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Can anything be truly infinite?

Author
Sabriz Adoudel
Move along there is nothing here
#21 - 2014-06-25 06:18:32 UTC
When I first encountered the difference between countable and uncountable infinities, my mind was blown.

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Mikael Menethil
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#22 - 2014-06-25 12:50:29 UTC
This might be of assistance:

"We now know (as of 2013) that the universe is flat with only a 0.4% margin of error. This suggests that the Universe is infinite in extent; however, since the Universe has a finite age, we can only observe a finite volume of the Universe. All we can truly conclude is that the Universe is much larger than the volume we can directly observe."

NASA
http://wmap.gsfc.nasa.gov/universe/uni_shape.html

Recycling and repeating indefinitely sounds right to me.
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#23 - 2014-06-25 13:38:42 UTC  |  Edited by: Krixtal Icefluxor
Sabriz Adoudel wrote:
When I first encountered the difference between countable and uncountable infinities, my mind was blown.



This is covered extensively in my Rudy Rucker book recommendation on Page 1.

Anyone care for an Aleph ???? Big smile

ed: The first time I read that book and finished it, I felt incredibly small and insignificant.

Finding out that one can count to infinity.....then add "1", then keep going and going and going....was indeed mind blowing.

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882

Eurydia Vespasian
Storm Hunters
#24 - 2014-06-25 14:05:03 UTC
i get confused with the ideas of the universe and space and how they are used. the way i thought it was, is that the universe is everything that happened/came out of with the big bang and has limits because it is only so old. but space, the empty void that the universe resides in...is infinite.

thinking too hard about this stuff sends my head just spinning. like the rules that something can't come from nothing. if that's true then space has always been here. the universe has always been here. in some form or another. or if you subscribe to religion and believe an all powerful deity is responsible...who created the deity? all things must have an origin. or do they?

i suppose space would have always had to be here regardless. one way or the other. because it is literally nothing right? the very definition of nothing.
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#25 - 2014-06-25 14:28:33 UTC
Eurydia Vespasian wrote:
i get confused with the ideas of the universe and space and how they are used. the way i thought it was, is that the universe is everything that happened/came out of with the big bang and has limits because it is only so old. but space, the empty void that the universe resides in...is infinite.

thinking too hard about this stuff sends my head just spinning. like the rules that something can't come from nothing. if that's true then space has always been here. the universe has always been here. in some form or another. or if you subscribe to religion and believe an all powerful deity is responsible...who created the deity? all things must have an origin. or do they?

i suppose space would have always had to be here regardless. one way or the other. because it is literally nothing right? the very definition of nothing.



This is just opinion:

The "space" that contains our universe is indeed infinitely old. The matter and energy (photons) from the big bang, are so far finite in age, but infinite in quantity. As more photons reach us from the nether regions, our view of the universe gets larger. It's all there, we just cannot see that far yet as the photons have not reached us.

I need to lay down for awhile............Lol

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882

Kijo Rikki
Killboard Padding Services
#26 - 2014-06-25 15:14:18 UTC
I thought that space and time had a beginning with the big bang, but because of the as yet misunderstood dark energy, the universe is expected to expand to "infinity", of course it is also theorized that dark energy will tear the universe apart down to the last subatomic particle, so there must be an end.

Also we will never be able to see how big the universe really is. It's not a question of the light having enough time to reach us, it's that there is a visual barrier to the beginning of the universe from a time when the universe was just a hot plasma that light cannot penetrate. The Cosmic Microwave Background is as far as we will ever see no matter how long we wait or how good our telescopes get. There is also the fact that as the universe increasingly expans with greater and greater speed, the galaxies furthest away from us will actually be accelerating away from us faster than the speed of light, so as time goes on more and more of the universe will become invisible to us and it will feel smaller even though it is getting bigger.

You make a valid point, good Sir or Madam. 

Wrayeth
Inexorable Retribution
#27 - 2014-06-25 15:31:43 UTC
Unsuccessful At Everything wrote:
There is a Yo Momma joke in here somewhere.. just waiting to be born...


Yo momma's so fat that, when she steps on a scale, the readout only shows the twin loops of the infinity symbol?


In regards to the original post, I find that infinity is a difficult topic to ponder in any aspect, whether it's time, space, or something else. How does one truly consider the infinite? Our minds are finite things, so the best description of infinity that we will ever be able to conceive of will, of necessity, be an abstraction.

Also, when considered beyond a certain point, it sometimes gives me chills.
Ila Dace
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#28 - 2014-06-25 16:56:54 UTC
jason hill
Red vs Blue Flight Academy
#29 - 2014-06-25 18:00:45 UTC
I believe it cos buzz lightyear said it ...TOOOOO INFINITY AAAAAAND BEYOOOOOND !

so it must be true ok !
Big smileBig smileBig smileBig smile
Evei Shard
Shard Industries
#30 - 2014-06-25 18:38:51 UTC
Ila Dace wrote:
http://www.science20.com/the_greatest_science_mysteries/the_infinite_multiverse_and_monkeys_typing_pi-138060

Indefinite is so much easier to manage.


If I understand the article right, the idea is based on a finite view of infinite series. 1 + 1/2 + 1/3 + 1/4.. and so on eventually equating to 2, but only at infinity.

His description of an infinite number of monkeys typing, and the assertion that none of them would ever type out PI is based on a finite view of things.

There's this invisible wall between the finite and the infinite. Why we tend to put this wall there is difficult to understand, but that wall tends to result in the idea that an infinite number of monkeys would not be able to type out PI in its entirety (which is also infinite). Observably none of them will, but, for lack of better terms, infinity demands that it will eventually happen.

Profit favors the prepared

Baneken
Arctic Light Inc.
Arctic Light
#31 - 2014-06-25 18:55:02 UTC  |  Edited by: Baneken
I leave this famous quote here: "Two things are infinite, human stupidity and the universe and I'm not sure about the latter". Cool

Sometimes when I read the news that quote does seem to be spot on.
Ila Dace
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#32 - 2014-06-25 19:08:12 UTC
Evei Shard wrote:
Ila Dace wrote:
http://www.science20.com/the_greatest_science_mysteries/the_infinite_multiverse_and_monkeys_typing_pi-138060

Indefinite is so much easier to manage.


If I understand the article right, the idea is based on a finite view of infinite series. 1 + 1/2 + 1/3 + 1/4.. and so on eventually equating to 2, but only at infinity.

His description of an infinite number of monkeys typing, and the assertion that none of them would ever type out PI is based on a finite view of things.

There's this invisible wall between the finite and the infinite. Why we tend to put this wall there is difficult to understand, but that wall tends to result in the idea that an infinite number of monkeys would not be able to type out PI in its entirety (which is also infinite). Observably none of them will, but, for lack of better terms, infinity demands that it will eventually happen.

Actually his point is more along the lines of "infinties do not cancel each other out." The notion of mathematical infinity cannot be applied to say it will happen, as the two inifinities are not equivalent and can never be.

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