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[news] Federal Government announces handover of Arcurio

Author
Evi Polevhia
Phoenix Naval Operations
Phoenix Naval Systems
#21 - 2014-06-10 23:50:34 UTC
I hope peaceful diplomacy catches on to the rest of the cluster.
Noden Vorpalstar
The Knights of Polaris
#22 - 2014-06-11 01:28:27 UTC
An admirable step towards peace. I will trust, until I learn other wise, that citizens of The Federation living on Caldari Prime will be able to continue calling 'Home' their home, and that a mutual understanding of peace will be a virtue of all whom live on the planet.

As for the Empyrean War, I do not believe it will end any time in the foreseeable future. Not so long as there are still extremist elements dedicated to The Federation's destruction both overtly and covertly.

Public Channel:  Polaris-Public Roleplaying Channel:  Gallente Lounge

TomHorn
Horn Brothers Holdings Inc.
#23 - 2014-06-11 01:31:02 UTC
The sooner Federation rule on Caldari Prime is removed the better. The Caldari nationalists can concentrate on helping the Intaki nationalists and the ILF in their goal of secession from the Federation and creating their own independent Intaki state.
Diana Kim
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#24 - 2014-06-11 01:58:40 UTC
There are still too many gallentean occupants present on the Caldari Prime.
I don't think we could just tell them to go without spilling their blood. And they must pay for what the Federation did with our planet.

Gallentean occupants on our territories should be named outlaws and should be dealt with accordingly, swiftly and without mercy.

How one can talk about peace, while security and integrity of our territories are being compromised?!

Honored are the dead, for their legacy guides us.

In memory of Tibus Heth, Caldari State Executor YC110-115, Hero and Patriot.

Samira Kernher
Cail Avetatu
#25 - 2014-06-11 02:17:32 UTC  |  Edited by: Samira Kernher
Diana Kim wrote:
There are still too many gallentean occupants present on the Caldari Prime.
I don't think we could just tell them to go without spilling their blood. And they must pay for what the Federation did with our planet.

Gallentean occupants on our territories should be named outlaws and should be dealt with accordingly, swiftly and without mercy.

How one can talk about peace, while security and integrity of our territories are being compromised?!


From your other thread:

Diana Kim wrote:
I don't do vengeance, Lieutenant Kernher, because vengeance is not professional.

...

I don't even want to take them into the State, I don't want to absorb them like you, or kill them.
What I want, is to dismantle their criminal regime, their government.


Sounds like vengeance to me.

Which is it? Do you want to just dismantle their government, or do you want to butcher the population? Pick one.
Diana Kim
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#26 - 2014-06-11 02:31:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Diana Kim
Samira Kernher wrote:
Diana Kim wrote:
There are still too many gallentean occupants present on the Caldari Prime.
I don't think we could just tell them to go without spilling their blood. And they must pay for what the Federation did with our planet.

Gallentean occupants on our territories should be named outlaws and should be dealt with accordingly, swiftly and without mercy.

How one can talk about peace, while security and integrity of our territories are being compromised?!


From your other thread:

Diana Kim wrote:
I don't do vengeance, Lieutenant Kernher, because vengeance is not professional.

...

I don't even want to take them into the State, I don't want to absorb them like you, or kill them.
What I want, is to dismantle their criminal regime, their government.


Sounds like vengeance to me.

Justice, Ms. Kernher.
Law and justice.

Samira Kernher wrote:

Which is it? Do you want to just dismantle their government, or do you want to butcher the population? Pick one.

No, no, of course not!
Just dismantle their government. As for their population, they don't all participate in occupation of Caldari territories.
Only occupants must be... ugh... using your words, "butchered".

Honored are the dead, for their legacy guides us.

In memory of Tibus Heth, Caldari State Executor YC110-115, Hero and Patriot.

Bryen Verrisai
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#27 - 2014-06-11 02:47:56 UTC
TomHorn wrote:
The Caldari nationalists can concentrate on helping the Intaki nationalists and the ILF in their goal of secession from the Federation

Don't hold your breath.

Actually, do.
Andreus Ixiris
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#28 - 2014-06-11 06:21:02 UTC
TomHorn wrote:
The Caldari nationalists can concentrate on helping the Intaki nationalists and the ILF in their goal of secession from the Federation and creating their own independent Intaki state.

