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[Proposal] Transferable Loyalty Points
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My Little Banker
Dead Space Investments
#1 - 2014-07-09 02:45:20 UTC  |  Edited by: My Little Banker
My idea is simple make the loyalty points that you get from missions and encounter surveillance systems transferable to other characters.

I want to keep this simple so I will make a list of reasons why this is good.

* Allows 0.0 players to cash in LP from multiple characters without making the 20+ jump trip.

* Reduces the shock to the market when players dump large amounts of LP.

* Increases the use of LP that is accumulated by players.

* Will help with the issue of large alliance only using one type of ESS causing that LP to decrease in value.

This is very much a ease of living proposal but I think it would make the use of encounter surveillance systems much more widespread than it is now. This could also possibly pave the way for more expansions to the ESS system that is currently in place.
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
#2 - 2014-07-09 02:49:17 UTC
Hi, I'm a corp that keeps track of how you have helped us so what favours we owe you in this thing we call LP.
So I'm going to be totally ok with you transferring these favours to someone we hate to get things from us instead of you.

Err........
Arya Regnar
Darwins Right Hand
#3 - 2014-07-09 02:50:19 UTC
Does loyalty mean nothing these days??

EvE-Mail me if you need anything.
My Little Banker
Dead Space Investments
#4 - 2014-07-09 02:54:07 UTC
Arya Regnar wrote:
Does loyalty mean nothing these days??

This is EVE loyalty is bought and sold every day.
Tiberizzle
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#5 - 2014-07-09 03:30:24 UTC
This is a pretty good idea. Pretty much anything that addresses the issue of factoring LP into nullsec income when you can only dispose of it by leaving nullsec would be a good idea though. I thought the goal with nullsec changes was to be moving us towards being self-sufficient?

I have 10+ characters with 1.5-2.5M LP split between several different factions per character.

I haven't bothered to cash out since these things were introduced because of the mindblowing headache going to 2-4 different LP stores per character then shipping all the crap to a market hub would be.

I don't mean to get all ~tism~ here but quite frankly, when you factor in the opportunity cost of liquidating, it's not a bonus as is, it's pretty much mockery.
Eugene Kerner
TunDraGon
The Initiative.
#6 - 2014-07-09 06:19:00 UTC
And make it so that we get Lp for just docking at the according NPC station.
Lazy Snows.

TunDraGon is recruiting! "Also, your boobs [:o] "   CCP Eterne, 2012 "When in doubt...make a diȼk joke." Robin Williams - RIP
Aliventi
Mouth Trumpet Cavalry.
Mouth Trumpet Cavalry
#7 - 2014-07-09 07:06:18 UTC
Allow LP to be bought, sold, traded, manipulated, scammed with, etc on the open market. LP is just another form of currency that instead of adding isk to the game it acts as an isk sink. People get hung up on the fact it is call "Loyalty Points." Like an NPC cares what you do with the points. Roll It is a reward. If you choose to sell that reward for isk on the open market then you should have the option to.

Once this is implemented it will act as sorts of an NPC stock exchange. Hear a new NPC corp is going to get an LP store buff? Buy buy buy their LP! Hear Minmatar FW is going to go on a crushing offensive of Amarr FW? Better sell your Minmatar LP and buy the Amarr LP because one is about to be come a lot more common and the other a lot more rare. Think of all the great market PvP we will get.
Nolak Ataru
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#8 - 2014-07-09 07:19:37 UTC
Aliventi wrote:
Allow LP to be bought, sold, traded, manipulated, scammed with, etc on the open market. LP is just another form of currency that instead of adding isk to the game it acts as an isk sink. People get hung up on the fact it is call "Loyalty Points." Like an NPC cares what you do with the points. Roll It is a reward. If you choose to sell that reward for isk on the open market then you should have the option to.

