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Faction Standing Warning

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BrundleMeth
State War Academy
Caldari State
#21 - 2014-07-19 10:14:19 UTC
OP....

Go play something else. Problem solved...
Omar Alharazaad
New Eden Tech Support
#22 - 2014-07-19 10:16:47 UTC
I'm not a fan of making things easier, as it tends to steal the sense of accomplishment from those who've mucked their way through things for years, so I'd be pretty dubious to any attempt to revamp how the standings system works.

On the other hand, reworking how the pertinent information is relayed to the player might not be a bad thing. We've seen quite a few changes as to how information is displayed to us in the last few expansions, and quite of bit of it for the better IMO. It would be nice if it were easier to see changes in your standings displayed in a more comprehensive fashion on the character sheet. The current display works, but it has room for improvement.

Come hell or high water, this sick world will know I was here.
Zappity
New Eden Tank Testing Services
#23 - 2014-07-19 10:16:49 UTC
Scipio Artelius wrote:
Zappity wrote:
The whole standings mechanics could really use a makeover.

Not accusing you of this, but as a general observation the whole "this could really use a makeover" is usually a statement that "things could be made easier'.

No need to make things easier as he already has several viable options to correct things.

The NPE could be made more explicit about these things so new players are more informed about the consequences of their choices, but the consequences don't need to be changed.

You are exactly right. It should be made easier. I don't see that the complexity of the plan (and the compulsory grind that goes with it) add enough positive gameplay to justify the nuisance. Compare the plan with the sec status tags in which you acquire, take to a lowsec station, pay some isk and you're done.

Note that I'm not arguing for any change to consequences, just the mechanics to repair those consequences.

Zappity's Adventures for a taste of lowsec and nullsec.
Gully Alex Foyle
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#24 - 2014-07-19 10:16:57 UTC
I have to agree with the OP on this one.

For something that can have fairly annoying consequences, the standings system is laughably obscure for a new player.


Quote:
This is an important mission, which will have significant impact on your faction standings.
Simply changing that to 'Dude, if you complete this mission Amarr will love you but Minmatar will hate your guts and eventually shoot at you in their highsec space' would be an improvement.

Make space glamorous! Is EVE dying or not? Ask the EVE-O Death-o-meter!
Adrie Atticus
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#25 - 2014-07-19 10:55:10 UTC  |  Edited by: Adrie Atticus
J'Poll wrote:
Adrie Atticus wrote:
Zappity wrote:
I don't understand why we can't buy faction standing like we can sec status. Forcing the grind is bad.


You can.


Yep. It is called datacenters.


Think more elaborate, no need to get stuck on datacenters.

Edit: another hint is that this requires social interaction, which is obviously not allowed in an MMO.
Dave Stark
#26 - 2014-07-19 11:03:44 UTC
faction standings are one of the most stupid things in eve that really should be looked at.
Yossarian Toralen
M and M Enterpises
#27 - 2014-07-19 11:51:48 UTC
Except for the minority, there has been many helpful replies, thank you.

While it does mention faction standings as you are playing the game nowhere does it say that you can negatively impact faction standings to such a degree by doing 1 mission that it will take you 16 or so to undo the damage done by one, if I was in a position that I couldn't do level 3 missions for a friendly faction it would be more like 50 to 1 level 1 missions.

It doesn't have to be easier, just more clearly displayed and explained at the point where you accept the mission, almost every other negative impact is warned about, try remove a rig and it warns you of the negative impact it will have.

Why can't it display that you get a -2.4% faction standings for doing some missions?
Arec Bardwin
#28 - 2014-07-19 12:21:38 UTC
When you join the milita it will further screw your standing with the opposite factions Lol
Caviar Liberta
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#29 - 2014-07-19 12:43:16 UTC
News Flash - Actions have consequences. Follow up at 11.
Chewytowel Haklar
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#30 - 2014-07-19 12:56:01 UTC
Do not do any of the missions, even the storyline ones, that have you kill an opposing faction that isn't a pirate. Every mission has a little banner indicating the target, always check that before heading out. Like some have said though, Diplomacy will raise standings quite a bit. If you are really in a pickle there are places for each faction where you can turn in tags for rep, which can help quite a bit. Plus the SoE epic arc if you haven't done it can also help boost standing quite a bit.
J'Poll
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#31 - 2014-07-19 14:29:34 UTC
Zappity wrote:
Scipio Artelius wrote:
Zappity wrote:
The whole standings mechanics could really use a makeover.

