EVE General Discussion

L4 Epic Arcs, maybe? Granted, they are pretty much a bunch of L4s scripted to get offered one after the other without any expiration timers. There's a lot more traveling around to do as well, but at least the end-mission rewards are fairly descent (you get a implant at the end of the Amarr one that sells for a pretty good price). They are only repeatable every three months, but as long as your standings with one or more of the major factions aren't in the toilet, it's kind of like a new set of L4s.

I'm only throwing that out their because I didn't see it proposed, though some of the other posts might be better in regards to being both profitable and break away from the L4 crowd at the same time (some are even quite interesting to say the least).

Fair enough!

Unfortunately, the number of online games that offer any complexity in their game play (be it character progression, trading/crafting, equipment) has... deteriorated over the years, and EvE is one of the last games left that offers something to people looking for more depth than "when you press the button, something AWESOME happens"...

In that vein, the EvE developers are the greatest troll of the industry for ensuring that the bullies that derive their fun from "harvesting tears" and "making dozens of people ragequit" are stuck in the same game as the nerds that don't consider a game interesting unless its rulebook comes in three telephone book sized volumes (printed in extra small text, no illustrations)

Ironically I probably fall into that category Jenn. It means I focus on strategy (ship fits, fleet comps and such), and fly mostly tiny ships that I don't care about losing.

I would also like to point out that EVE is unique for more reasons than just sandbox and space. It has a unique fighting style, with no skills and abilities and such, meaning there isnt button spamming or anything to that effect. On top of that, the biggest selling point for me was the economy, and all the options for making money. Show me another game with mining like this, where your character can be built just around that. What about hauling? I dont know any other game that has that. A couple indy games have some similar stuff, but they dont look nice, nor do they have it all. Some MMOs have some of the features, but none have them all.

The adrenaline isnt the problem. The problem is that I just dont like PvP. I am not any good, and never have been in any of the MMOs that I played. The last time I did "decent" in PvP, it was called PK, and was on a ROT MUD. It just isnt my thing, and I dont enjoy losing my stuff. If I am still making headway, it isnt a big deal, but losing and losing (which my previous attempts in low sec turned into) just wasnt fun. Yes, I could have joined up with other people, and spent a bunch of time trying to avoid gate camps, but it isnt my thing. I dont fault EVE for any of it, and openly admit that I am not playing the game to the fullest. It still doesnt change that nothing out there is like EVE, and I enjoy EVE in the way that I play it.

To each their own. Having tried PvP I can say it held no special allure for me. I'm not keen of being on the receiving end since it's rarely fair and never had any motivation to be on the giving end. There was a "high" of sorts, but i supposed since I'd found myself entertained by other activities it just didn't take.

(a) Probe ded complexes to find valuable deadspace loot. Ded 3s and Ded 4s allow cruisers, hacs and faction cruisers in, recommended faction cruiser or hac. In my experience serpentis earned me about 65m/hr long term, and gurista highsec exploration was worth nearly twice as much (it is all very streaky though).

(b) probe and complete hideout complexes, and trigger their escalations to follow them in highsec to more deadspace loot
can be done in a frigate.

(c) complete lookout, watch and vigil escalations which are mostly highsec but end in lowsec (the unrated escalations).
Stratios is your one stop shop for this, as it has good dps and cloak warps, the end of the escalations are mostly very short and the bookmark is private, forcing people to probe you down, and not forcing you to fly into a public signature that other people may already have bookmarked. It is the safest PVE you can do in lowsec due to unpredictable schedule, and lack of public BMs for others to ambush at, and short time exposure.

(d) farm highsec dens, which means spending a few hours shooting easy encounters with frequent faction cruiser spawns, that will also escalate to lowsec to the enjoyable ded 5 escalation, and once again, you'll have a private bookmark, that people can only enter by scanning you down. This is harder, but has valuable b-type cruiser loot, and loads faction cruiser blueprints. I farmed all of my own vigilants doing this (or directly hunting the hydroponics ded 5 signature).

Some of those task are purely highsec, others are mostly done in highsec, with a short period of lowsec exposure. All are safer than pure lowsec exploration. Due to the limited lowsec exposure, and delayed nature of people attempting to catch me (have to scan me down), I did all of the above for considerable amounts of time without losing a ship to another player.

All of the above also gets you out of lumbering battleships, and makes EVE quite a different experience.

The simple fact that you refer to players who simply enjoy a play style that you do not as "bullies" and assume that the goal of every ganker or PVP player is to "harvest tears" and "make dozens of people ragequit" speaks volumes in terms of your understanding of the nature of the game in the first place.

Though, you do have a fair point - and I agree. I don't think players who feel they are "stuck" in the same game as everyone else should have to experience that. I would be delighted if CCP would create a single additional main server with some very simple changes - all areas of space outside of high-sec are removed, and all forms of in space player vs. player combat with the exception of combat that all parties agree to beforehand removed. After launch, existing characters would have 30 days to move characters to this server, and new characters will get a selection screen that offers the choice between "Eve Classic" and "New Eve". Of course, this screen will explain all of the differences between the two versions in detail, and in a way that is easy to understand for new players.

This will allow the game development teams to work on whatever version of EVE has the most need - with need being determined by server population and changes in game balance. I expect that "Eve Classic" will receive a much higher amount of development due to a vastly greater server population and the need to balance the game - while "New Eve" will not require much effort at all - since PVP outside of the "dual" mechanic will be removed, there will be no need to spend endless hours coming up with new and creative ways to tweak the game to cater to a minority of players who feel that AFK mining in a untanked barge should carry no risk - or that running the same set of a handful of missions over and over again should be totally free from any other player creating content that can make any change to the progression of that mission.

Your logical fault is that you want it all - you want a game that is rich and very complex and a lightyear beyond the traditional cookier-cutter themepark MMO, but you don't want to have to interact with players you feel are "bullies" and still enjoy the same complexity and overall experience. I believe that in practice you would find that when you start to remove the option for play styles that don't jive with your personal code of e-bushido - you will just end up with a boring shallow game that your inner nerd will have no desire to play.

In a seriousness, though - i'd love CCP to do this! With all of the players who want to play internet spaceships EVE style but without any interaction with a player that they do not have a choice to allow or deny able to play on a server that gives them just what they want, those players can stop ruining the game for everyone else and the "Eve Classic" server will become about ten thousand times more fun!

To clarify - I don't think that all gankers etc. are bullies. Ganking and other forms of non-consensual pvp for profit (be it ganking overloaded industrials in Jita, camping lowsec traffic routes, driving competition out of you mining system) is something I have no problem with & something that makes the game more interesting as a whole. As the victim you can fight against it - once you make sure your enemy looses more than you, you're winning.

However, eve attracts more than enough people willing to throw all ingame benefits down the drain as long as they make sure the other person isn't having fun. There's no point in making sure that the attacker is unable to gain any monetary benefit from your demise (e.g. by preventing looting/salvaging with counteraggression) when all he's out to do is ruining your day. You either make sure he can't touch you at all (which is quite difficult given how cheap various alphastrike ships are) - or you make sure you avoid him.

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