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the Power of API
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Victor Andall
#21 - 2014-07-17 10:39:29 UTC
Avern wrote:
Any corp who wants information to the level of my communications with others can get lost, it is a violation of privacy of the person you are communicating with.

Say a friend mentions thinking about leaving his corp that is in alliance with yours then your leader goes "Oh better share this with the corp X leader they have a flight risk" meanwhile it was just a shallow temporary thought and the only reason the information ever came to light of day was because of someone having access to a full api and taking things out of context,

That level of sharing is just wrong,


So don't share. What exactly is even the problem here? Oh no, corporations are asking for information that I can only give them willingly!

How frequent is the situation where you really really really want to be part of a corporation, but you don't want to give them your full API.

It's like a girl saying that she really really really wants to be in a relationship with that guy. His only flaw is that he beats her but he's a standup guy rest of the time.

I just undocked for the first time and someone challenged me to a duel. Wat do?

19.08.2014 - Dinsdale gets slammed by CCP Falcon. Never forget.
ChromeStriker
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#22 - 2014-07-17 10:43:21 UTC
As an ex-recruiter i know why a full background check is needed. To those peeps that were worried from a privicy point of view (and weren't hiding something Blink ) i told them to put an expiry date of a week on the api.

Forums etc usually only need a very limited api.... if a full is needed for them... then id be worried lol

No Worries
Nicolai Serkanner
Incredible.
Brave Collective
#23 - 2014-07-17 10:58:55 UTC
Victor Andall wrote:
Avern wrote:
Any corp who wants information to the level of my communications with others can get lost, it is a violation of privacy of the person you are communicating with.

Say a friend mentions thinking about leaving his corp that is in alliance with yours then your leader goes "Oh better share this with the corp X leader they have a flight risk" meanwhile it was just a shallow temporary thought and the only reason the information ever came to light of day was because of someone having access to a full api and taking things out of context,

That level of sharing is just wrong,


So don't share. What exactly is even the problem here? Oh no, corporations are asking for information that I can only give them willingly!

How frequent is the situation where you really really really want to be part of a corporation, but you don't want to give them your full API.

It's like a girl saying that she really really really wants to be in a relationship with that guy. His only flaw is that he beats her but he's a standup guy rest of the time.


Seriously, you compare an API with beating up people?
Victor Andall
#24 - 2014-07-17 11:14:31 UTC
I don't think you understand how analogies and hyperboles work.

I just undocked for the first time and someone challenged me to a duel. Wat do?

19.08.2014 - Dinsdale gets slammed by CCP Falcon. Never forget.
De'Veldrin
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#25 - 2014-07-17 12:23:24 UTC
You are in no way required to give anyone any form of an API key at any time for any reason. But we are in no way required to blindly accept you into our corporation.

Speaking as a recruiter, Full APIs are just one tool in the bag of tricks that helps us keep our members assets safe from potential neer do wells. We have a responsibility to our existing members to do whatever is in our power to protect them from the asshats of the cluster. Contrary to what seems to be a popular belief, we are not sitting around reading your evemails in the middle of the night with the curtains closed and our creeper suits on. Frankly, we give less than two fucks who you're talking to on a daily basis. We check it ahead of time because it's one way of weeding out the lazy and the incompetent spies and awoxers before they can be a threat.

There are also some other glorious tools - EveSearch (thanks Chribba!) stores every character you have ever typed on these forums. I just pop over to there enter your name and peruse at my leisure looking for anything that seems inconsistent with your interview. Killboards, evewho, and plain old google are also tools in my box of "Nope, not gonna risk it" during the review proess.

De'Veldrin's Corollary (to Malcanis' Law): Any idea that seeks to limit the ability of a large nullsec bloc to do something in the name of allowing more small groups into sov null will inevitably make it that much harder for small groups to enter sov null.
Slade Trillgon
Brutor Force Federated
#26 - 2014-07-17 12:24:56 UTC
Titania Hrothgar wrote:
Just out of curiosity, I decided to look into what all is granted by a full API. I did a quick google search, found a link to the powerful tools used by corporations to do their background checks, and was appalled at what I saw.

My assets and in which station I'd placed them, my wallet, all my market transactions, where I go, what I do, even granting full access to every notification and mail I send and receive? A full API literally lets someone watch my every move!

It's creepy!

I've now joined the bandwagon of those who refuse to provide a full API. No one shall have that kind of access to my game play experience. I sent an e-mail to my corp providing them with a new API. I hope they understand. It was just way too creepy a thing to have out there....

*shudder*


Just do not enter a corp that requires you to maintain the same API you used for them to vet you.
S'Way
State War Academy
Caldari State
#27 - 2014-07-17 15:07:10 UTC  |  Edited by: S'Way
Full API keys make corps feel a lot more secure about who they're recruiting so usually hand out more roles, more access and more info much sooner than they would otherwise. If you're someone the corp should actually be worried about accepting into the ranks then you'll have several accounts just for the purpose of infiltrations and often target "full API" corps for that reason. (the character bazaar even provides a way to offload "burnt" alts afterwards as well).

The most successful corps I've known over the years only ask for a limited API because they don't give out roles without good reason, check who has access to important stuff often and assume everyone is a spy.
Nicolai Serkanner
Incredible.
Brave Collective
#28 - 2014-07-17 15:42:07 UTC
Victor Andall wrote:
I don't think you understand how analogies and hyperboles work.


I think you don't understand how analogies and hyperboles work.
B Scripts
Serious Legitimate Hauling and Trade Corporation
#29 - 2014-07-17 15:54:45 UTC
If you had nothing to hide, you wouldn't mind sharing.



