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Player Features and Ideas Discussion

 
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NPE: Provide Protected Newbie "Zone" similar to WoW's

First post
Author
Sentamon
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#61 - 2014-07-13 01:06:14 UTC
Ahem, 10 years of constant growth and this isn't a problem, but suddenly the guy that doesn't even log in speaks and ta-da, it's a problem.

Smoke and Mirrors.

~ Professional Forum Alt  ~

Aloh
Migrant-Fleet
#62 - 2014-07-13 01:07:42 UTC
Christopher Tsutola wrote:
[quote]
this doesn't ensure that it won't snow ball as for the exit being camped to hell i say let it be let them be blasted and podded then re-spawn in a random med bay. the first thing they encounter in eve after the tutorial would be a gank they wouldn't have anything to lose as they exited it would be a great sort of event for the community a way of greeting them into eve and indoctrinating them as one of us.


It would in that any anti ganking and non PVP is ONLY in the newbie zone.
Nothing changes in Eve proper.
As far as the gate camp point goes. Fair enough :)
Although I am not one for hazing or initiations in general you make a valid point.
Vherokior Matari
#63 - 2014-07-13 01:10:31 UTC
Sentamon wrote:
10 years of constant growth.


Citation required.
Bohneik Itohn
10.K
#64 - 2014-07-13 01:26:27 UTC
Vherokior Matari wrote:
Sentamon wrote:
10 years of constant growth.


Citation required.



Citation provided.

One tiny dip between 2010 and 2011, but otherwise Eve has had some booming years lately and there is nothing to complain about.

Wait, CCP kills kittens now too?!  - Freyya

Are you a forum alt? Have you ever wondered why your experience on the forums is always so frustrating and unrewarding? This may help.

Christopher Tsutola
State Navy
#65 - 2014-07-13 01:29:11 UTC
Aloh wrote:
Christopher Tsutola wrote:
[quote]
this doesn't ensure that it won't snow ball as for the exit being camped to hell i say let it be let them be blasted and podded then re-spawn in a random med bay. the first thing they encounter in eve after the tutorial would be a gank they wouldn't have anything to lose as they exited it would be a great sort of event for the community a way of greeting them into eve and indoctrinating them as one of us.


It would in that any anti ganking and non PVP is ONLY in the newbie zone.
Nothing changes in Eve proper.
As far as the gate camp point goes. Fair enough :)
Although I am not one for hazing or initiations in general you make a valid point.



the snow ball comes after this is implemented this little thing could easily grow past the borders of the newbie zone and with an influx of players who would be introduced to eve with a safe zone more ppl would push to extend it into eve. it isn't a definite scenario but the risk would be there
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#66 - 2014-07-13 01:34:48 UTC
Christopher Tsutola wrote:


the snow ball comes after this is implemented this little thing could easily grow past the borders of the newbie zone and with an influx of players who would be introduced to eve with a safe zone more ppl would push to extend it into eve. it isn't a definite scenario but the risk would be there


I would argue that, barring significant watchfulness and advocacy of the existing playerbase, that it is a definite scenario.

CCP has been adding more safety creep to highsec year after year without cease. Case in point, I have never once seen them patch out a "bug" faster than they did with the MTU drone aggro thing earlier. They did that in a week. That is their on record fastest fix ever.

Their efforts have largely gone to giving highsec more safety for their mindless themepark content while the POS architecture languishes for literally years.

So I would say it's a significant danger. And imo, if the dichotomy all the change crusaders are offering is true(which I know it's not, they use that as a scare tactic to try and bolster their shaky arguments), that we have to kill the game or the game will die, then I'd rather have it fade into obscurity rather than prostituted out to the thrice damned casuals before the servers go cold.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.

Syrias Bizniz
some random local shitlords
#67 - 2014-07-13 01:40:25 UTC
Well, most of the people starting EVE are probably here because they read about it on some blogs, reviews, whatever, where they become the impression that EVE is a game without rules, so if they start the game they do it because of this.

Giving them a safe zone that has nothing in common with the picture of EVE that is present everywhere might give them a false glimpse of the game.


