These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

EVE General Discussion

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

Plex prices

First post
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
Dave stark
#121 - 2014-06-29 09:57:36 UTC
polly papercut wrote:
with the small sample group


we can completely disregard your poll.
Hasikan Miallok
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#122 - 2014-06-29 11:08:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Hasikan Miallok
Dave Stark wrote:
polly papercut wrote:
with the small sample group


we can completely disregard your poll.


Statistically any poll that is voluntary rather than using a preselected balanced sample should be disregarded ot regarded with scepticism.

Common sense says those people upset about Plex will jump at the chance to vote in that poll whereas the people happily Plexing away will tend to not even read it neverlone vote.

Its not only too small a sample it's also a biased sample.
Vyktor Abyss
Abyss Research
#123 - 2014-06-29 11:22:03 UTC
It is obvious that it is in CCP's interest to have very high PLEX prices.

Because people buying them for real money are more likely to do so (to then sell on the market) if the amount of ISK they can return for their real money is higher.

More PLEX sales means more money for CCP.

The only time CCP would intervene would be when large numbers of us "playing for free" people are forced to stop playing, which arguably is starting to happen considering all the PLEX price whine threads lately.

My guess is rather than HELP the playing for free crowd, they'd be more likely to attack the investor crowd first by putting a 30 day expiry on the PLEX after purchase or something to stop ISK rich people stockpiling them.
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor
#124 - 2014-06-29 12:07:49 UTC
Arcelian wrote:
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:
Arcelian wrote:
polly papercut wrote:
Prince Kobol wrote:
I cant wait until Plex prices hit a billion.. the tears will be stunning

Yup all the tears from all the people complaining that there is hardly any players left to pvp.
Followed by all the complaints about how null sec and low sec are dead and empty will be so great.

See for me I will just have more time to work on rl things than computer things. So I will not be here to see all the tears but you can bet your ass they will not come from the people quitting.


My god, are the majority of eve players in poverty? Can't afford that $15 sub? I had no idea that was such a colossal amount of money.


I am currently living in a country where $600 is a NICE monthly wage. ….


So... CCP should lower plex prices and cut into their profits because of the poor countries so individuals that make little income can play? Sorry, but that is a small minority of the eve player base, and not a reason to lower plex prices from a business stand point.


No, you missed the point. All that needs to happen is for the folks living in the USA to stop calling people "poor" just because they can't afford (or don't want to afford) $15 a month to play a game that they can invest a little time in to play for free.

Day 0 Advice for New Players
Mario Putzo
#125 - 2014-06-29 13:59:56 UTC
TharOkha wrote:
Mario Putzo wrote:
Meh, 1 half hour of work and it pays for my account. 1 day of work out of the 25 or so I work in a month lets me be filthy rich selling PLEX to no lifes who can't be assed to go out and get a job and would rather complain that it takes them 6-8 hours to grind out isk for a plex instead of working for an hour and just paying for the game.

Thanks for your ISK losers, get a job ya bums.


here you go you ignorant ***meh***.


Then don't play video games if you can't afford too.

Option A)
Suck it up and realize plex demand has driven the cost up, meaning you need to put in more effort to play for "free"

Option B)
Pay for the account in a normal manner with cash, or credit.

Stop being an entitled little **** and expecting that the environment change to include you. You adapt to the environment, just like in the real world. If you don't adapt you get left behind, just like the real world.

Whether you make $600 a month, or $2000 a month, the onus is on you to budget yourself accordingly, not on CCP, not on this community, and not on "ignorant" people like me.

If you can't afford it, you can't afford it....welcome to life and more often than not it isn't fair.
Arcelian
0nus
#126 - 2014-06-29 14:15:52 UTC

Mara Rinn wrote:

No, you missed the point. All that needs to happen is for the folks living in the USA to stop calling people "poor" just because they can't afford (or don't want to afford) $15 a month to play a game that they can invest a little time in to play for free.



I missed the point... what point are you trying to make? People complain plex is too expensive, I say it's perfectly fine, and you don't like that I say that. Pretty clear to me.

If you can't afford $15 a month, yeah you are poor. That's 50 cents a day. Barely enough to feed a starving child in Africa, or so that's what the infomercials on TV say.

It's a giant crock of poo to say that plex prices are going to be preventing a lot of people from playing. The poor non westerners or what have you that can't afford a sub are not the ones losing out on this. It's the vocal, minority bitter-vets that are up in arms about it. And what's funny is they are probably the ones causing the prices to rise in the first place.

