, why bother? when the fleet alpha is so ******** you could be shooting T1 ammo.

as far as weapon system being desirable? its simple a matter of being able to keep tracking on the edge of optimal, something that rails have a problem doing, even at .5 falloff :/ not so much once you hit large rails/tachs.
that and great fleet hulls. that is, hulls that synergize well with Logis. high resists + low signatures. (Mallers, Zealots, Napocs) that's really all there is. ask anyone on PL or other null alliances (or npc null dwellers) that field amarr hulls and they will never talk about guns, they will always start with the resists and signature. the napoc is the smallest battleship outside of the minnie hulls (which on null doctrines CANNOT be used with anything but Artys... whose role on today's 2k+ fleet brawls is down to "we do explosive damage guyz!") that 370 sig paired with links, drugs and even LG halos is enough to screw up rails. add to that signature radius six lowslots for tank and you get a pretty nasty battleship. its pretty impressive, but really expensive.

lasers aren't really desirable, if we could fit rails and keep the bonusses on Zealots or Navy apocs, then people would ditch energy guns all together. because even when rails have terrible tracking, they aren't as reliant on cap, project the same, track the same (considering the ranges at which null engagements heppen), and once Neuting bombs land, rails wreck fleets with their therm/kin, while energy still hits the natural peak resist.

bleh, im ranting... i love lazors, i just wish the medium/small ones didn't suck as much.

I don;t care about any of that. They LOOK cool... That's what really matters...
Ralph King-Griffin
New Eden Tech Support
#28 - 2014-07-22 09:52:11 UTC
BrundleMeth wrote:
GreenSeed wrote:
the weapon system is not good, its full of problems. starting with scorch.

on medium energy guns scorch is so good it still outshines Beams even after a recent 25% percent damage buff.... that's not really a sign of Scorch being good, its a sign of how poorly thought through the whole weapon system is. it also brings some light on the T2 ammo problems, and the wall that they are to new players.

medium pulses are too easy to fit as expected, and deal a really nice damage, but with such a crap projection that you cant really use them unless you have the option of Scorch, so forget about meta guns, and forget about being competitive if you are new on the game. (and by crap projection im taking into account the speed of your average amarr ship along with their over reliance on overloading to keep point, keep webs, and keep range.)
medium beams are too hard to fit with too crappy of a projection on its medium and small sizes, turning things around on the tachs... so much in fact that people rarely care for pulses at the large size. -.-'

the whole weapon system is a mess... does it work? yeah... but there are no fitting choices really. "up until large make sure that whatever you are shooting with can load scorch." that's how far the thought process goes. the only people that care to switch crystals are incursion runners, and half the time, why bother? when the fleet alpha is so ******** you could be shooting T1 ammo.

as far as weapon system being desirable? its simple a matter of being able to keep tracking on the edge of optimal, something that rails have a problem doing, even at .5 falloff :/ not so much once you hit large rails/tachs.
that and great fleet hulls. that is, hulls that synergize well with Logis. high resists + low signatures. (Mallers, Zealots, Napocs) that's really all there is. ask anyone on PL or other null alliances (or npc null dwellers) that field amarr hulls and they will never talk about guns, they will always start with the resists and signature. the napoc is the smallest battleship outside of the minnie hulls (which on null doctrines CANNOT be used with anything but Artys... whose role on today's 2k+ fleet brawls is down to "we do explosive damage guyz!") that 370 sig paired with links, drugs and even LG halos is enough to screw up rails. add to that signature radius six lowslots for tank and you get a pretty nasty battleship. its pretty impressive, but really expensive.

lasers aren't really desirable, if we could fit rails and keep the bonusses on Zealots or Navy apocs, then people would ditch energy guns all together. because even when rails have terrible tracking, they aren't as reliant on cap, project the same, track the same (considering the ranges at which null engagements heppen), and once Neuting bombs land, rails wreck fleets with their therm/kin, while energy still hits the natural peak resist.

bleh, im ranting... i love lazors, i just wish the medium/small ones didn't suck as much.

I don;t care about any of that. They LOOK cool... That's what really matters...

he gets it +1 good sir

Nalelmir Ahashion
Industrial Management and Engineering
Mouth Trumpet Cavalry
#29 - 2014-07-22 09:53:05 UTC
Out of curiosity I tested this week the dual heavy beam lasers on BS doing some L4s for kicks. and that weapon system hits pretty well up to 80-90 km range no problem at all insta popping frigs and melting BS like nothing.
Then put it on Navy Geddon for RoF bonus to fire a volley every 3.5 sec +-

Using normal beams on medium hull (harbinger) at L3s and DED 4 sites just melt stuff so fast it's scary. Also there was one particular mission which even though was marked as L3 had inside like 8 BS many cruisers and such and some BS had NOS (Blood Raiders) and the Harbinger with beams pretty much rap*d them.

Bottom line Lasers are great if you can manage cap cause no cap = no guns. I like them pretty much cause I don't need ammo, used to fly some hybrid turret hulls and missile hulls and filling the load of inventory with ammo was annoying.