Those players who get griefed out within their first days would most likely not enjoy the game on the long run anyways.
No matter if they're shy, like to play solo, like to play safe, like to play dangerous,
there is a place for everyone within EVE Online - as long as they stick to it, and that means stick to the game, and not some weird happy-fluffy-funtimes SafeZone.

Christopher Tsutola
State Navy
#68 - 2014-07-13 01:40:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Christopher Tsutola
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Christopher Tsutola wrote:


the snow ball comes after this is implemented this little thing could easily grow past the borders of the newbie zone and with an influx of players who would be introduced to eve with a safe zone more ppl would push to extend it into eve. it isn't a definite scenario but the risk would be there


I would argue that, barring significant watchfulness and advocacy of the existing playerbase, that it is a definite scenario.

CCP has been adding more safety creep to highsec year after year without cease. Case in point, I have never once seen them patch out a "bug" faster than they did with the MTU drone aggro thing earlier. They did that in a week. That is their on record fastest fix ever.

Their efforts have largely gone to giving highsec more safety for their mindless themepark content while the POS architecture languishes for literally years.

So I would say it's a significant danger. And imo, if the dichotomy all the change crusaders are offering is true(which I know it's not, they use that as a scare tactic to try and bolster their shaky arguments), that we have to kill the game or the game will die, then I'd rather have it fade into obscurity rather than prostituted out to the thrice damned casuals before the servers go cold.

i would rather see it fade out then go the way of a lot of mmos that pushed me away with a bad taste but that doesn't mean i want to just let it die i'm sure something can be done to improve the NPE without damaging the game.

however i don't believe the NPE is as big a problem as ppl think and that the panel at fan fest may have frightened ppl a bit
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#69 - 2014-07-13 01:44:55 UTC
Christopher Tsutola wrote:

i would rather see it fade out then go the way of a lot of mmos that pushed me away with a bad taste but that doesn't mean i want to just let it die i'm sure something can be done to improve the NPE without damaging the game.

however i don't believe the NPE is as big a problem as ppl think and that the panel at fan fest may have frightened ppl a bit


I quite simply reject the notion that the game will die without more newbies for me to eat. I dine very well as it is.

I don't buy into that alarmist, histrionic bullshit that Ripard Teg slung.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.

Bohneik Itohn
10.K
#70 - 2014-07-13 01:48:10 UTC
Christopher Tsutola wrote:

i would rather see it fade out then go the way of a lot of mmos that pushed me away with a bad taste but that doesn't mean i want to just let it die i'm sure something can be done to improve the NPE without damaging the game.

however i don't believe the NPE is as big a problem as ppl think and that the panel at fan fest may have frightened ppl a bit


It can be done quite simply without doing anything more than what I suggested: One patch to fix the tutorials an an official newbie Player-run corporation maintained by CCP officials.

Assuming they do both competently...

As a recently new player, I can confirm just how many people who started playing at the same time I did are no longer playing 8 months later. Player retention is as bad as it was said to be in the panel. However, the players that remain tend to have more grit than the usual stock. That being said, there's nothing stopping people from sticking some sand in a few noobs' britches in between their pew and helping the process.

Wait, CCP kills kittens now too?!  - Freyya

Are you a forum alt? Have you ever wondered why your experience on the forums is always so frustrating and unrewarding? This may help.

Christopher Tsutola
State Navy
#71 - 2014-07-13 01:54:28 UTC
Bohneik Itohn wrote:
Christopher Tsutola wrote:

i would rather see it fade out then go the way of a lot of mmos that pushed me away with a bad taste but that doesn't mean i want to just let it die i'm sure something can be done to improve the NPE without damaging the game.

however i don't believe the NPE is as big a problem as ppl think and that the panel at fan fest may have frightened ppl a bit


It can be done quite simply without doing anything more than what I suggested: One patch to fix the tutorials an an official newbie Player-run corporation maintained by CCP officials.

Assuming they do both competently...

