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AFK cloaked camper

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Hakaari Inkuran
State War Academy
Caldari State
#21 - 2014-06-11 15:05:33 UTC
I propose a complete lack of local chat in null, just like in WH space to solve this issue. If someone is logged in your system but afk you won't be bothered with that oppressive knowledge.
Hakaari Inkuran
State War Academy
Caldari State
#22 - 2014-06-11 15:09:49 UTC
Tchulen wrote:
I sometimes hate this forum. Showed no post through several forced refreshes so reposted and whamo, post duplicated. Apols.

I've seen posts where if I quote the post, I see more content written by the person, in my post draft, than when simply viewing the thread normally.

Search function is almost always borked it seems like, as well.
Nikk Narrel
Moonlit Bonsai
#23 - 2014-06-11 15:14:34 UTC
The problem is not that you seem unable to interact with this cloaked character.

The problem is that you are afraid the cloaked character will interact with you when you are not ready.

Establish a point where you are always ready, and the cloaked character must then match your efforts or be ignored as they should be.

If the game seems unable to allow for such preparedness, then that is another issue, and should be tackled as such.

(Worry about cyno use, or other overwhelming tactics, etc)

Upgrading Local to Eliminate All AFK Influence What if Local Chat changed, Hunting the Cloaked...
SurrenderMonkey
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#24 - 2014-06-11 15:22:28 UTC
ahllamaar wrote:
Hi,
I know this is a subject that periodically comes around, but trying to bumo it again as it seems a glitch in the game mechanic.


It's not.

Quote:
You know the issue.... alt chars that stay days and days in a system cloaked avoiding any other activities by lots of active players.


Making you butthurt isn't the same thing as being an issue.

Quote:
With no way of getting the AFK guy it is unfair to a lot of people.


No it isn't. HTFU.

Quote:
The point is not to make cloaking modules easy to intercept, but to avoid AFK char that block activities.


An AFK person, by definition, cannot block anything. He's AFK. There's literally nothing he can do to harm you.

Quote:
What about introducing something to prevent AFKing while cloaked? for example, after a certain reasonable amount of time with no mouse activity (1 hour?), there is chance for the module to deactivate. This could be reasonable, in my opinion, and would not impact other aspect of the game that could need of cloaking for a long time.



Wow, what a completely new and unique idea!

There are two real issues at play here.

1. You know there is someone else in the system.
2. You are a pussy.

So, to solve this problem, we really only need one of two things to happen...

1. You could HTFU. If you stop being a pussy, you will no longer fear an AFK person.
2. Remove local, thereby preventing you from knowing that he is there.

"Help, I'm bored with missions!"

http://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/
Luna Arindale
Caldari Independent Navy Reserve
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
#25 - 2014-06-11 15:28:41 UTC
I am fairly certain I know why this thread came into being. However the issue is not cloaking. It is the uncomfortable power projection that can come from one guy cloaked up with a covert cyno.

A cyno once lit can be instantaneously jumped to, there is no counter for the prey, and the prey has a ridiculously low chance of survival even if fit to 'counter' it. I personally don't like it when someone sits in your systems for months on end cloaked up ready to Cyno in a fleet to blap the first person who does anything not in a DED complex. You cannot force them to leave, and you cannot force them to actually attack you. But when they do they have a 100% chance to kill their target with minimal to no losses for zero effort on the part of the hunter because they are using an alt specifically for that end while still making large sums of risk on their main.
Nikk Narrel
Moonlit Bonsai
#26 - 2014-06-11 15:33:07 UTC
Luna Arindale wrote:
I am fairly certain I know why this thread came into being. However the issue is not cloaking. It is the uncomfortable power projection that can come from one guy cloaked up with a covert cyno.

A cyno once lit can be instantaneously jumped to, there is no counter for the prey, and the prey has a ridiculously low chance of survival even if fit to 'counter' it. I personally don't like it when someone sits in your systems for months on end cloaked up ready to Cyno in a fleet to blap the first person who does anything not in a DED complex. You cannot force them to leave, and you cannot force them to actually attack you. But when they do they have a 100% chance to kill their target with minimal to no losses for zero effort on the part of the hunter because they are using an alt specifically for that end while still making large sums of risk on their main.

I would hardly call covert the "end all beat all" of cyno concerns.

They can only send ships off of a limited list, all of which are effectively overpriced for their comparable fighting capability.

The issues surrounding cyno use itself deserve a thread of their own, and this is just a shadow puppet of a thread to demonstrate how effective it can be combined with tactics such as long term cloaking.

Upgrading Local to Eliminate All AFK Influence What if Local Chat changed, Hunting the Cloaked...
Hakaari Inkuran
State War Academy
Caldari State
#27 - 2014-06-11 16:13:21 UTC
I'm fine with cyno having a spool-up time, honestly. Where's the cyno suggestion thread? Search is borked for me as usual.
Owen Levanth
Sagittarius Unlimited Exploration
#28 - 2014-06-11 16:16:50 UTC
Luna Arindale wrote:
I am fairly certain I know why this thread came into being. However the issue is not cloaking. It is the uncomfortable power projection that can come from one guy cloaked up with a covert cyno.