It's like some of you don't remember that PLEX is a relatively new thing, eve did just fine without it for many years. If PLEX didn't exist anymore tomorrow, eve wouldn't die because of it...
Jenn aSide
Worthless Carebears
The Initiative.
#127 - 2014-06-29 14:36:22 UTC
TharOkha wrote:

Dude im not complaining about my monthly salary. (read the link i posted).. Im just tired of those "elitists" that moaning "get a job" while they cannot see behind their national border, how the rest of the world lives and what average monthly salary is "out there"..

My monthly ingame isk icome is waaaaay over PLEX price and my ingame needs, thats why i PLEX my account rather than pay 21 EUR for it. For 21 EUR i can buy food for a 5-6 days.



You're looking at it the wrong way. I has nothing to do with what country you live in, and people aren't being "elitist" for telling people to not play a video game if they can't afford it. I personally think the sense of 'entitlement' coming from some who use plex is irratating, CCP doesn't owe anyone cheap plex to play their game. CCP is a western for profit company, pay their price for their service or don't.

That being said, the 'get a job' crowd is stupid. They tend to be pvp only types who thinks that everything else is 'unfun'. I pay with pex because I LIKE PVE/doing things that make is and I'd much rather spend 5 or 6 hours a month killing rats in a video game while sitting in my chair in front of my computer drunk and on comms.

For me the alternative is to put on my uniform , equipment and weapons for an extra 30 minutes a month to go deal with criminals. I like EVE but damn if I'm risking my life for it if I can achile the same goal while butt ass naked at home. It's fine if the 'get a job' crowd wants to do that because they work at a nice safe job like Kinkos or McDonalds, but alas some of us like the video game we're playing and would prefer to do that instead.
Jenn aSide
Worthless Carebears
The Initiative.
#128 - 2014-06-29 14:38:24 UTC
Arcelian wrote:

Mara Rinn wrote:

No, you missed the point. All that needs to happen is for the folks living in the USA to stop calling people "poor" just because they can't afford (or don't want to afford) $15 a month to play a game that they can invest a little time in to play for free.



I missed the point... what point are you trying to make? People complain plex is too expensive, I say it's perfectly fine, and you don't like that I say that. Pretty clear to me.

If you can't afford $15 a month, yeah you are poor. That's 50 cents a day. Barely enough to feed a starving child in Africa, or so that's what the infomercials on TV say.

It's a giant crock of poo to say that plex prices are going to be preventing a lot of people from playing. The poor non westerners or what have you that can't afford a sub are not the ones losing out on this. It's the vocal, minority bitter-vets that are up in arms about it. And what's funny is they are probably the ones causing the prices to rise in the first place.

It's like some of you don't remember that PLEX is a relatively new thing, eve did just fine without it for many years. If PLEX didn't exist anymore tomorrow, eve wouldn't die because of it...



LMAO, AAs I read that i totally heard a white woman in my mind singing about being in the arms of some angels.

"50 cents a day is all that is needed to help Goons. Won't you help a child in Deklien today?"

Big smile
Arcelian
0nus
#129 - 2014-06-29 15:08:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Arcelian
Jenn aSide wrote:
TharOkha wrote:

Dude im not complaining about my monthly salary. (read the link i posted).. Im just tired of those "elitists" that moaning "get a job" while they cannot see behind their national border, how the rest of the world lives and what average monthly salary is "out there"..

My monthly ingame isk icome is waaaaay over PLEX price and my ingame needs, thats why i PLEX my account rather than pay 21 EUR for it. For 21 EUR i can buy food for a 5-6 days.



You're looking at it the wrong way. I has nothing to do with what country you live in, and people aren't being "elitist" for telling people to not play a video game if they can't afford it. I personally think the sense of 'entitlement' coming from some who use plex is irratating, CCP doesn't owe anyone cheap plex to play their game. CCP is a western for profit company, pay their price for their service or don't.

That being said, the 'get a job' crowd is stupid. They tend to be pvp only types who thinks that everything else is 'unfun'. I pay with pex because I LIKE PVE/doing things that make is and I'd much rather spend 5 or 6 hours a month killing rats in a video game while sitting in my chair in front of my computer drunk and on comms.

For me the alternative is to put on my uniform , equipment and weapons for an extra 30 minutes a month to go deal with criminals. I like EVE but damn if I'm risking my life for it if I can achile the same goal while butt ass naked at home. It's fine if the 'get a job' crowd wants to do that because they work at a nice safe job like Kinkos or McDonalds, but alas some of us like the video game we're playing and would prefer to do that instead.