Behold Provist hypocricy.

The Federation meddling with internal State affairs? Unacceptable!
The State meddling with internal Federation affairs? Perfectly fine.

Andreus Ixiris > A Civire without a chin is barely a Civire at all.

Pieter Tuulinen > He'd be Civirely disadvantaged, Andreus.

Andreus Ixiris > ...

Andreus Ixiris > This is why we're at war.

Elmund Egivand
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#29 - 2014-06-11 07:49:30 UTC
Andreus Ixiris wrote:
TomHorn wrote:
The Caldari nationalists can concentrate on helping the Intaki nationalists and the ILF in their goal of secession from the Federation and creating their own independent Intaki state.

Behold Provist hypocricy.

The Federation meddling with internal State affairs? Unacceptable!
The State meddling with internal Federation affairs? Perfectly fine.


Welcome to the wonderful world of cognitive biases.

A Minmatar warship is like a rusting Beetle with 500 horsepower Cardillac engines in the rear, armour plating bolted to chassis and a M2 Browning stuck on top.

Jaret Victorian
Itsukame-Zainou Hyperspatial Inquiries Ltd.
Arataka Research Consortium
#30 - 2014-06-11 08:57:19 UTC  |  Edited by: Jaret Victorian
Andreus Ixiris wrote:
TomHorn wrote:
The Caldari nationalists can concentrate on helping the Intaki nationalists and the ILF in their goal of secession from the Federation and creating their own independent Intaki state.

Behold Provist hypocricy.

The Federation meddling with internal State affairs? Unacceptable!
The State meddling with internal Federation affairs? Perfectly fine.

While what you said is right, double standards are bad, I think it is important to save the right of self-determination, to some degree at least.

After all this was the self-determination that got both the State and the Federation into the conflict.
Noden Vorpalstar
The Knights of Polaris
#31 - 2014-06-11 12:04:52 UTC
Samira Kernher wrote:
Diana Kim wrote:
There are still too many gallentean occupants present on the Caldari Prime.
I don't think we could just tell them to go without spilling their blood. And they must pay for what the Federation did with our planet.

Gallentean occupants on our territories should be named outlaws and should be dealt with accordingly, swiftly and without mercy.

How one can talk about peace, while security and integrity of our territories are being compromised?!


From your other thread:

Diana Kim wrote:
I don't do vengeance, Lieutenant Kernher, because vengeance is not professional.

...

I don't even want to take them into the State, I don't want to absorb them like you, or kill them.
What I want, is to dismantle their criminal regime, their government.


Sounds like vengeance to me.

Which is it? Do you want to just dismantle their government, or do you want to butcher the population? Pick one.


Neither of which are an acceptable course of action.

Public Channel:  Polaris-Public Roleplaying Channel:  Gallente Lounge

Veikitamo Gesakaarin
Doomheim
#32 - 2014-06-11 12:08:21 UTC  |  Edited by: Veikitamo Gesakaarin
I outlined my thoughts regarding the Ishukone - Material Acquisitions deal for Arcurio elsewhere, however I think it bears mentioning here again.

The policies of Ishukone and the Federal Senate regarding Caldari Prime mark the beginning of a potential re-normalization of relations between the Caldari State and the Gallente Federation. Any lasting peace upon which any future peace accords will be signed will always require the establishment of interwoven political, economic, and commercial interests between both State and Federation in order to further prevent the outbreak of hostilities. That negotiations have begun, matured, and reached fruition between Ishukone and the Federation as regards Caldari Prime in general and Arcurio in particular displays that the creation of such an interwoven fabric of peace between the State and Federation lies not in the realm of impossibility but in actual reality.

A reality in which it is Caldari that may potentially control the destiny of the Homeworld through diplomacy and dialogue should always be seen as preferable by those that hold true to ideal that violence and force of arms should only ever be the last resort in order to preserve human life and dignity. Ishukone is Caldari, and it is through their actions and that of Chief Executive Reppola that the only powerful symbol of those who know only hatred and intolerance, such as the Templis Dragonaurs, such as the U.D.I, such as the CPD, such as Tibus Heth and all those that think like him is removed. Their claims to patriotism and the greater good of the State revealed as the lies said by charlatans when the Homeworld is no longer a memory of a painful past to be used by the petty provocateur but rather a vision of a future of peace and prosperity the people of the State can realize.

