Player Features and Ideas Discussion

Well I do get frustration, but in my experience it was more about how one acquires the knowledge about all the game mechanics and not with anything related to skillpoints, or the ability to fit modules. The first has been mentioned all over - again and again, that it is the tutorials that are not optimal and that every player absorbs information in a different way, never forget that.
The second, the issues with fitting etc came up much later, after at least a week or two where you already had the opportunity to acquire some skillpoints. If they were wrong or you missed out, because you didn't know how to keep your cue full... look to the first point again.
And the real frustration comes much - much later, when you start planning, remapping, even without any mistakes or wasted tries. And that again is related to perception and expectations. let my give you an example here.

"What 6 days to train for the level 5 skill to unlock the t2 mod ? Pffrr !"
9 months later after a few 32 day skills.
"What, only 6 days ? Can't believe I didn't train it before the remap!"
And that is totally your own fault and has everything to do with perception and the right evaluation and nothing with skillpoint presets or acquirement.

What can be said for a 6 day skill for a general player (vets might laugh at 26 day skills) can be said for a 17 hour skills as a beginner.

I was happy for some 50.000 free SP, could get a few skills down, a week later it was just finishing one skill or cutting a day. Now its like ... "OK, not sure why, but thx anyway." And its not because I don't value the skillpoints in regards to their bonus or unlock power, its because I know that they are irrelevant to what I do each day. What keeps me from doing things is nobody but me.

And in regards to options, beginners have way more options available and a much more unbiased game play offered then anyone stepping over the 900.000 SP threshold and wearing implants. That's where you explore freely without consequences a risk free world of stumbling around, making your first steps etc.
Every fresh player I meet I say, 'go to low', 'go to null' explore space, cause I don't, for many reasons and I regret my decisions, but those are my own shackles I am wearing and I put them on me myself.

This is getting dumber and dumber, now we are afraid of players with skillpoints?

And your whole premise is wrong, we are neither agreeing nor is starting frustrating, I said it could be, but just pick and chose won't get you anywhere. I gave you reasons, yet you cherry pick and copy one note on the end of another argument just to make it fit as it suit you.

Its all about progression, learning your steps, not blowing everything up someones buttox, EVE is not catering to the masses, EVE does not look for the masses nor easy access, everything learned has to be gained. More skillpoints do more harm then achieve anything as positive nor bridge anything terrible as you are hinting it would.

It has been for a while and starter SP get rather lower then higher. I have lots of friends I like to join, but it neither occurs to me 'oh, if just the SP were higher', nor do they ask or complain about it.

In the end it comes down to melcanis' law and a proven, working system (never change a running system,ever heard of that ?) and complains come solely from those that do not want to put in the work or assume (probably from their own desires) that others don´t want to either and are gonna be disappointed. All with the premise that they could be such an asset.

Lol, if they fail at 56k or 90k or 900k , how about failing at hitting the 60 mil or 100 mil SP mark for when the super expectations come in ?

And if 900k is 'just a symbol' what the hell are you proposing anyway, 56.001 SP maybe? What number is right, how do you measure it , preset skills, pre-decided, super mix, instant access (and screw up by players) at log in, instead of putting a thought into it... You are just arguing for the arguments sake. Show me one game that starts beyond char level 1 and skills 0 for example. I guess I am losing it here, time to quit this

Well,

1, you are Lazerhawk, that means sth. We (on my main) fight from time to time :) so I know skill you represent.

2, you had 8 experienced man on your side and combining 8 hours of SP with your experience your role (and your expectations) were well defined.

I'm not denying that you can get satisfaction from fresh char with actual 56k SP pool, but thats for experienced players.

Cheers,
(I'll give you a box of HAMs next time we meet ;) )

no more boosts for noobs. What is wrong with working to achieve goals in a video game?

Plus you've obviously never heard of the goons ten hour heroes development plan that makes noobs really useful for fleets, ganks and small gangs.


Edit. Train the relevant skills to 3 and within mere days you can fly battle cruisers t1 fit of course but still useful.

Back analogy, You are suggestign giving players the tools for designing a skyscraper when they don't even know how to lay a brick wall. All you would do with this is increase frustration as the newb would die just the same whilst believing they should do better because of the SP they have.


That's good. Let extend hat even more.
Let new players be able to seriously participate in fleet operations.
Let they learn good things from very beginning. EvE is PvP game so lets newbies jump straight into serious PvP skipping several weeks of misleading "larva" mode where enemy is red cross.
No more carebears, let they learn from beginning "enemy is an another player", "red cross is just another resource to farm".
[/quote]
You missed the point, he was saying that with the 10 hour training plan the newb *can* participate effectively in fleets.



A newb in a t1 BC should expect to be squished as they will not have the player skills to pilot it effectively, even more so with the 900k SP idea since the SP to fly it were just handed to them.

As for the PvP/Carebears comment why do those who prefer PvP have to try to change anothers playstyle? Those you call carebears are playing how they choose. Leave them to it ans ignore them if it offends you. They also play an important role in the game just the same as they too pay for plex, drive markets, generate isk in the economy, provide targets for gankers etc etc.

The real enemy is always other players whether it be in PvP combat or other more PvE based paths. Your definition that PvP combat is the only good thing about Eve is a very narrow focus indeed and the explorers and S&I players would all differ greatly with your view. I personally would like new players to be tought that PvP combat is *not* the only way to fight your enemies, that market manipulation, outperform your enemies in manufacture, support your allies by various methods, explore the badlands in any way you wish. There is so much more to Eve, make the most of it.

.......No, the problem is a lack of skills.

No amount of imagination from a new player will kill me. Ever.

Same thread, same dumb responses.

How is it that everyone still posting in this thread is conveniently ignoring the fact that new players do indeed get an SP boost on the same order as what is being suggested?

How about this.... Instead of the player needing to start playing Eve with the starter pack to get the cerebral accelerator SP boost, give it to all new accounts including trial accounts that get upgraded into full accounts. Not a big deal market-wise since the implants have an expiration date on them.

Should you just give that SP to a new player flat out? No. Every second is a learning experience during your first week in Eve, it's better if the player is allowed to choose how the SP is spent as he learns than giving it in one lump in the beginning so that his first mistake screws him for the next 3 months.

Big, important question: What's the difference between 900k SP on day 1 and 1 mil SP on day 7, when on day 7 most new players still think it's OK to autopilot through low sec? SP is not going to save them from those moments of genius.

Because in thier delusions of mediocraty, they think Malcanis' Law won't apply to their ideas.

New players already get a cerebral accelerator and iirc a bunch of remaps.

But they don't get it all at once, because firstly it can and will lead to wasted skillpoints, and secondly because it's potential for abuse is huge.

You have a lot more than when I started.

You young'uns have no idea just how good you have it.