Player Features and Ideas Discussion

But this is the whole point of those changes.
You cannot limit power projection without touching JF.

You will have to use local industry to limit all possible shortages.
The more you make locally , the less you will have to move in.
You will have to make transport ops , and escort industrial ships brining all what you are missing.
You will patrol supply lines, fight pirates.
Use every possible WH to do some additional logistics.

We are talking about fun, group play.
Think how fun will be to keep all those gates clear of pirates.
Think how fun will be to BE one of those pirates.

M8 I once moved 11 freighter loads of war stocks from lowsec khanid to the bottom of stain where it borders Esoteria. O I did that with 1 single freighter ( my own) on my character Thronde which I sold to some guy back in 2006. Alliance mates and I did it and it took a whole weekend with one freighter. It was for a planned invasion against Prime Orbital System by my alliance Firmus Ixion. We were too be the vanguard into Eso for Band of Brothers. The invasion fell apart and too this day I still have a bunch of assets from that move in the bottom of Stain. Also when Firmus Ixion use to have mining ops in FAT-GP ( there were no other stations in catch other than V2-VC2 and 5-N) I would move freighter loads of minerals from FAT to H74.

Furthermore when I was in 0utbreak I handled logistics for a time when we were very nomadic. Carriers stuffed with Itty 5s full of small tractor beams. We moved them into null refined them and then built BS hulls. So yes I have done quite a bit of logistics in my day. I just did it before most of the current player base knew what Eve even was.


Funny story I once had to evade a hostile gang in 4-07 while moving minerals from the FAT station to H74 to refine them. I warped my freighter to a deep safe that was 1200au out. It took me a hour to warp to the safe lol.


To expand on my post we did things as a team back then. It was dangerous and exciting and hard but when you completed something it was a awesome feeling. Friends and I once killed a hauler from IAC that was moving assets into 0.0. We caught him in HED-GP in a safe and killed him. Out of the dropped loot we got a Gyrostab 2 bpo.

At same time if you have even more friends you do not need to project so much of your power. Because you surely will ahve lots of friends nearby. The very same solution USA found in NATO to deal with USSR presence.

If you press too much on one side the players will just push even more into the lots of blues to not need capital ship projection so much.

So you want to wish this on the current logistic backbone? A run to jita in a ship that holds 340k m3 and back would not only take hours and hours it would require handholding on alot of pvpers, Its bad enough how the majority of pvpers **** on those who do this grunt work allready but for these logistics pilots to rely on more people? ALso the game was much smaller back then no? There are a great deal more people now, who i know would take great pleasure locking down the entrances and exists to and from nullsec. As it is ccp has made nullsec completely reliant on empire to the point to where you can mine almost all you need but 3 of the needed minerals for ships and have to ship most of that down. Racial ice would have to be a thing of the past, Racial salvage as well. Jump freighters would need to massivly change while either getting bigger hulls or becomine dust collecting peices of ****. There is so much work here ccp would need to do and they allready balk at rewriting pos code why do you think for a minute they would put the effort into this?

The biggest problem I see with your example is that this single pilot is required to supply so many people. What is the ratio of logistics pilots to pvp pilots relying on them for their stuff? In the neighborhood of 100:1 maybe?

Also, somehow i don't think you're going to be seeing any JFs flying from gate to gate. You're going to be seeing regular Freighters that have at this point nearly 10x the storage capacity. So doing that once instead of 10 JF runs would be more reasonable and would also warrent a good defense force to scout and help move from place to place. The best part about this whole thing is you don't have to worry about your Freighter getting hot dropped by dreads/supers. So 1 person in a system isn't going to be a huge threat anymore since hot drops will be at best, next door.

And that brings up another great point. And by great i mean GREAT!!!

Without threat of getting hot dropped by 30+ dudes from 15+ jumps away one person in a system isn't going to be a big threat anymore. So nobody is going to care about cloaky campers since the vast majority of their threat projection is tied directly to power projection. And because cloaky camping will become so insignificant, I'd say it wouldn't be too unreasonable to replace null sec local chat with the wormhole style delayed local. And there in Blops will retain a large portion of their power and utility even if their mobility is stifled significantly.

So many birds, so little stones.

Do you think they want to go out of business?

After watching blizzard slowly and deliberately kill 2 of thier major IP's it would not suprise me one little bit if CCP went that way.

I keep my stance that you are being too optimistic. I really doubt the critical mass will push trough the initial dificulties in order to go in the direction you suggest. Everyone will try to let the others do it first, and just take profit on that by living at the border of their own territory and raiding their new weakened enemies.

Your plan has logic and would work wonders if everyone tought that same way. But its exact same virtues as comunism... yet no one will want to be the first to try that, because that is a clearly bad move (to be the first).

So you need a more direct incentive.

And no, after alliances ( social level concept, not the in game concept) are made, they are much unlikely to be diluted unless some conflict over a set of interests arise.

Implementing your idea without anythign else will jsut keep the very exact status quo, but the size of the fights will reduce and the scalation in capital fights as well. THe same 2 powerblocs will continue exactly as of now.

And the powerblocs are the major reason why 0.0 is no where as interesting as used to be.

That is the difference between eve being BIG and current state , where every thing is close.

People will adapt soon.
You live in amarr space, and flying thanny ... well , time to train archon.
Don't say you use caldari poses while having minmatar ice in system.

Salvage?
Just haul stuff you are relay missing.

Check other posts, idea is that in each region you will have ALL , again ALL materials to construct T2 ships and equipment of local race.

So you will have cheep local doctrines , and expensive from other side of eve.

Items will get new price , how?
Why zealot have to cost so much? , will it cost 1/5 if you have all the minerals , and put those ships by yourself ( on alliance level).

So giving pvpers content is a bad thing?


Case in point! pvpers wouldn't have to go out on hours and hours of roams to get content. All they have to do is a logistic escort op to get their jollies.


I believe most of this has already been established.... And in the Original post?....