This may only be the first act towards peace, but I can still only hope it ends in the denouement of a lasting and final one between State and Federation.

Kurilaivonen|Concern

Diana Kim
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#33 - 2014-06-11 12:12:08 UTC
Noden Vorpalstar wrote:
Samira Kernher wrote:
Diana Kim wrote:
There are still too many gallentean occupants present on the Caldari Prime.
I don't think we could just tell them to go without spilling their blood. And they must pay for what the Federation did with our planet.

Gallentean occupants on our territories should be named outlaws and should be dealt with accordingly, swiftly and without mercy.

How one can talk about peace, while security and integrity of our territories are being compromised?!


From your other thread:

Diana Kim wrote:
I don't do vengeance, Lieutenant Kernher, because vengeance is not professional.

...

I don't even want to take them into the State, I don't want to absorb them like you, or kill them.
What I want, is to dismantle their criminal regime, their government.


Sounds like vengeance to me.

Which is it? Do you want to just dismantle their government, or do you want to butcher the population? Pick one.


Neither of which are an acceptable course of action.

Dismantling of gallentean government is not just acceptable, it is required action.

Gallentean government is composed of criminals, who staged "Operation Highlander". By assuming their position in gallentean hierarchy, they evade justice, but for their action they must be put before the tribunal. In order to achieve it, the whole system that supports their crimes must be dismantled.

Honored are the dead, for their legacy guides us.

In memory of Tibus Heth, Caldari State Executor YC110-115, Hero and Patriot.

Indira Harashani
Tyrathlion Interstellar
#34 - 2014-06-11 13:28:30 UTC
Diana Kim wrote:
Dismantling of gallentean government is not just acceptable, it is required action.

Gallentean government is composed of criminals, who staged "Operation Highlander". By assuming their position in gallentean hierarchy, they evade justice, but for their action they must be put before the tribunal. In order to achieve it, the whole system that supports their crimes must be dismantled.

This notion that the Federation's Operation Highlander was a criminal act, and that those who authorized it are criminals, is laughable.

I am no lover of the Federation, but the initial invasion of Luminaire back in YC 110 was a criminal act perpetrated on the back of another cowardly and criminal act - the Elder Fleet's attack on the headquarters of CONCORD. Yes, it is your homeworld, but it was located within Federation territory. It was still located in Federation territory even after the invasion, even if it can be reasonably claimed that the planet itself was a de facto island of State sovereignty. (A state that it appears to be peacefully shifting towards right now, without bloodshed or violence - a good thing.)

Operation Highlander was, in a way, the Federation's emulation of the Empress' glorious return to Her people. An invading foe was met on the battlefield with overwhelming force, and purged from their sovereign space with wrath and fury that splintered hulls like trees snapping in the wind.

But the State's claim to Caldari Prime still does not make Operation Highlander a criminal act. Luminaire itself, as a system always remained under Federation sovereignty after the events of YC 110, which gives them the right to move materiel in and out of the system whenever and wherever they want. This includes the movement of a significant number of capital ships into the system, and the decision to place them in an engagement with State forces left over from the invasion five years prior.

They did not need to ask your permission to do that, just as Her Grace did not need to ask the Elder Fleet's permission to smear it across space with Her fury.

I would not expect the Republic Fleet to ask permission to open fire on us were we sat in orbit over one of their worlds, nor for the Caldari Navy to do the same with the Federation Navy. Neither should you.

Lady Indira Harashani

Holder of the Kheryskova Archipelago, Kihtaled IV

Anslo
Scope Works
#35 - 2014-06-11 13:57:52 UTC
Samira Kernher wrote:
Diana Kim wrote:
There are still too many gallentean occupants present on the Caldari Prime.
I don't think we could just tell them to go without spilling their blood. And they must pay for what the Federation did with our planet.

Gallentean occupants on our territories should be named outlaws and should be dealt with accordingly, swiftly and without mercy.

How one can talk about peace, while security and integrity of our territories are being compromised?!


From your other thread:

Diana Kim wrote:
I don't do vengeance, Lieutenant Kernher, because vengeance is not professional.

...

I don't even want to take them into the State, I don't want to absorb them like you, or kill them.
What I want, is to dismantle their criminal regime, their government.