As a recently new player, I can confirm just how many people who started playing at the same time I did are no longer playing 8 months later. Player retention is as bad as it was said to be in the panel. However, the players that remain tend to have more grit than the usual stock. That being said, there's nothing stopping people from sticking some sand in a few noobs' britches in between their pew and helping the process.



definitely i found your suggestion to be great
ISD Ezwal
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
ISD Alliance
#72 - 2014-07-13 02:09:46 UTC
I have removed a rule breaking post.

The Rules:
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The use of profanity is prohibited on the EVE Online forums. This includes the partial masking of letters using numbers or alternate symbols, and any attempts at bypassing the profanity filter.

ISD Ezwal Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)

Daichi Yamato
Jabbersnarks and Wonderglass
#73 - 2014-07-13 02:45:33 UTC
I have my doubts about how effective this idea will be. Do players leave because they've been griefed and they are new, or do they leave because they've been griefed period? Maybe this idea means we hold onto some new players for a little bit longer but still not for long.

NPE is not how WoW keeps its subscribers.

EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided"

Daichi Yamato's version of structure based decs

Christopher Tsutola
State Navy
#74 - 2014-07-13 02:50:12 UTC
Daichi Yamato wrote:
I have my doubts about how effective this idea will be. Do players leave because they've been griefed and they are new, or do they leave because they've been griefed period? Maybe this idea means we hold onto some new players for a little bit longer but still not for long.

NPE is not how WoW keeps its subscribers.


NPE is not how any game keeps its subscribes past the NPE phase for that matter
Aloh
Migrant-Fleet
#75 - 2014-07-13 02:53:41 UTC
Christopher Tsutola wrote:
Daichi Yamato wrote:
I have my doubts about how effective this idea will be. Do players leave because they've been griefed and they are new, or do they leave because they've been griefed period? Maybe this idea means we hold onto some new players for a little bit longer but still not for long.

NPE is not how WoW keeps its subscribers.


NPE is not how any game keeps its subscribes past the NPE phase for that matter


Agreed but stipulating that Eve loses plenty of them to their NPE.
Petrified
Old and Petrified Syndication
#76 - 2014-07-13 03:52:39 UTC
I remember when I started EVE getting stuck in the newbie tutorial system.

Wait... that was Beta.

There are some good things to be said for giving new players a place to dip their toes into the water... I suppose this is not so much the shallow end as the kiddie pool. (there is no shallow end in EVE currently)

Though it won't be long before griefers turn local into a shameful display of Jita Local. Still, it just might be better for the long term health of the game if this were made to happen

Cloaking is the closest thing to a "Pause Game" button one can get while in space.

Support better localization for the Japanese Community.

Sentamon
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#77 - 2014-07-13 05:32:07 UTC
Last I checked vets greifing noobs in starter systems gets you banned. There you go, protected noobie zone.

Do we have any more suggestions from people more interested in making a living from the game then actually playing it?

~ Professional Forum Alt  ~

Dave Stark
#78 - 2014-07-13 05:42:06 UTC
Sentamon wrote:
Last I checked vets greifing noobs in starter systems gets you banned. There you go, protected noobie zone.

Do we have any more suggestions from people more interested in making a living from the game then actually playing it?


the repercussions of griefing players who don't even understand how the UI functions are irrelevant - it shouldn't be possible in the first place.

There's no real reason to expose people to other players, especially in eve, before they've even learned the basics of how to interact with the game.

the less time and resources that are spent on banning current players abusing new players is more time and resources that can be dedicated to increasing the retention rate above 50%.
ihcn
Life. Universe. Everything.
#79 - 2014-07-13 06:40:04 UTC
I read the thread title and said "no" out loud. Why would "safe zones" be an appropriate introduction to a game infamous for the fact that safe zones do not exist?
Dave Stark
#80 - 2014-07-13 06:59:17 UTC
ihcn wrote:
I read the thread title and said "no" out loud. Why would "safe zones" be an appropriate introduction to a game infamous for the fact that safe zones do not exist?


i think an area where you can learn how the ui and basic game functions work before being put in to the actual game is appropriate for any game.