Not accusing you of this, but as a general observation the whole "this could really use a makeover" is usually a statement that "things could be made easier'.

No need to make things easier as he already has several viable options to correct things.

The NPE could be made more explicit about these things so new players are more informed about the consequences of their choices, but the consequences don't need to be changed.

You are exactly right. It should be made easier. I don't see that the complexity of the plan (and the compulsory grind that goes with it) add enough positive gameplay to justify the nuisance. Compare the plan with the sec status tags in which you acquire, take to a lowsec station, pay some isk and you're done.

Note that I'm not arguing for any change to consequences, just the mechanics to repair those consequences.


Now let's compare the Tags-4-Sec with datacenters.

I buy tags
I warp to datacenter
I open and instantly complete them.

Voila, Faction standings.

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J'Poll
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#32 - 2014-07-19 14:30:21 UTC  |  Edited by: J'Poll
Adrie Atticus wrote:
J'Poll wrote:
Adrie Atticus wrote:
Zappity wrote:
I don't understand why we can't buy faction standing like we can sec status. Forcing the grind is bad.


You can.


Yep. It is called datacenters.


Think more elaborate, no need to get stuck on datacenters.

Edit: another hint is that this requires social interaction, which is obviously not allowed in an MMO.


Uhm, OP already excluded mission sharing as he doesn't want to do it.

Funny part about it, faction standings are NEVER shared with missions.

Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy

Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded

Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar / The Content Club
J'Poll
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#33 - 2014-07-19 14:32:32 UTC
Gully Alex Foyle wrote:
I have to agree with the OP on this one.

For something that can have fairly annoying consequences, the standings system is laughably obscure for a new player.


Quote:
This is an important mission, which will have significant impact on your faction standings.
Simply changing that to 'Dude, if you complete this mission Amarr will love you but Minmatar will hate your guts and eventually shoot at you in their highsec space' would be an improvement.


Isn't that already completely clear by the icon that you are about to shoot Minmatar NPC in the mission.

AFAIK if I shoot a certain race / nationality long enough, they start to hate you.

Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy

Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded

Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar / The Content Club
Korvus Falek
Depraved Corruption
Lux Inter Astra
#34 - 2014-07-19 14:39:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Korvus Falek
Yossarian Toralen wrote:

Did I miss something along the way?


Yes, you missed the big red letters saying something along the lines of "This mission will have a significant effect on your standings with other factions" in the mission text.

Read the mission info when the agent gives it to you instead of just click festing through like a wow-tard. Its no ones fault (not even the games) but your own.

EvE has this fantasic ability to show users their own faults and fallacies where the game is near perfect for people who actually pay attention. Except mission pve (boring gameplay) and tidi (more boring gameplay)...those are black spots imo =P
Celise Katelo
State War Academy
Caldari State
#35 - 2014-07-19 16:30:34 UTC
.../blinks Pirate

Clearly the OP needs to pay more attention, but i can understand how this can happen. This game has so much information that at first i guess you ignore most of it & try to jump straight into the action, blindly playing like its a hack / slash (or WoW game).

"Red text = Warning please Read me" Working as intended P

Perhaps the "Red text" should be glowing red & all flashy neons, or:

Flashy Lights - Animation

EVEBoard ...Just over 60million skill points, each skill was chosen for a reason. I closed my eyes & clicked another skill to train... "BINGO...!!!" ... "This time i got something usefull"
Dave Stark
#36 - 2014-07-19 16:31:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Dave Stark
Celise Katelo wrote:
.../blinks Pirate

Clearly the OP needs to pay more attention, but i can understand how this can happen. This game has so much information that at first i guess you ignore most of it & try to jump straight into the action, blindly playing like its a hack / slash (or WoW game).

