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Armageddon turret and launcher change
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Ronny Hugo
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#1 - 2014-05-30 19:43:16 UTC
I think the Armageddon is a very useful ship for a number of roles, but the 5 turret and 5 launcher hardpoint split is annoying, particularly in PVE, and limits its uses. Do anyone have any reasons why the armageddon can't have 6 or 7 of each? Alternatively, only 6-7 turret hardpoints OR launcher hardpoints.
Thoughts?

-RH.
zar dada
Future Corps
Sleeper Social Club
#2 - 2014-05-30 19:53:13 UTC
Ronny Hugo wrote:
I think the Armageddon is a very useful ship for a number of roles, but the 5 turret and 5 launcher hardpoint split is annoying, particularly in PVE, and limits its uses. Do anyone have any reasons why the armageddon can't have 6 or 7 of each? Alternatively, only 6-7 turret hardpoints OR launcher hardpoints.
Thoughts?

-RH.


For better PVE, may I suggest training for a Marauder? Paladin, Golem, Kronos, and Vargur.

What about the Armageddon do you like that you're using it over another T1 Battleship?

KB

fcftw.org
Paul Panala
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#3 - 2014-05-30 20:03:36 UTC
Probably because the DPS would be too high if you could fit 7 blasters and fill up the low rack with drone amps and mag stabs.
Ronny Hugo
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#4 - 2014-05-30 21:59:03 UTC
zar dada wrote:
Ronny Hugo wrote:
I think the Armageddon is a very useful ship for a number of roles, but the 5 turret and 5 launcher hardpoint split is annoying, particularly in PVE, and limits its uses. Do anyone have any reasons why the armageddon can't have 6 or 7 of each? Alternatively, only 6-7 turret hardpoints OR launcher hardpoints.
Thoughts?

-RH.


For better PVE, may I suggest training for a Marauder? Paladin, Golem, Kronos, and Vargur.

What about the Armageddon do you like that you're using it over another T1 Battleship?

I'm not using it.

To summarize, the current answers to the question "why can't armageddon have 6 or 7 hardpoints for turrets and launchers?" are as follows:
1. It would be too good if it could fit 7 blasters.
Hence 7 turret hardpoints are out of the question (assuming its correct). What about 6? Is the same true for missile hardpoints?
2. Only ships that require a lot of training can be fun to do L4's with.
The reason I would prefer more hardpoints on the Armageddon is because its not fun to play it with 3 different weapon systems (turrets and launchers and drones). The navy geddon gets 1330 dps with 2 systems and no one seems to mind.
Cassandra Aurilien
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#5 - 2014-05-30 22:21:47 UTC
Ronny Hugo wrote:


I'm not using it.

To summarize, the current answers to the question "why can't armageddon have 6 or 7 hardpoints for turrets and launchers?" are as follows:
1. It would be too good if it could fit 7 blasters.
Hence 7 turret hardpoints are out of the question (assuming its correct). What about 6? Is the same true for missile hardpoints?
2. Only ships that require a lot of training can be fun to do L4's with.
The reason I would prefer more hardpoints on the Armageddon is because its not fun to play it with 3 different weapon systems (turrets and launchers and drones). The navy geddon gets 1330 dps with 2 systems and no one seems to mind.




For #1, torp launchers are just as devastating as blasters. (Though harder to apply to a target.)

As far as #2 is concerned... It's not a matter of training. The Geddon is an e-war & combat ship. It's not meant to be solely a source of firepower. If it's DPS you want, there is the Apoc, Navy Geddon in the Amarr line, as well as plenty of others from ship lineups.

The Domi is a better choice for a missioning drone boat, as it has bonuses to drone tracking, instead of the worthless for PVE e-war bonus of the Geddon.

Edit: Fixed quote.
Samillian
Angry Mustellid
#6 - 2014-05-30 23:19:58 UTC  |  Edited by: Samillian
Using the Armageddon for PvE is a waste of a hull when many far more efficient options are available.

The role the Armageddon excels in is as a Logi counter especially with its good tank and the neut range bonus. On top of that its drone bonuses allow it to make a reasonable contribution to a fleets dps especially with sentries.

NBSI shall be the whole of the Law
w3ak3stl1nk
Hedion University
#7 - 2014-05-31 00:31:46 UTC
Armageddon is one of the most flexible high slot battleship around and you want to nerf it? That makes no sense. Is it a mini cheaper bhal... With flexibility to hybrids/projectiles/missiles fits... With neut bonus for pvp. No wasted trait bonus like the old typhoon. You trying to ruin a good thing even before people catch on how awesome this ship is...

