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Ganking miners - What do you get from it?

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KnowUsByTheDead
Sunlight...Through The Blight.
#121 - 2014-06-21 23:27:20 UTC
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
Ramona McCandless wrote:
I am chill, we were just joshing

Ask Jonah, he and me are tight, y'all
Confirming that we poke fun at each other on the forum for giggles, it's all good.


Oh, I wasn't worried. Blink

Merely using the moment to point out how nonsensical the party lines of Carebear v. Non-consensual PvPer has become.

Y'know, for posterity.

Big smile

Once you realize what a joke everything is, being the comedian is the only thing that makes sense.
Baden Luskan
Freeworlds Collective
#122 - 2014-06-21 23:34:16 UTC
Christine Peeveepeeski wrote:
Ok first things first, Not a whine thread! I think it's fine that people can be assploded in high sec as they are. What confuses me is why so many do it.

I get freighter ganks, mostly that's for iskies but miners puzzles me.

Bare with me here because I know this could be seen as troll bait so first I will lay out my experiences ganking miners.

I tried it for maybe a few days, racked up about 4 orca and 20 or so hulk/mack kills quite a while back. Got bored because it's so easy, tears were not that common and not so tasty compared to pvper tears. All in all I found it lacklustre. Used up my suicide cat/thrasher collection then went back to pewing wt's.

How about you guys that do it permanently? Surely you must be doing this on alts as i can't imagine it enough to sustain playing a main for?

I am genuinely interested, why do you do it?


The answer is both quite simple and complex at the same time. Simply, there are a group of people in the world who enjoy being assholes (no better word to use -- sorry ISD). The ones in Eve who kill miners do it because they can calculate the risk/reward and know they will not risk a loss. This is because you can mathematically figure out how much damage you need to destroy a mining barge/exhumer in the allotted time Concord gives before they show up. In essence, the ganker is doing the exact same thing the high-sec miner is doing, just on the extreme opposite side of the spectrum. Add to this the facts that 99% of the miners can't defend themselves (no weapon systems past drones) and how the game mechanics in high-sec favor the ganker if he does not mind suicide-ing his ship in the process.
Ramona McCandless
Silent Vale
LinkNet
#123 - 2014-06-21 23:38:00 UTC
Baden Luskan wrote:

The ones in Eve who kill miners do it because they can calculate the risk/reward and know they will not risk a loss.


Ignoring the random insults and general rudeness of your post; please tell me more about the reward that you get for the "non-loss" of a 15m isk ship per attempt and the 22m isk per tag sec tag purchaces, and also the cost of clone replacement if the ganker actually finds someone who is defending himself (as unlikely as that is).

"Yea, some dude came in and was normal for first couple months, so I gave him director." - Sean Dunaway

"A singular character could be hired to penetrate another corps space... using gorilla like tactics..." - Chane Morgann
admiral root
Red Galaxy
#124 - 2014-06-21 23:41:06 UTC
Baden Luskan wrote:
The answer is both quite simple and complex at the same time. Simply, there are a group of people in the world who enjoy being assholes (no better word to use -- sorry ISD). The ones in Eve who kill miners do it because they can calculate the risk/reward and know they will not risk a loss.


So if I shoot you in the head while playing counterstrike or I take your queen while playing chess you'd consider me to be an *******?

Baden Luskan wrote:
Add to this the facts that 99% of the miners can't defend themselves (no weapon systems past drones) and how the game mechanics in high-sec favor the ganker if he does not mind suicide-ing his ship in the process.


Two things here, first of all, could you kindly cite your source showing 99%? Secondly, it's not that miners can't defend themselves, it's that they won't.

No, your rights end in optimal+2*falloff
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#125 - 2014-06-21 23:42:53 UTC
admiral root wrote:


Are you kidding? With those paltry yields I'd have to get friends to help me. What kind of multiplayer game are you trying to sell me here?


Turns out people needed that kind of ship to play this massively multiplayer game solo. Personally I would just adapt as I have always done.
Domanique Altares
Rifterlings
#126 - 2014-06-21 23:44:03 UTC
It's not surprising that you find no interest in this activity, OP. You're a good PvP pilot. I've called targets and gotten warp ins for others, but never ganked a miner in high sec.
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#127 - 2014-06-21 23:45:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Jonah Gravenstein
Baden Luskan wrote:
The answer is both quite simple and complex at the same time. Simply, there are a group of people in the world who enjoy being assholes (no better word to use -- sorry ISD). The ones in Eve who kill miners do it because they can calculate the risk/reward and know they will not risk a loss.
They do it because A: it's fun, B: your tears are delicious, they're good for the skin too, and C: it's good for the economy, everything they destroy has to be replaced.

