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Amarr Battleship and Battle Cruisers defences against frigs/intys
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Wotan The-Wise
Doomheim
#1 - 2014-05-23 07:48:42 UTC
7o All!

I have been thinking about a few tactics/fits to counter frigates and interceptors if they ever catch me when i'm SOLO in a BC or BS.

A few words before I start:
I know the best defense would be to avoid them in the first place, so I am not looking to make Super duper OP one size fits all Anti-frig killing battleship/cruiser that fill kill entire frigate fleets, this is a non specialized fit that I want to use when I am in a kitchen sink fleet or when I am traveling solo. Also with this fit/tactics I am not looking to necessarily kill the frigate/interceptor but to just get away from its hold and to be able to warp off before its friends arrive. So please no use "Small guns on a Battleship" suggestions.

So far many posts have mentioned Drones, in particular Tech 2 Warriors, but I have also read that many Inty pilots can just blap em while keeping me pointed. That is why I have been trying to come up with a multi layered defense that won't impact my overall fitting too much.

So far I came up with a combo of webs, neuts, tech 2 drones, MJD (applicable for BS) and some form of EWAR.
For EWAR I have been thinking about sensor dampeners in case a frig/inty uses a long range scram (I have heard some people can point from 30+KM away), but since I also found out a large amount of people also use Sensor Boosters I am not sure if this will work and if I should use a different kind of method, something that will break the scram off me so I can warp away.

For BC I would be relying even more on drones and the EWAR method since the Neut range is severely shortened for Medium sized modules.

Does anyone have anything to add/improve and a better Idea on how I could imply EWAR in this defense?

And I say it again I am not trying to make a "frig killer" design, but a "Get em off me long enough to warp away" design, either by killing, driving them away or by breaking their lock on me.

Sorry for the long posts, this is just something that needs a bit more detail to explain.

Thank you in advance!

Dub Step
Death To Everyone But Us
#2 - 2014-05-23 08:18:49 UTC
If you have a utility hight, fit a neut. Flight of small drones as you mentioned. Other than that, if you can fit a web it will help. Large guns are never going to track something that small and fast if it is in range but you can try and catch it breaking point range or on the approach. BC's have a much higher chance of tracking frigs but you still need to pin them down or reduce their transversal.

Sensor damps would only force them in closer, where you will never track them.
Deerin
East Trading Co Ltd
#3 - 2014-05-23 08:52:16 UTC
Against those frigs that come close dual web + neut does very very bad things. Against those that stay away at 30k+, there is not much you can do. Use your MJD to get away if you are in BS or use your Mobile Micro Jump Unit if you are in BC.
Kaea Astridsson
Hoplite Brigade
Ushra'Khan
#4 - 2014-05-23 09:11:18 UTC
Though forcing them near with damps would most likely also force them into heavy neut range (25km), never had this used against but if I'm holding you at about 30km I'm also near the edge of my target range (My max is about 45km, point 28 cold no links). When you manage to slurp someone's cap, just send your flight of lights on them and they'll most likely be forced of field. Either way they'll lose point after a cycle of heavy neuts.

If you go for MJD - could maybe trick someone into scramming you, from where you'll want to apply scram, web, neut and drones. But really, if I'd see you start MJD I'll just go out in the direction you'll most likely land and grab point again.Covering that distance of 70-130km Think your window of opporunity using MJD will be an extra 5s.

Get on Comms, or die typing.
Chessur
Full Broadside
Deepwater Hooligans
#5 - 2014-05-23 10:58:15 UTC
Wotan The-Wise wrote:
7o All!

I have been thinking about a few tactics/fits to counter frigates and interceptors if they ever catch me when i'm SOLO in a BC or BS.

A few words before I start:
I know the best defense would be to avoid them in the first place, so I am not looking to make Super duper OP one size fits all Anti-frig killing battleship/cruiser that fill kill entire frigate fleets, this is a non specialized fit that I want to use when I am in a kitchen sink fleet or when I am traveling solo. Also with this fit/tactics I am not looking to necessarily kill the frigate/interceptor but to just get away from its hold and to be able to warp off before its friends arrive. So please no use "Small guns on a Battleship" suggestions.

So far many posts have mentioned Drones, in particular Tech 2 Warriors, but I have also read that many Inty pilots can just blap em while keeping me pointed. That is why I have been trying to come up with a multi layered defense that won't impact my overall fitting too much.