Is that my two cents or yours?
Ronny Hugo
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#8 - 2014-05-31 01:04:38 UTC
Cassandra Aurilien wrote:
The Domi is a better choice for a missioning drone boat, as it has bonuses to drone tracking, instead of the worthless for PVE e-war bonus of the Geddon..


Samillian wrote:
Using the Armageddon for PvE is a waste of a hull when many far more efficient options are available.


Sure, the most efficient thing would be the most efficient thing if one of my 52 level 5 skills involved Gallente Battleship V.
I have spent around 900 dollars on this game over the last 3 years, I'd like for all three t1 battleships in my race to be enjoyable in L4 missions. Is that too much to ask?

w3ak3stl1nk, how would 6 or 7 turret and 6 or 7 launcher slots nerf the Armageddon? If that makes it too good then why don't more ships have this flexibility? Some flexible ships with many roles, and some specialist ships with one role. Variation.
Cassandra Aurilien
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#9 - 2014-05-31 01:14:30 UTC
Ronny Hugo wrote:
Cassandra Aurilien wrote:
The Domi is a better choice for a missioning drone boat, as it has bonuses to drone tracking, instead of the worthless for PVE e-war bonus of the Geddon..


Samillian wrote:
Using the Armageddon for PvE is a waste of a hull when many far more efficient options are available.


Sure, the most efficient thing would be the most efficient thing if one of my 52 level 5 skills involved Gallente Battleship V.
I have spent around 900 dollars on this game over the last 3 years, I'd like for all three t1 battleships in my race to be enjoyable in L4 missions. Is that too much to ask?

w3ak3stl1nk, how would 6 or 7 turret and 6 or 7 launcher slots nerf the Armageddon? If that makes it too good then why don't more ships have this flexibility? Some flexible ships with many roles, and some specialist ships with one role. Variation.


The closest comparison to the Geddon is the Scorpion - Normal Scorp, not the SNI. The Geddon has far more flexibility than it. It's usable as a missioning battleship, but because it's designed to be an e-war ship, it's not going to excel.

It's worth mentioning that the new Rattlesnake, which is also a drone BS/ missile ship has 7.5 effective launchers and the same drone damage bonus as the Geddon. Giving it the ability to fit 7 slots of one weapon type along with a drone bonus would make it far too powerful for a T1 battleship. (It would likely be the most powerful T1 BS in the game at that point.)
w3ak3stl1nk
Hedion University
#10 - 2014-05-31 01:18:04 UTC
People don't like flexible ships... Cookie cutter dps ehp fits is what people want.

Is that my two cents or yours?
Myopic Thyne
Accounts Payable.
#11 - 2014-05-31 01:22:57 UTC
w3ak3stl1nk wrote:
Armageddon is one of the most flexible high slot battleship around and you want to nerf it? That makes no sense. Is it a mini cheaper bhal... With flexibility to hybrids/projectiles/missiles fits... With neut bonus for pvp. No wasted trait bonus like the old typhoon. You trying to ruin a good thing even before people catch on how awesome this ship is...

Ssshhhh! Don't tell them!
Ronny Hugo
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#12 - 2014-05-31 01:28:47 UTC
Cassandra Aurilien wrote:
Giving it the ability to fit 7 slots of one weapon type along with a drone bonus would make it far too powerful for a T1 battleship. (It would likely be the most powerful T1 BS in the game at that point.)


Well what about 6, for the n'th time. 6 turrets or launchers and drones, maybe a nos in the last slot instead of bothering with another gun or launcher, would make for a pretty relaxed L4 experience.
w3ak3stl1nk
Hedion University
#13 - 2014-05-31 01:42:12 UTC
6 with the low slot layout it has available... I vote way too powerful

Is that my two cents or yours?
Cassandra Aurilien
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#14 - 2014-05-31 01:44:44 UTC  |  Edited by: Cassandra Aurilien
w3ak3stl1nk wrote:
6 with the low slot layout it has available... I vote way too powerful


Yes. It would out DPS a Nightmare.

Edit: DPS isn't everything, but having the flexibility of drones on top of being able to fit it as an e-war battleship, missile boat, or any turret system... That's not exactly balanced.

Further edit... Playing around with the fittings, I'd actually forgotten how much you can get out of the Geddon as it is. Big smile Might have to convert one of my Geddons to PVE fittings, just for a change of pace.
HiddenPorpoise
Jarlhettur's Drop
United Federation of Conifers
#15 - 2014-05-31 03:28:55 UTC
The geddon is meant to have 2 neuts in the highs; the 5 and 5 is to let you have full choice in weapon type.