Sounds like vengeance to me.

Which is it? Do you want to just dismantle their government, or do you want to butcher the population? Pick one.


That Sami. Always fighting the good fight. Even if she has to dunk enemies with posts.

[center]-_For the Proveldtariat_/-[/center]

Pieter Tuulinen
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#36 - 2014-06-11 15:24:05 UTC
Andreus Ixiris wrote:
TomHorn wrote:
The Caldari nationalists can concentrate on helping the Intaki nationalists and the ILF in their goal of secession from the Federation and creating their own independent Intaki state.

Behold Provist hypocricy.

The Federation meddling with internal State affairs? Unacceptable!
The State meddling with internal Federation affairs? Perfectly fine.


NOT that I necessarily have a problem with this, but one could say that decrying State efforts to help minority populations find self-determination whilst the Federation reserves the right to do the exact same thing in the Empire is also hypocrisy.

My actual opinion is that people should mind their own business more, though. When in Caldari Prime, do as the Caldari do.

For the first time since I started the conversation, he looks me dead in the eye. In his gaze are steel jackhammers, quiet vengeance, a hundred thousand orbital bombs frozen in still life.

Karynn Denton
Lekhantsi Salvage Depot
#37 - 2014-06-11 16:50:49 UTC
Indira Harashani wrote:
... another cowardly and criminal act - the Elder Fleet's attack on the headquarters of CONCORD.


Cowardly? Criminal?

It was ****ing glorious!

Karynn Denton

Caravan Master

Richard Masseri
Intaki Liberation Front
Intaki Prosperity Initiative
#38 - 2014-06-11 19:09:01 UTC
I will happily raise a glass to all meaningful acts that bring the Caldari and Federation closer together. However I sadly have to agree with Mr Vorpalstar it will be a very long time before the Empyrean war even though many of us living in those areas wish this was not the case.
Andreus Ixiris
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#39 - 2014-06-11 20:19:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Andreus Ixiris
Pieter Tuulinen wrote:
NOT that I necessarily have a problem with this, but one could say that decrying State efforts to help minority populations find self-determination whilst the Federation reserves the right to do the exact same thing in the Empire is also hypocrisy.

The Intaki people have a very significant difference to the Minmatar. We are not enslaved by the Federation, and joined it - co-founded it, in fact - as a matter of personal choice. The majority of the Intaki ethnicity and the majority of the Intaki system's populace desire to remain with the Federation.

More importantly, as a lot of Provists seem far too stupid to understand, even if the majority of Intaki did desire to leave the Federation, we'd still operate a democratic society that championed the causes of freedom and individualism, and we certainly wouldn't want their control of our interests replaced with the Caldari's. Provists do not desire Intaki freedom, as has been made very, very clear by Heth, the CPD and their capsuleer cheerleaders on the IGS - they desire to exchange vassalage to the Federation for vassalage to them.

Andreus Ixiris > A Civire without a chin is barely a Civire at all.

Pieter Tuulinen > He'd be Civirely disadvantaged, Andreus.

Andreus Ixiris > ...

Andreus Ixiris > This is why we're at war.

Pieter Tuulinen
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#40 - 2014-06-11 20:34:00 UTC
Andreus Ixiris wrote:
The Intaki people have a very significant difference to the Minmatar. We are not enslaved by the Federation, and joined it - co-founded it, in fact - as a matter of personal choice. The majority of the Intaki ethnicity and the majority of the Intaki system's populace desire to remain with the Federation.

More importantly, as a lot of Provists seem far too stupid to understand, even if the majority of Intaki did desire to leave the Federation, we'd still operate a democratic society that championed the causes of freedom and individualism, and we certainly wouldn't want their control of our interests replaced with the Caldari's. Provists do not desire Intaki freedom, as has been made very, very clear by Heth, the CPD and their capsuleer cheerleaders on the IGS - they desire to exchange vassalage to the Federation for vassalage to them.


Or perhaps nothing more than a trading agreement and mutual defence treaty? The State isn't exactly famous for it's expansionist policies, Andreus. We're also not famous for bullying allies to change their ways to match our own, or we might have had a few things to say on the subject of Slavery.

For the first time since I started the conversation, he looks me dead in the eye. In his gaze are steel jackhammers, quiet vengeance, a hundred thousand orbital bombs frozen in still life.