/NSA
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#30 - 2014-07-17 15:57:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Alavaria Fera
You know, actually... huh give API for all my alts but never checked what is in it, hmm...

Nothing in communications (because we don't use evemail i guess), nothing on wallet&market either.

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#31 - 2014-07-17 15:59:25 UTC  |  Edited by: BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie
I've stopped asking for mail bodies on the api, because the security aspect is far more centered on who you know than what you say. The reality is that most of the sections of the api that people complain about being an "invasion of privacy" are the most useful for identifying alts that the applicant may not have told the corp about.

Also, I'm looking for a decent industrial/pve corp to join that does not require an api key. Let me know if you're interested!

Founder of Violet Squadron, a small gang NPSI community! Mail me for more information.

BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie's Space Mediation Service!
Sibyyl
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#32 - 2014-07-17 16:01:50 UTC
BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie wrote:
I've stopped asking for mail bodies on the api, because the security aspect is far more centered on who you know than what you say. The reality is that most of the sections of the api that people complain about being an "invasion of privacy" are the most useful for identifying alts that the applicant may not have told the corp about.

I really like this.

Joffy Aulx-Gao for CSM. Fix links and OGB. Ban stabs from plexes. Fulfill karmic justice.
Titania Hrothgar
Nemesis Retribution
#33 - 2014-07-17 16:07:28 UTC  |  Edited by: Titania Hrothgar
B Scripts wrote:
If you had nothing to hide, you wouldn't mind sharing.



/NSA


Fortunately, that's not a true statement :)

All the world's a stage and all the men and women are the players.
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#34 - 2014-07-17 16:08:48 UTC
All this "hurrrrr durrrr spais spais spais" thing would not be a problem when your corporation does not have anything to steal.

Is there some rule I didn't hear about that says once you are in a corporation you have to put all of your crap in a hangar someone else can access?

Bring back DEEEEP Space!
admiral root
Red Galaxy
#35 - 2014-07-17 16:39:37 UTC
Lots of paranoia in this thread.

No, your rights end in optimal+2*falloff
Paranoid Loyd
#36 - 2014-07-17 16:40:06 UTC
admiral root wrote:
Lots of paranoia in this thread.


o/

"There is only one authority in this game, and that my friend is violence. The supreme authority upon which all other authority is derived." ISD Max Trix

Fix the Prospect!
BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#37 - 2014-07-17 17:15:22 UTC
Paranoid Loyd wrote:
admiral root wrote:
Lots of paranoia in this thread.


o/

I see what you did thar...

Founder of Violet Squadron, a small gang NPSI community! Mail me for more information.

BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie's Space Mediation Service!
Alphea Abbra
Project Promethion
#38 - 2014-07-17 17:16:37 UTC
Titania Hrothgar wrote:
B Scripts wrote:
If you had nothing to hide, you wouldn't mind sharing.



/NSA


Fortunately, that's not a true statement :)
True, and in the real world, it's an actual danger when it is employed.
However, EVE is not as real as your social security number, and no data in the API can be compared to it.

Now, you say that you don't want to give out a full API - and the answer to that will probably be "Fair, then we won't recruit you" or "Are there any specific concerns, so that I may alleviate your fears through education and explanation?" from recruiters. Personally, I have no issue with giving a full API. Apart from my very sensual and arousing conversation with Solstice, I have no mails that is worth anyone's time to sift through, and if anyone has to do it by hand, I really pity them.

I'd rather be a member of the corp and alliance that I am, than having the luxury of knowing only CCP can potentially and legally look into my EVE mails. If that luxury is worth more to anyone than the membership of the organisation that asks for an API key, well, simple answer is, don't join it. But then don't complain that you're rejected because of the API thing. It was obviously more important to you than the organisation of your choice.

Can API be abused? Only as long as you allow it to be. You can always delete it, and it will no longer update on their end.
Nariya Kentaya
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#39 - 2014-07-17 19:22:27 UTC
Avern wrote:
Any corp who wants information to the level of my communications with others can get lost, it is a violation of privacy of the person you are communicating with.

Say a friend mentions thinking about leaving his corp that is in alliance with yours then your leader goes "Oh better share this with the corp X leader they have a flight risk" meanwhile it was just a shallow temporary thought and the only reason the information ever came to light of day was because of someone having access to a full api and taking things out of context,

That level of sharing is just wrong,

Enjoy getting a job that involves even setting foot on federal property, because you wont get it, because "muh privacies"
Nariya Kentaya
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#40 - 2014-07-17 19:24:38 UTC
De'Veldrin wrote:
You are in no way required to give anyone any form of an API key at any time for any reason. But we are in no way required to blindly accept you into our corporation.

Speaking as a recruiter, Full APIs are just one tool in the bag of tricks that helps us keep our members assets safe from potential neer do wells. We have a responsibility to our existing members to do whatever is in our power to protect them from the asshats of the cluster. Contrary to what seems to be a popular belief, we are not sitting around reading your evemails in the middle of the night with the curtains closed and our creeper suits on. Frankly, we give less than two fucks who you're talking to on a daily basis. We check it ahead of time because it's one way of weeding out the lazy and the incompetent spies and awoxers before they can be a threat.

There are also some other glorious tools - EveSearch (thanks Chribba!) stores every character you have ever typed on these forums. I just pop over to there enter your name and peruse at my leisure looking for anything that seems inconsistent with your interview. Killboards, evewho, and plain old google are also tools in my box of "Nope, not gonna risk it" during the review proess.

I remember one time in a corp I was in, our recruiter hated taking APIs, but he always did. It payed off one day when he was looking WAAAAY back in a characters history and found out it was a Psychotic Monk alt, he even popped into the channel to confirm he was caught. He was a cool dude, too.
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