You aren't the only one with a dangerous profession, but it's NORMAL to have a job to pay for entertainment. I don't go to the movies and work the snack bar for a couple of hours so I can get a ticket.... I have a job to pay for the necessities and the extravagances (which my job also includes a uniform, and guns).


And I feel like this belongs here.

Here you go.
Lady Areola Fappington
#130 - 2014-06-29 15:56:38 UTC
Jenn aSide wrote:


You're looking at it the wrong way. I has nothing to do with what country you live in, and people aren't being "elitist" for telling people to not play a video game if they can't afford it. I personally think the sense of 'entitlement' coming from some who use plex is irratating, CCP doesn't owe anyone cheap plex to play their game. CCP is a western for profit company, pay their price for their service or don't.

That being said, the 'get a job' crowd is stupid. They tend to be pvp only types who thinks that everything else is 'unfun'. I pay with pex because I LIKE PVE/doing things that make is and I'd much rather spend 5 or 6 hours a month killing rats in a video game while sitting in my chair in front of my computer drunk and on comms.

For me the alternative is to put on my uniform , equipment and weapons for an extra 30 minutes a month to go deal with criminals. I like EVE but damn if I'm risking my life for it if I can achile the same goal while butt ass naked at home. It's fine if the 'get a job' crowd wants to do that because they work at a nice safe job like Kinkos or McDonalds, but alas some of us like the video game we're playing and would prefer to do that instead.



Sorry Jenn, but the only thing I pulled out of your post was the "Butt ass naked" bit.

Could you please maybe snap a few pix of that? Perhaps wearing the Sam Brown and the hat please. Pirate

This is very relevant to my interests and studies.

7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided. --Eve New Player Guide
Matilda Cecilia Fock
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#131 - 2014-06-29 16:10:51 UTC
Just another take on the issue (my 2 cents):

- Active players have gone down by 20%
- Very likely active subscriptions have gone down by 20%
- PLEX trade has gone down by 10%
- PLEX price has gone up by 40%

So, PLEX demand should have gone down by 20% (as the ultimate purpose of a PLEX is to pay an account). But it only has gone down 10%, and price has gone up by 40%.

The standard explanation is speculation and stockpiling: PLEX are being traded at a faster pace and prices are being driven up by the expectation of profits, rather than the need to pay accounts.

But I want to ask: what about supply? What if people unsubbing were net PLEX suppliers rather than PLEX consumers/speculators?

Q: Should we be worried? A: Nope. (...) Worry a lot if Fozzie, Masterplan, Rise, Veritas, Bettik, Ytterbium, Scarpia, Arrow, or even Greyscale leaves. Worry a little if Punkturis, karkur, SoniClover, Affinity, Goliath, or Xhagen leaves.
Unezka Turigahl
Det Som Engang Var
#132 - 2014-06-29 16:48:37 UTC
Arcelian wrote:

That's 50 cents a day. Barely enough to feed a starving child in Africa, or so that's what the infomercials on TV say.


You mean barely enough to buy every African child a bible, and build a church in every town. Roll

But yeah, the PLEX is too damn high! I wish CCP would at least disconnect PLEX from AUR and the NES and other services. It seems they plan to go the opposite direction though, and retire PLEX and move to an AUR-only system.

Hmm. Maybe I'll actually start paying for my sub again, and play the game without alts. Woah. That would be really weird. P
Poo Sugar
Swiss Army Spoons
#133 - 2014-06-29 17:22:26 UTC
I wanted to post in this new and refreshing thread.
polly papercut
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#134 - 2014-06-29 17:40:14 UTC  |  Edited by: polly papercut
Hasikan Miallok wrote:
Dave Stark wrote:
polly papercut wrote:
with the small sample group


we can completely disregard your poll.


Statistically any poll that is voluntary rather than using a preselected balanced sample should be disregarded ot regarded with scepticism.

Common sense says those people upset about Plex will jump at the chance to vote in that poll whereas the people happily Plexing away will tend to not even read it neverlone vote.

Its not only too small a sample it's also a biased sample.

Actually the amount of people who are happy with plex prices are completely irrelevant to the purpose of the poll. The purpose of the poll was just to get a sample head count of how many people have canceled accounts because on plex prices.

This was not a are you satisfied with the plex prices poll. I could have left out the answer about not canceling any account still achieved the desired results.

And seeing that we have a fair number of canceled accounts over a small sample size it if safe to assume that there are a large number of canceled accounts due to the price of plex.

