Player Features and Ideas Discussion

Please explain how you'll risk losing it?

The idea is to have some mechanic devised to make this work.... What flaws would a mechanic have inherently that this would not be a viable change to make in the future....

And this post has gone way off topic.....

Don't forget we want barges to be more fleet synergistic to encourage the use of mining fleets!

You have a big enough drone bay now to equip two different drone sets. that point is moot.

If you pay attention you'll know you are being scouted. You'll know if you are being scanned for your fit or not. this is again why it's also bad to be in high-sec as you get too comfortable with the illusion of safety and don't realize what people are doing around you.

The purpose of our advice is to make you not look like easy meat, which most players do in high-sec, if you become a hard target you survive better overall.

Proc-skiff's are hell DPS, but in high-sec when they can bring an Alpha nado etc fleet to bear on you, your only real protection is warning systems, watching local(and flagging ganking organizations with standings), and being ready to leave should a fleet big enough appear to smack you. This is not a problem with low or null as any big fleet like that usually gets the attention of bigger fish and dies or otherwise get's engaged.

The Aggressor in any engagement holds the advantage in that he decides when to strike, the defense while usually able to hold on for certain periods must be ready for when the attack comes. Surprise elements kill more people in high-sec than most activities, save perhaps retardation.[/quote]

Yes, the retreiver or mack can deploy five light drones and the mack can have another squadron in reserve. That SHOULD be enough, by what you say, but it isn't.

I am NOT an AFK miner. I agree afk mining is stupid. I stay busy while mining by alternating my strip miners and thus have 90-seconds cycles (without boosts). Spotting a scout is not as easy as you let on. ANY ship can be a scout. Hell, a player can two-box and have a shuttle go thru your belt in 5 seconds or have another miner start mining. The ganker doesn't have to spring the trap immediately, either. I know of at least one incident when the ganker hit a miner 5 minutes after the scout left.

If the mining ship left a belt every time another ship showed, the miner would not be mining.

I have type 2 drones with Drone, Drone interface, drone durability and drone damage ALL MAXXED (5) and they don't do diddly to the ganker before even the hardest tanked retreiver or mack is dead.
So, why bother tanking when it only reduces your yield? Fit for max yield and get that isk collected before a ganker shows.

Before the kronos update, THIS toon could gain the isk to buy and fit a mack in 8-10 days. Any isk after that is profit. Gankers don't show up often enough (if you carefully select your system) to ruin that profit.

I don't know how things are after Kronos because I started a new toon and retired this one to the forums. The new toon has all the assets (100+ ships and 4 billion+ isk) of my account. That toon is sitting in a station building drone skills (then mining skills) until I'm again ready to mine.

That new toon will ONLY mine in high sec (using MTUs) unless CCP gets smart and provides the solo miner a means to FIGHT a ganking attempt. If such a ability is not possible with the retreiver/mack, my miners will fit for max yield and (hopefully) provide the profit that way as they did before Kronos.

I am aware there is a barge/exhumer combo that is super tank (it was designed for it). Unless the entire system has been drastically altered by Kronos, they can not 'max-tank' and 'max-mine' with the same fit.

They can not survive a gank unless they're 'max-tank' and they can not out-mine the retriever/mackinaw unless they're 'max-mining'.

I have a new toon training to mine after Kronos (this toon is retired to the forums), so it'll be a while before the skills are built up to using the mack or my orcas.

wrong option? maybe. but it's the option I will use because it has been working for me.

purposely losing yield to try to survive a fight I have no way of winning anyway is just not right. Instead, I fit for max yield with as little time lost to freighting ore as possible.

It works.

somehow, the reply didn't post. I had to edit.

hey, I have never been accused of being the smartest in the world. LOL

I enjoy the game, but I do not enjoy all aspects, especially PvP

I
am
patient.

You are not. I can mine for hours with no other ships on my screen without getting bored. can you?

If I find a system that works, I use it until it doesn't. As far as I see at the moment, it still works.

Another system may work better, but I have the patience to wait for mine. If you don't understand how somebody can relax and wait (instead of ALWAYS striving for the fastest way), that is your problem.

I held the super-stressful, super-boring job of pushing 40 tons 650 miles every day (7 days a week/50 weeks a year) for 19 years. I can wait. If you can't wait...

you are mistaken.

Technically speaking, no you can'y max yield/max tank in the same fit, however you dont need to.

With basic skills and no fittings the skiff can get about 23-26k ehp (min gets 25 with exhumer lvl 4). And with kronos my yield further increased with the option to use the extra lowslot for mining upgradeassuming you are mining in highsec, you wont need any specialized mining rigs (ice/mercoxit The ones I use often) and can fit for a very decent tank without any sacrifices to yield. Unless you have managed to make your existence the bane of someone elses, it is unlikely they will bring multiple tornados or catalysts to kill your skiff/proc. And if they happen to be in catalysts, in 0.5, you will still have the drone dps to knock off one or two before you go down (assuming they brought extra).

If you are honestly worried about tank and yield over cargo capacity I highly recomend you give those two ships a try. They are well worth the investment.

It's funny because even those Industrialists are split into several groups. Those who consider the PvP part of EVE and those who don't.

Giving the Skiff yield on par with the Mack was imo a mistake.

CCP greatly overestimated the importance of cargo space when people can bring orcas, freighers, industrials, and mtus, to mining ops. I even see people solo with Skiff by running ore to stations, the tank is just that good.

As a quick and simple small adjustment, I would drop the yield for Skiffs back to there it was (the drone bonus was good enough), and increase the Hulks cargohold, speed and agility a small amount.

That's because this change happened with Kronos. People just continue to share their thoughts about it.

Suicide Ganking in an emergent activity in this game much like jet-can group mining was an emergent activity during the first years of EvE.

After 10 years do you really believe that it will ever go away? It would be a culture shock.It would irrevocably challenge the right of this MMO to call itself a PVP. That's what people believe it seems.

Sad or no, that was CCP's choice. There are a thousand ways they could have dealt with it. They choose not to.

Imagine this scenario: the temptation to use large-haul barges/exhumers is removed. But then, suicide gankers continue. They now hunt Procurer and Skiffs. Just for the thrill of it.

Maybe i am wrong, but in this thread, does it state anywhere that CCP's intention with the changes was to protect miners in high sec?

I believe no. The OP does speak in generalities which we could infer pretty much anything from, but there is one phrase that i would argue that if CCP was ever even secretly hoping to reduce suicide ganking they were rather naive, in this case.

"The Retriever and Mackinaw keep the solo and low-attention mining crown..."
Yeah sure i get the least attention when mining in Ret or Mack..

Thank you though. If your facts are correct I am sure someone will benefit from this.