"Red text = Warning please Read me" Working as intended P

Perhaps the "Red text" should be glowing red & all flashy neons, or:

Flashy Lights - Animation


most missions that give you a faction standings hit don't have red text to warn you of these things.
at least, not the ones where the standings hit comes from the rats.
ISD Tyrozan
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
ISD Alliance
#37 - 2014-07-19 19:45:33 UTC
Personal attack post removed.

Forum rule 4. Personal attacks are prohibited.

ISD Tyrozan

Captain

Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)

Interstellar Services Department

@ISDTyrozan | @ISD_CCL
Zappity
New Eden Tank Testing Services
#38 - 2014-07-19 19:54:19 UTC
J'Poll wrote:
Zappity wrote:
Scipio Artelius wrote:
Zappity wrote:
The whole standings mechanics could really use a makeover.

Not accusing you of this, but as a general observation the whole "this could really use a makeover" is usually a statement that "things could be made easier'.

No need to make things easier as he already has several viable options to correct things.

The NPE could be made more explicit about these things so new players are more informed about the consequences of their choices, but the consequences don't need to be changed.

You are exactly right. It should be made easier. I don't see that the complexity of the plan (and the compulsory grind that goes with it) add enough positive gameplay to justify the nuisance. Compare the plan with the sec status tags in which you acquire, take to a lowsec station, pay some isk and you're done.

Note that I'm not arguing for any change to consequences, just the mechanics to repair those consequences.


Now let's compare the Tags-4-Sec with datacenters.

I buy tags
I warp to datacenter
I open and instantly complete them.

Voila, Faction standings.

Does that fully repair your standings against the faction? I thought they were one time only. I admit that I've never done it - I looked over the plan and decided to do something else instead. It looked awful.

Regardless, I'm quite sanguine about the faction mechanics. The upcoming removal of standings requirements from POS anchoring indicates that CCP is inclined toward good design rather than historical equity. I think they will continue to promote player-player consequence rather than player-NPC consequence and that this will flow into a revision of standings mechanics when they get around to it.

Not that I think that will be soon - they have bigger fish to fry.

Zappity's Adventures for a taste of lowsec and nullsec.
DeMichael Crimson
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#39 - 2014-07-19 20:38:28 UTC
Zappity wrote:

Does that fully repair your standings against the faction? I thought they were one time only. I admit that I've never done it - I looked over the plan and decided to do something else instead. It looked awful.
Shocked

Which part looked awful?

The part where you can repair negative Faction standing easily and quickly or the part where you can boost positive Faction standing quickly and easily?

Anyway, time and time again 'The Plan' has been proven by the player base to be very effective.

Zappity wrote:

Regardless, I'm quite sanguine about the faction mechanics. The upcoming removal of standings requirements from POS anchoring indicates that CCP is inclined toward good design rather than historical equity. I think they will continue to promote player-player consequence rather than player-NPC consequence and that this will flow into a revision of standings mechanics when they get around to it.

Not that I think that will be soon - they have bigger fish to fry.


In my opinion the main point of CCP removing POS Faction Standing requirements and opening up the rest of High Security to allow POS anchoring is to promote more PvP carnage with WarDecs, hopefully creating free publicity for CCP through the gaming news media.

Of course the destruction of player owned structures and ships should also help boost Industry, right?


DMC

'The Plan' | California Eve Players | Proposal - The Endless Battle
Gorinia Sanford
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#40 - 2014-07-19 21:10:24 UTC
Omar Alharazaad wrote:
Train diplomacy to 5. It will help a great deal in mitigating the harm you've done to your standings.
From there some of your options aren't terrible, spamming quick missions to get storyline missions can help, just be choosy for whom you work.

Edit: Also, pretty much any time you blow something up in space it's bound to annoy someone or something.


^^This.

Training up some of the skills in the social tree can go a long way to helping you. Sure, it'll take time, but what skills worth having in Eve don't?
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