Once this is implemented it will act as sorts of an NPC stock exchange. Hear a new NPC corp is going to get an LP store buff? Buy buy buy their LP! Hear Minmatar FW is going to go on a crushing offensive of Amarr FW? Better sell your Minmatar LP and buy the Amarr LP because one is about to be come a lot more common and the other a lot more rare. Think of all the great market PvP we will get.


Well if you continually run L4s for Amarr, they're going to appreciate your efforts.

If Joe Ibis, some guy who runs L4s for Minmatar and is -10 with Amarr, comes along and you give him your LP, in a real world, the Amarr would probably stop giving you missions or, in an extreme instance, convict you of treason.

So no. Leave LP alone.
Jint Hikaru
OffWorld Exploration Inc
#9 - 2014-07-09 08:21:09 UTC
Aliventi wrote:
People get hung up on the fact it is call "Loyalty Points." Like an NPC cares what you do with the points. Roll It is a reward. If you choose to sell that reward for isk on the open market then you should have the option to.


They are called Loyalty Points for a reason. The NPC Corp is rewarding the pilot for his/her 'Loyalty'. Simple as that.

Why would a corporation go tot he trouble of keeping records of your loyalty standing and offering specific items based on this, if you are going to sell them to a person who that Corp hates.

So, I say, No to this idea.

Jint Hikaru - Miner / Salvager / Explorer / SpaceBum In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move.
Fer'isam K'ahn
SAS Veterinarians
#10 - 2014-07-09 09:27:03 UTC
Hmm, some functionality says, 'yes', some system principle and lore says 'no'. Am divided.

Anthar Thebess
#11 - 2014-07-09 09:45:24 UTC
Abrazzar
Vardaugas Family
#12 - 2014-07-09 11:01:14 UTC
"Transferable Loyalty" is a oxymoron.

Sovereignty and Population

New Mining Mechanics
Lothros Andastar
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#13 - 2014-07-09 11:01:16 UTC
Only if it comes at a 10:1 cost. 10 LP for Gallente Corp A = Gallente 1 LP for Corp B.
Corraidhin Farsaidh
Singularity Expedition Services
Singularity Syndicate
#14 - 2014-07-09 11:18:42 UTC
I siad no the last several times this came up and still say no for the usual reasons. It's loyalty reward from a corp to an individual. Not a loyalty reward to someone they never even heard of who happens to know someone they have. The only improvement I can see working here would be a letter of recommendation system whereby the corp can transfer their rewards upwards to the faction the corp has its HQ under. This would allow people to aggregate LP to the factions for cashing in.
My Little Banker
Dead Space Investments
#15 - 2014-07-09 15:11:19 UTC
Aliventi wrote:
Allow LP to be bought, sold, traded, manipulated, scammed with, etc on the open market. LP is just another form of currency that instead of adding isk to the game it acts as an isk sink. People get hung up on the fact it is call "Loyalty Points." Like an NPC cares what you do with the points. Roll It is a reward. If you choose to sell that reward for isk on the open market then you should have the option to.

Once this is implemented it will act as sorts of an NPC stock exchange. Hear a new NPC corp is going to get an LP store buff? Buy buy buy their LP! Hear Minmatar FW is going to go on a crushing offensive of Amarr FW? Better sell your Minmatar LP and buy the Amarr LP because one is about to be come a lot more common and the other a lot more rare. Think of all the great market PvP we will get.

I agree having LP traded like a currency would be the best solution. This would add more content to the game and make the LP store more accessible to non-mission runners.

Also for those of us in 0.0 there is no "loyalty" to a faction just because they give us money. There is little incentive for 0.0 players to use the ESS due to the huge barrier to using the LP you gain. allowing it to be traded would remove this barrier and hopefully more people with use the feature CCP added for 0.0 players.
Daichi Yamato
Jabbersnarks and Wonderglass
#16 - 2014-07-09 17:41:37 UTC
LP is not a currency. Its an attempt at quantifying how much a corp wants to give u neat presents and discounts.

it should never be transferable.

EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided"

Daichi Yamato's version of structure based decs
Gully Alex Foyle
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#17 - 2014-07-09 18:00:17 UTC
+1

It would also be a big help to FW Corps, that could easily 'tax' their member Loyalty Points.

Joe has 100,000 LP.

Corp CEO buys them for 100 Mil ISK.

CEO cashes in all LPs, makes some profit that goes to the Corp coffers.


Would also create a LP market and LP-related 'jobs' (e.g. people specializing in cashing in Amarr LP, doing all the logistics, etc....).


I'm sure there may be downsides and it would be interesting to discuss them.

But so far none of the 'no' posts have managed to point out a single one. Yeah, 'make believe NPC corp would get mad' is a kindergarden argument.

Make space glamorous! Is EVE dying or not? Ask the EVE-O Death-o-meter!
Nolak Ataru
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#18 - 2014-07-09 18:25:37 UTC
Gully Alex Foyle wrote:
It would also be a big help to FW Corps, that could easily 'tax' their member Loyalty Points.
Joe has 100,000 LP.
Corp CEO buys them for 100 Mil ISK.
CEO cashes in all LPs, makes some profit that goes to the Corp coffers.

Would also create a LP market and LP-related 'jobs' (e.g. people specializing in cashing in Amarr LP, doing all the logistics, etc....).

I'm sure there may be downsides and it would be interesting to discuss them.

But so far none of the 'no' posts have managed to point out a single one. Yeah, 'make believe NPC corp would get mad' is a kindergarden argument.


So introduce a LP tax available for FW corps / alliances only. There is already a LP market. It's called the market. The prices on the market reflect the price people are willing to sell their LP at.

If you want to see LP selling in action, join channel "Concord LP" and ask around about how things work. You'll learn a lot.

As for "LP Jobs", those are called "Security / Mining / Distro Missions" and are already in the game.

And CCP goes to a great length to give lore a place in this game. Unless you were living under a rock for the past year or so, the Mordus player events, the Ghost Sites player events, the Battle of Caldari Prime player event..... shall I go on?
Gully Alex Foyle
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#19 - 2014-07-09 18:31:45 UTC
Nolak Ataru wrote:
Gully Alex Foyle wrote:
It would also be a big help to FW Corps, that could easily 'tax' their member Loyalty Points.
Joe has 100,000 LP.
Corp CEO buys them for 100 Mil ISK.
CEO cashes in all LPs, makes some profit that goes to the Corp coffers.

Would also create a LP market and LP-related 'jobs' (e.g. people specializing in cashing in Amarr LP, doing all the logistics, etc....).

I'm sure there may be downsides and it would be interesting to discuss them.

But so far none of the 'no' posts have managed to point out a single one. Yeah, 'make believe NPC corp would get mad' is a kindergarden argument.


So introduce a LP tax available for FW corps / alliances only. There is already a LP market. It's called the market. The prices on the market reflect the price people are willing to sell their LP at.

If you want to see LP selling in action, join channel "Concord LP" and ask around about how things work. You'll learn a lot.

As for "LP Jobs", those are called "Security / Mining / Distro Missions" and are already in the game.

And CCP goes to a great length to give lore a place in this game. Unless you were living under a rock for the past year or so, the Mordus player events, the Ghost Sites player events, the Battle of Caldari Prime player event..... shall I go on?
So...?

That's what npc standings are for, which of course make sense only if they're non-transferrable.

And saying that you can currently somewhat work around a simple concept such as lp transfer is not a solid argument to not introduce it.

Make space glamorous! Is EVE dying or not? Ask the EVE-O Death-o-meter!
Daichi Yamato
Jabbersnarks and Wonderglass
#20 - 2014-07-09 18:40:11 UTC
Gully Alex Foyle wrote:


That's what npc standings are for, which of course make sense only if they're non-transferrable.



Same as LP's.

EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided"

Daichi Yamato's version of structure based decs
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