So far I came up with a combo of webs, neuts, tech 2 drones, MJD (applicable for BS) and some form of EWAR.
For EWAR I have been thinking about sensor dampeners in case a frig/inty uses a long range scram (I have heard some people can point from 30+KM away), but since I also found out a large amount of people also use Sensor Boosters I am not sure if this will work and if I should use a different kind of method, something that will break the scram off me so I can warp away.

For BC I would be relying even more on drones and the EWAR method since the Neut range is severely shortened for Medium sized modules.

Does anyone have anything to add/improve and a better Idea on how I could imply EWAR in this defense?

And I say it again I am not trying to make a "frig killer" design, but a "Get em off me long enough to warp away" design, either by killing, driving them away or by breaking their lock on me.

Sorry for the long posts, this is just something that needs a bit more detail to explain.

Thank you in advance!




Ok BC's are complete ****. So flying those is questionable. However if I was going to fly an amarr BC, it would be the navy harb. With an innate tracking bonus, and dual web and a medium neut- any inty that comes into web range is going to get insta killed with Multi. No ship in the game has a defense against a linked, RF point interceptor orbiting you at 50k. Unless you have an MJD, drones or damps- nothing is getting done there. THe only way to avoid this problem, is to get a mobile depot (50m3) pop that out, throw on some stabs- and warp to freedom.

As for BS, again really not the best ships in the current meta. The geddon may have a shot at killing an inty, however any other amarr BS will fall flat on its face. Bhallghorn is a nice option. However the Nightmare is simply OP and is far and away your best choice. Fit properly, with dual web, dual T2 Metastasis, and Dual heavy neut- any frigate within 25K of you should be instantly dead. But- like all the other ships, an RF point, linked interceptor can still hold long point on you forever. MJD is nice here, or you can use a mobile depot to throw on a few extra stabs- and fly to freedom.
Flyinghotpocket
Small Focused Memes
Ragequit Cancel Sub
#6 - 2014-05-23 13:35:50 UTC
when your solo, uh amarr doesnt really work on the bc bs level. its best to have a partner to help you out. 2 webs minimum. geddon is easy just fit heavy neuts GG.

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Garviel Tarrant
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#7 - 2014-05-23 14:16:27 UTC
Mob depo and stabs in cargo for refitting?

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Estella Osoka
Cranky Bitches Who PMS
#8 - 2014-05-23 14:39:08 UTC
Medium Micro Jump Drives are coming. Equiping one will help make the inty pilot have to come in closer and use scram. However, most inty pilots won't be alone.
Bronson Hughes
The Knights of the Blessed Mother of Acceleration
#9 - 2014-05-23 14:45:55 UTC
If you're worried about tackling frigates, try a Proph' or a 'Geddon. Both have drone bonuses so those pesky Warrior IIs suddenly become a threat and you'll have multiple waves of them to boot. Plus, on a 'Geddon the combination of range bonused heavy neuts plus a range-scripted damp should be effective against most frigates.

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Wotan The-Wise
Doomheim
#10 - 2014-05-23 19:44:35 UTC
Ty all for the response.

As a matter of fact I tested my defence plan with a friend last night. He had a crow with sensor booster scramming me at 34ish KM, i applied sensor dampeners with the range disrupting bonus and he had to come within 25km to reaquire the scram on me.
Then I applied 1 heavy neut with 25km range and he was instantly dead in the water. Throw that into the mix with Warrior 2s and a MJD I should definently be able to get away from a single tackler before his friends show up.

Still not to sure about a BC though. i guess mediums pulse lasers and drones might do the trick though.

As I stated before, its an emergency *oh crap lemme get away* strategy. There is no reason to fly a Geddon or Bhaalgorn (I would never fly my Bhaalgorn Solo ever) just for some neut and drone damage.

So for those people still wondering the same thing, you can make your battleship safe even against a long point tackler with a range dampening script and heavy neut alone (altough you may have to sacrifice a turret for that). Coupled with Tech 2 drones and MJD you should definitely be able to to get away to safety when traveling solo.

Tyvm everyone for your input. Hopefully this may help others as well
Rahelis
Doomheim
#11 - 2014-05-24 16:10:16 UTC  |  Edited by: Rahelis
Fly a geddon with a micro jump drive.

Stay at top speed all time and do not change heading.

Let your friends scram you - and hit the micro button.

You will micro jump as long your move with more than 75% curent top speed. You will not be able to micro jump when you fall under 75% current speed. Range given, you will hold all active targets locked.

Neuts and drones will eat ceptors. You can imporve drone speed with mods. No need to web them ceptors.