The fact that the sample size is smaller than the amount of canceled accounts highly suggest that. If anything my own poll is working against me as I can not reach the people who have canceled there only account or all of there accounts. .

So if this was a satisfactory poll you would have a point about the small sample size but as the purpose of the poll is trying to tally the amount of canceled accounts the small sample size works in my favor.

The reason for that is one we know we didn't reach every person who has canceled an account. We need to factor in the people who don't come to the forum and the people who have out right quit eve with one or more accounts.

There for the poll iso 100% relevant.

I wasn't going to bother posting back as the forums are typically a place for the eve lifers and fan boys hence an other reason the poll works against me.
But I caught a rerun of to catch a predator last night,
and they were talking about how many pedophiles they caught out in this little back water town.
I thought to my self man if they caught that many pedophiles in such a small area (small sample size) just think of how many pedophiles there really must be.

Same applies here small sample size large number of accounts for the size. Just think how many more canceled accounts we don't know about. .

*drops the mic
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#135 - 2014-06-29 17:50:55 UTC
polly papercut wrote:
The reason for that is one we know we didn't reach every person who has canceled an account. We need to factor in the people who don't come to the forum and the people who have out right quit eve with one or more accounts.

There for the poll iso 100% relevant.
No, it is still 100% irrelevant because you're still only dealing with a self-selecting biased sample. Your sample size is insignificant and your sample selection process is thoroughly flawed. Therefore, the poll gives an absolute number that tells us nothing of any interest.

Quote:
I thought to my self man if they caught that many pedophilestudents in such a small area (small sample size) just think of how many pedophiles there really must be.

Same applies here small sample size large number of accounts for the size. Just think how many more canceled accounts we don't know about. .

*drops the mic
You should probably not try to handle microphones if your hands are that slippery. You're quite correct, though, but in the exact opposite of what you're hoping for: the small and biased sample of a back-water town is indeed a thoroughly invalid source for any kind of conclusion about the general population — same as for the minute-n self-selecting poll. Your conclusion is just as wrong about it as about the poll in question and for the exact same reasons.
Plug in Baby
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#136 - 2014-06-29 18:03:33 UTC
Remiel Pollard wrote:
Plug in Baby wrote:
Remiel Pollard wrote:
I'm one of those people that buys PLEX from CCP and sells it in-game, and manipulates the market whenever possible to keep prices high so I can make a lot of isk..


So let me get this straight, you are introducing PLEX to the game and somehow you have convinced yourself that you are increasing PLEX prices.


No, you haven't been trolled


Oh dear Roll I'm sure your method for breaking the fundamentals of economics is great, even if your posting suggests you don't quite understand high school statistics.

This is not a forum alt, this is a forum main.
polly papercut
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#137 - 2014-06-29 18:04:30 UTC  |  Edited by: polly papercut
Tippia wrote:
No, it is still 100% irrelevant because you're still only dealing with a self-selecting biased sample. Your sample size is insignificant and your sample selection process is thoroughly flawed. Therefore, the poll gives an absolute number that tells us nothing of any interest.
sorry but your wrong. When the purpose of the poll is solely to try to get a tally of canceled accounts due to plex prices it doesn't need to be unbiased at all. But again I'm talking to an eve lifer so carry on.
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#138 - 2014-06-29 18:06:05 UTC
Pretty interesting discussion here...

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Ralph King-Griffin
New Eden Tech Support
#139 - 2014-06-29 18:07:34 UTC
I took your pole and I lied...what dose that mean for your numbers eh?

Murderers of Negotiable Motivations

=]|[=
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#140 - 2014-06-29 18:19:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
polly papercut wrote:
sorry but your wrong.
Not really, no.
You're just trying to constantly redefine what the purpose of the poll is when it (inevitably) turns out that it utterly fails to fulfil whatever purpose you're trying to attribute to it next.

Quote:
When the purpose of the poll is solely to try to get a tally of canceled accounts due to plex prices it doesn't need to be unbiased at all.
If that's all it's supposed to do, then it is if anything even more meaningless since it you can't even relate that number to anything relevant. It fails to provide a useful tally since it simply doesn't tally the people who cancel their accounts — just a (insignificantly minute) number of them who just so happen to discover and answer the poll. It tells you absolutely nothing about those who didn't take the poll. It offers zero generalisability.

Your poll still needs to be unbiased and sufficiently large in order to actually do what it's supposed to do, otherwise it's just a meaningless random number generator.