Quote:
This is because you can mathematically figure out how much damage you need to destroy a mining barge/exhumer in the allotted time Concord gives before they show up.
If people could be arsed to tank their ships they'd throw the maths out, and increase the cost of ganking too Shocked

Quote:
In essence, the ganker is doing the exact same thing the high-sec miner is doing, just on the extreme opposite side of the spectrum.
I'll allow you this, miners farm asteroids, gankers farm miner tears.

Quote:
Add to this the facts that 99% of the miners can't defend themselves (no weapon systems past drones) and how the game mechanics in high-sec favor the ganker if he does not mind suicide-ing his ship in the process.
You mean won't defend themselves, being a hard to gank miner is not about using drones to kill your attackers, it's about using your brain and the tools available to you to make yourself difficult to gank.

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#128 - 2014-06-21 23:48:35 UTC
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
I'll allow you this, miners farm asteroids, gankers farm miner tears.


Free range, like in most forms of livestock farming, is the best.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
Kezia The Accused
Doomheim
#129 - 2014-06-21 23:53:04 UTC
Baden Luskan wrote:


The answer is both quite simple and complex at the same time. Simply, there are a group of people in the world who enjoy being assholes (no better word to use -- sorry ISD). The ones in Eve who kill miners do it because they can calculate the risk/reward and know they will not risk a loss. This is because you can mathematically figure out how much damage you need to destroy a mining barge/exhumer in the allotted time Concord gives before they show up. In essence, the ganker is doing the exact same thing the high-sec miner is doing, just on the extreme opposite side of the spectrum. Add to this the facts that 99% of the miners can't defend themselves (no weapon systems past drones) and how the game mechanics in high-sec favor the ganker if he does not mind suicide-ing his ship in the process.



Thank you for answering the thread, random NPC corp member #345256366234.

We at The Institute For The Study Of Pssshhh Development have concluded that your thoughts mean little. After all, it was a CCP employee who said the following in regards to ganking...

CCP Falcon wrote:


Some men just want to watch the world burn.

There's space for us all in New Eden.



While reading your response, we at the Institute realized that you suffer from one of the following...

1. Inability to tank a ship. Please join EvE Uni.

2. Inability to align. Please learn game mechanics.

3. Have learned that EvE is a game of mathematics. Congrats.

4. Lack general pssshhh while playing EvE. Remember to post your QQ thread in OOPE, to help our wonderful ISD's.

At this time, due to recent cuts and economic reasons, CCP has not the time, nor the effort to give further "pssshhh" to miners who completely overlooked the past 3 years of extra "pssshhh" already given to barges and exhumers.

As the Study of these development measures increases, we will be able to give you more definitive answers as to why things are this way. Until then, your post is not it at all. It needs more........pssshhh.
BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#130 - 2014-06-22 00:16:08 UTC
Herr Wilkus wrote:
The joy of placing their smiling faces into my address book, waiting for them to log in, and ganking them over and over until they stop logging in. I have quite an impressive collection of dead subscriptions. My personal FU to CCP, as i believe they are beyond saving. Their conduct regarding Erotica1's banning came pretty close to motivating me to start up again, if I didn't have other pressures on my time....

If gankers want to impact CCP's bottom line and retention rate, they should NEVER unsubscribe, but instead use their resources to make carebears unsub instead. Has a much greater impact, and I smile inwardly when I see another thread about layoffs.
In this regard, I differ from Ero1 and CODE, who really just want to have fun and save bears from dull gameplay.
I'd rather carebears are just exterminated entirely.

I believe this is the first time that I have heard someone say that they attempt to drive other players out of the game. ******* disgusting. I know some players leave due to entitlement issues, but I never attack someone with the hope that they will quit the game, and I can confidently say that most of my allies approach combat with the same mindset. If someone does quit because their ship gets blown up, then eve is probably not the game for them.

I hope the anti-ganking group has some understanding that Herr Wilkus is not representative of gankers as a whole.

Founder of Violet Squadron, a small gang NPSI community! Mail me for more information.

BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie's Space Mediation Service!
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#131 - 2014-06-22 00:24:09 UTC
BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie wrote:

I believe this is the first time that I have heard someone say that they attempt to drive other players out of the game.