Also let's say you get a mission somewhere 4 jumps from your main station and there are like 3-5 rooms in there (dread pirate scarlet I look at you there) and bang ammo depleted. Jump back and get some more.
With lasers you just keep some normal crystals just in case you navy\t2 ones got pop'd.
Pheusia
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#30 - 2014-07-22 10:01:15 UTC
Kuroi Aurgnet wrote:
Can someone enlighten me as to why lasers? Tons of people use lasers- and amarr ships are extremely popular. why? Basically- what do lasers have that set them apart from other guns, and make them so desirable?


Scorch.

And Tachyon Beams.
Hal Morsh
Doomheim
#31 - 2014-07-22 11:35:12 UTC  |  Edited by: Hal Morsh
Scorsigaar wrote:
Multicolor Disco Laserboat Lightshow in Space.

Cmon now...party like Amarr Big smile



I have a rainbow coercer. But I thought it was gallente who partied, the amarr don't even like normal clothing, it's too revealing. They wear robes.

Oh, I perfectly understand, Hal Morsh — a mission like this requires courage, skill, and heroism… qualities you are clearly lacking. Have you forgotten you're one of the bloody immortals!?

Solecist Project
#32 - 2014-07-22 11:54:18 UTC
Damen Apol wrote:
Extreme tracking with amazing damage projection.

What more is there to love?

Projectile weapons are complete and total ass so they're out. Hybrids can be p. good, blasters are the hands-down best ganking thing for catalysts and stuff, and railrax/raildeimos is p. dope too, but dat tracking and projection on lasers m8.

light missile launchers are p. dope too.

I'm speaking from the perspective of pvp btw

I never used lasers except once for trying, so I have to give a pass on that.


Artillery is the best to use when ganking solo or in groups of two or three, under sentry fire.


Blasters are better to be used when not under sentry fire,
or when there are enough catalysts in a big enough group.


Missiles ... uhm ... I never use missiles. They suck.



Glad I was of help.

That ringing in your ears you're experiencing right now is the last gasping breathe of a dying inner ear as it got thoroughly PULVERISED by the point roaring over your head at supersonic speeds. - Tippia

Danny John-Peter
Blue Canary
Watch This
#33 - 2014-07-22 12:35:48 UTC
Lasers are basically amazing because of Scorch, which gives short range weapons (Pulse) so much flexibility compared to Blasters or ACs.

Amarr BS for example can do near blaster damage at close range with decent tracking while dealing good damage at 60-70 (or 90 if its an Napoc).
Bohneik Itohn
10.K
#34 - 2014-07-22 14:38:05 UTC
How has this not been posted yet?

Wait, CCP kills kittens now too?!  - Freyya

Are you a forum alt? Have you ever wondered why your experience on the forums is always so frustrating and unrewarding? This may help.

Nose' Feliciano
#35 - 2014-07-22 14:48:25 UTC
lazers are purdy
Bronson Hughes
The Knights of the Blessed Mother of Acceleration
#36 - 2014-07-22 14:49:19 UTC
Kagura Nikon wrote:
They have BAD tracking. Pulses are the worse tracking of the short range weapons.

Load up a T2 Pulse Laser with Scorch and compare it's tracking to any long range turret system that will engage at comparable ranges with short range ammo. That's what people mean when they say lasers have excellent tracking. Of course they don't have blaster or autocannon tracking, but if you're using pulses at ranges short enough that it matters you're probably doing it wrong.

Relatively Notorious By Association

My Many Misadventures

I predicted FAUXs

Stitcher
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#37 - 2014-07-22 15:42:33 UTC
Armour doctrine is riding high in the meta right now, Amarrian ships are excellent armour ships and Amarr ships use lasers. Seemples.

AKA Hambone

Author of The Deathworlders

Gorinia Sanford
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#38 - 2014-07-22 15:47:45 UTC
Ryuu Novak wrote:
Not to mention you don't have to carry so much ammo


That's what I love about my Harbringer, don't have to carry ammo.

Although I've got to say, I do really like missiles. I guess it stems from all those model rockets I shot off as a kid. Then I discovered high powered rocketry....
Feyd Rautha Harkonnen
Doomheim
#39 - 2014-07-22 16:12:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Feyd Rautha Harkonnen
Gorinia Sanford wrote:

...
Although I've got to say, I do really like missiles. I guess it stems from all those model rockets I shot off as a kid. Then I discovered high powered rocketry....

+1, love me my HAM's.

Missles don't miss. They can't be tracking disrupted. You can select your damage type to meet any resist hole. They don't consume capacitor. Most downsides can be mitigated by smart ammo selection (i.e. faction vs T2).

F
Phaade
LowKey Ops
Snuffed Out
#40 - 2014-07-22 16:21:06 UTC
Damen Apol wrote:
Extreme tracking with amazing damage projection.

What more is there to love?

Projectile weapons are complete and total ass so they're out. Hybrids can be p. good, blasters are the hands-down best ganking thing for catalysts and stuff, and railrax/raildeimos is p. dope too, but dat tracking and projection on lasers m8.

light missile launchers are p. dope too.

I'm speaking from the perspective of pvp btw



Lol, I don't think you ever PvP.

Lasers are okay, honestly underpowered IMO (compared to their cap use). Pulse are pretty good, beam are generally just terrible.

They project damage very well, sure, but their damage type and tracking are worst of the three.