A cyno once lit can be instantaneously jumped to, there is no counter for the prey, and the prey has a ridiculously low chance of survival even if fit to 'counter' it. I personally don't like it when someone sits in your systems for months on end cloaked up ready to Cyno in a fleet to blap the first person who does anything not in a DED complex. You cannot force them to leave, and you cannot force them to actually attack you. But when they do they have a 100% chance to kill their target with minimal to no losses for zero effort on the part of the hunter because they are using an alt specifically for that end while still making large sums of risk on their main.


OK, real talk now. Imagine a world where AFK-cloaking is impossible.

Now you park your alt in a system at a safe and log out until you want to take a look around. Of course when you're logged in, you are actively cloaking and gathering intel.

Now you have a situation were a visitor is not only hanging around for months, he is also producing more stress because you know he is actively gathering intel when you see him, and invisible if he is AFK (because he logged out).

Now every time you see someone suddenly show up in local, you have to be even more alert and on the ball, or you'll be totally surprised.

So in short, be glad a "AFK"-cloaker advertises he's there to you. If someone AFK-camps a system, you at least now something bad could happen if you let your guard down.

Without AFK-cloaking, defenders will have to meet the effort of intel gathering with their own effort.

So from a gameplay perspective, nothing changes except more busy-work for everyone involved. And this is why cloaking is perfectly fine as it is. Cool
Nikk Narrel
Moonlit Bonsai
#29 - 2014-06-11 16:34:49 UTC
Owen Levanth wrote:
OK, real talk now. Imagine a world where AFK-cloaking is impossible.

Now you park your alt in a system at a safe and log out until you want to take a look around. Of course when you're logged in, you are actively cloaking and gathering intel.

Now you have a situation were a visitor is not only hanging around for months, he is also producing more stress because you know he is actively gathering intel when you see him, and invisible if he is AFK (because he logged out).

It is undefined here why the visitor is logging out, but that is not the keystone here.

Owen Levanth wrote:
Now every time you see someone suddenly show up in local, you have to be even more alert and on the ball, or you'll be totally surprised.

So in short, be glad a "AFK"-cloaker advertises he's there to you. If someone AFK-camps a system, you at least now something bad could happen if you let your guard down.

Without AFK-cloaking, defenders will have to meet the effort of intel gathering with their own effort.

So from a gameplay perspective, nothing changes except more busy-work for everyone involved. And this is why cloaking is perfectly fine as it is. Cool

I would say the keystone of this is centered around the perception that a defender can not be both prepared, and engaged in rewarding play.

They suggest, that they are either twiddling their thumbs in a PvP ship, and ready to fight an opponent not willing to engage...
OR
That they are mining / ratting and are subject to overwhelming force with not enough warning.

That these should be the only two options, seems wrong to me.
(And no, while group play is an ideal, we don't live in an ideal world where that can be reliably used... besides which... when was the last time you felt the urge to stand guard while someone else PvE'd some ISK for themselves?)

Upgrading Local to Eliminate All AFK Influence What if Local Chat changed, Hunting the Cloaked...
Iain Cariaba
#30 - 2014-06-11 17:12:36 UTC
OP wrote:
Mommy, Eve isn't fair!!!

Of the many ways to deal with a cloaky camper, whining on forums about it isn't one of them. Personally, this thread makes me want to find the system OP calls home, cloaky camp it myself, and see if I can collect me some carebear tears over it being unfair.
Llyona
Lazerhawks
L A Z E R H A W K S
#31 - 2014-06-11 17:21:59 UTC
SurrenderMonkey wrote:

There are two real issues at play here.

1. You know there is someone else in the system.
2. You are a *****.

So, to solve this problem, we really only need one of two things to happen...

1. You could HTFU. If you stop being a *****, you will no longer fear an AFK person.
2. Remove local, thereby preventing you from knowing that he is there.


I think I have a solution to the plague of AFK Cloakers in Nullbearland. Why not tie local to the cloaking device? In essence, you would only appear in local if you are not cloaked. It makes total sense from the perspective of what cloaking is supposed to be.

With this solution, null still gets to have local in just about all its glory and they don't have to worry about AFK cloakers anymore. Somehow I see AFK Interceptors becoming a new thing though.

EVE is an illness, for which there is no cure.
Crumplecorn
Eve Cluster Explorations
#32 - 2014-06-11 17:23:01 UTC
De'Veldrin wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
http://desusig.crumplecorn.com/afkcloaker.jpg

Hey whatever happened to Crumple?
I'm too busy with Dota 2 to play EVE these days, and no game = no forum.

Witty Image - Stream

Not Liking this post hurts my RL feelings and will be considered harassment
ISD Ezwal
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
ISD Alliance
#33 - 2014-06-11 23:04:46 UTC
ahllamaar wrote:
Hi,
I know this is a subject that periodically comes around
Exactly the reason why starting this thread was rather unnecessary.

Thread locked.

The rules:
16. Redundant and re-posted threads will be locked.

As a courtesy to other forum users, please search to see if there is a thread already open on the topic you wish to discuss. If so, please place your comments there instead. Multiple threads on the same subject clutter up the forums needlessly, causing good feedback and ideas to be lost. Please keep discussions regarding a topic to a single thread.

ISD Ezwal Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)
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