I'll tell you straight up that I've done it myself. I should clarify however that only twice has it been intentional, to drive out the individual who doxxed me back in 2009. (it's why I post on an alt).

Accidentally, I imagine I've done it a bunch of times. If even a fifth of the people who've claimed they would quit after encountering me actually did, that number is fairly high.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#132 - 2014-06-22 00:24:09 UTC
BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie wrote:
Herr Wilkus wrote:
The joy of placing their smiling faces into my address book, waiting for them to log in, and ganking them over and over until they stop logging in. I have quite an impressive collection of dead subscriptions. My personal FU to CCP, as i believe they are beyond saving. Their conduct regarding Erotica1's banning came pretty close to motivating me to start up again, if I didn't have other pressures on my time....

If gankers want to impact CCP's bottom line and retention rate, they should NEVER unsubscribe, but instead use their resources to make carebears unsub instead. Has a much greater impact, and I smile inwardly when I see another thread about layoffs.
In this regard, I differ from Ero1 and CODE, who really just want to have fun and save bears from dull gameplay.
I'd rather carebears are just exterminated entirely.

I believe this is the first time that I have heard someone say that they attempt to drive other players out of the game. ******* disgusting. I know some players leave due to entitlement issues, but I never attack someone with the hope that they will quit the game, and I can confidently say that most of my allies approach combat with the same mindset. If someone does quit because their ship gets blown up, then eve is probably not the game for them.

I hope the anti-ganking group has some understanding that Herr Wilkus is not representative of gankers as a whole.




To be perfectly honest, this is one of the reasons why I have respect for Herr Wilkus. Here is someone that openly admits it. He does not play coy and pretend he's the good guy, and he's certainly not fooling himself. He's not trying to play the game of "blame the victim". I've known players like this. Their game is to make people leave the game, like knocking someone's marbles out of the circle. They are a diminishing breed. And if the cry of "this is a sandbox" were to be shouted, it's here - because there's a lot of way to deal with it, but people instead chose to quit.

When someone says they want to drive you out of a game, what do you do?

Well if you are the kind of person who can grow from adversity, you stay in it. That's what you do. RL is worse for that, actually, because you don't have a choice except to stop being alive. There's something to learn from here.

And beyond that, Wilkus had a method for a "3 way gank" using a Tornado that even a carebearing hishsec sperglord like myself can't help but to be in awe. Even if you don't like the art, sometimes the art form transcends the genre. It was so impressive that CCP dropped a huge hammer on it in short order. I recall the thread might still be in the C&P forums. It might be the reason why you can not enter warp any more when you got a GCC.

Bring back DEEEEP Space!
Ramona McCandless
Silent Vale
LinkNet
#133 - 2014-06-22 00:26:21 UTC
Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:
To be perfectly honest, this is one of the reasons why I have respect for Herr Wilkus. Here is someone that openly admits it. He does not play coy and pretend he's the good guy, and he's certainly not fooling himself. He's not trying to play the game of "blame the victim". I've known players like this. Their game is to make people leave the game, like knocking someone's marbles out of the circle. They are a diminishing breed. And if the cry of "this is a sandbox" were to be shouted, it's here - because there's a lot of way to deal with it, but people instead chose to quit.


Lol you need to work harder on your reverse psychology, esse

This is pretty transparent

"Yea, some dude came in and was normal for first couple months, so I gave him director." - Sean Dunaway

"A singular character could be hired to penetrate another corps space... using gorilla like tactics..." - Chane Morgann
Foxstar Damaskeenus
why did i join this corp
Not Purple Shoot It.
#134 - 2014-06-22 00:32:24 UTC
At one time I was part of a group that ran a significant part of the "Bleak Lands" market. part of why we occasionally did it was to keep people from mining in our high sec pocket to keep the industrial wing liquid.

I would do it with a couple buddies after getting beaten up in low sec pvp and it made me and the group feel better.

A few yarrs and a couple animated gifs of girls getting slapped in the face with sausages.

"[this thread] is a cesspit of trolling and flaming" ISD Buldath
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#135 - 2014-06-22 00:34:25 UTC
Ramona McCandless wrote:
Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:
To be perfectly honest, this is one of the reasons why I have respect for Herr Wilkus. Here is someone that openly admits it. He does not play coy and pretend he's the good guy, and he's certainly not fooling himself. He's not trying to play the game of "blame the victim". I've known players like this. Their game is to make people leave the game, like knocking someone's marbles out of the circle. They are a diminishing breed. And if the cry of "this is a sandbox" were to be shouted, it's here - because there's a lot of way to deal with it, but people instead chose to quit.


Lol you need to work harder on your reverse psychology, esse

This is pretty transparent



If you knew me personally you would think otherwise. There's no reverse psychology here. I'm known for being critical of the griefing thing, but of that what I have trouble with the most is not the people who know they log in to pee in the cereal and say they do it, but those who (dare I say "sociopathically") lie about it, pretend they are normal and the good guys, and then try to flip everything around on their victim to further get off on the whole affair.

What you are seeing from Herr Wilkus is the kind of honesty that should be admired for a PVP GAME. In a world where people either think they are entitled to seeing everybody else bow to their hurt feelings, or use the accusation of their feelings being hurt to weigh a rules system on someone else (for the purpose of hurting them), it's a breath of fresh air to see someone admit they will hurt your feelings because they can and don't care about it. Do I agree with it? No. It's not how I roll (or "role" if you know what I mean). But that kind of player who is honest in his intentions is getting rare these days.

Bring back DEEEEP Space!
Ramona McCandless
Silent Vale
LinkNet
#136 - 2014-06-22 00:39:20 UTC
Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:

If you knew me personally you would think otherwise.


I would know that you were honest about supporting bannable actions from someone who claims to want CCP shut down?

Ok bro, whatever you say

I cant say that if you are being truthful Id want to

"Yea, some dude came in and was normal for first couple months, so I gave him director." - Sean Dunaway

"A singular character could be hired to penetrate another corps space... using gorilla like tactics..." - Chane Morgann
La Nariz
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#137 - 2014-06-22 00:40:14 UTC
Christine Peeveepeeski wrote:
Ok first things first, Not a whine thread! I think it's fine that people can be assploded in high sec as they are. What confuses me is why so many do it.

I get freighter ganks, mostly that's for iskies but miners puzzles me.

Bare with me here because I know this could be seen as troll bait so first I will lay out my experiences ganking miners.

I tried it for maybe a few days, racked up about 4 orca and 20 or so hulk/mack kills quite a while back. Got bored because it's so easy, tears were not that common and not so tasty compared to pvper tears. All in all I found it lacklustre. Used up my suicide cat/thrasher collection then went back to pewing wt's.

How about you guys that do it permanently? Surely you must be doing this on alts as i can't imagine it enough to sustain playing a main for?

I am genuinely interested, why do you do it?


It can be lucrative, its an easy way to entertain people, its close to home and hopefully it makes the minerals I invested in worth more.

This post was loving crafted by a member of the Official GoonWaffe recruitment team. Improve the forums, support this idea: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&find=unread&t=345133
Felicity Love
Doomheim
#138 - 2014-06-22 00:46:01 UTC
Silky Cyno wrote:
Some people like real fights Vs people that shoot back....


... and most of them bring at least a few friends and/or a (neutral) logi... because, y'know, that's like a fair fight so long as the one guy all on his lonesome shoots back before he figures out he's pooched by a blob.

Roll

"EVE is dying." -- The Four Forum Trolls of the Apocalypse.   ( Pick four, any four. They all smell.  )
Arkady Romanov
Whole Squid
#139 - 2014-06-22 00:46:21 UTC
I gank miners not because I want them to quit the game, but because I want them to understand that EVE is not a single player game. It is also not a game where you can safely walk away from the computer while you are undocked and in space, regardless of the security status of the system.


I truly believe that the act of ganking is educational. If the ganked chooses not to learn from it, well then I'll just have to come back and do it again until it sinks in.

Whole Squid: Get Inked.
Domina Trix
McKNOBBLER DRINKING CLAN
#140 - 2014-06-22 00:57:15 UTC
Arkady Romanov wrote:
I gank miners not because I want them to quit the game, but because I want them to understand that EVE is not a single player game. It is also not a game where you can safely walk away from the computer while you are undocked and in space, regardless of the security status of the system.


I truly believe that the act of ganking is educational. If the ganked chooses not to learn from it, well then I'll just have to come back and do it again until it sinks in.


I can see where you are coming from about the afk'ing but what has ganking miners got to do with a single player game?

Two of the defining characteristics of a carebear are wanting other players to play the way the carebear wants and whining on the forums for the game to change when they don't. Yet I see more threads on these forums from gankers than I do miners whining about wanting the game changed to suit them.