These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

EVE General Discussion

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

"Waste of dev time"
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
Xercodo
Cruor Angelicus
#41 - 2014-05-22 23:06:33 UTC
Felicity Love wrote:
Sibyyl wrote:
Well, ideally the devs are the puppets, CSM are the strings, and the players are controlling everything with their fingers. Of course the puppets end up being at pocket level so that they can fish out all the cash for subs and PLEXs.


Methinks you have the order, and the assigned "roles", somewhat out of sequence... Blink



I think she has the order right, in an ideal world anyway, but what she did forget to mention that the puppeteer has 20 heads all bitching at each other about how the show should be acted and as a result end up with the string all tangled and the puppet in a deadly contorted form.

The Drake is a Lie
Cipher Jones
The Thomas Edwards Taco Tuesday All Stars
#42 - 2014-05-23 00:29:13 UTC  |  Edited by: Cipher Jones
DaReaper wrote:
Cipher Jones wrote:
WoD, waste of dev time.

The time they had the devs write articles for and against gold ammo, waste of dev time.

The other things they did in the "18 months", waste of dev time.



Waste of resources, not dev time. Different devs worked on WoD. However, the money could of been used in eve, valk, legion, etc. So not quite the same thing.

And you do not know what came form WoD. If the tech used to make that, was imported into say, legion, or valk, or eve, and it made all three or one of the three better, which in turn gives ccp more resources, then WoD was not a waste.

Nothing is ever truly a waste


Yeah, I do actually. It was supposed to be the WiS engine. The one thats not ever going to be used. The one I've been waiting for for 5 years.

When they introduced CQ, a few people figured out how to play My Little Pony on the monitor in the CQ. So yeah, not a total waste.

internet spaceships

are serious business sir.

and don't forget it
Riyria Twinpeaks
Perkone
Caldari State
#43 - 2014-05-23 00:47:00 UTC
Sibyyl wrote:
Well, ideally the devs are the puppets, CSM are the strings, and the players are controlling everything with their fingers. Of course the puppets end up being at pocket level so that they can fish out all the cash for subs and PLEXs.


I disagree. I think many players are terrible game designers who, as someone above already mentioned, don't think things through to the end. And often enough people want things which actually would make the game less fun for themselves.

EVE seems to have a player base where this is less so, as far as I can judge, but giving all the control over the development to the players is a bad thing, imo.
Devs/game designers should listen to the players and should take feedback seriously, which is why I think the CSM is good thing to have, but then they need to do their job and if necessary also decide against player wishes.
Ra'Shyne Viper
Native Freshfood
#44 - 2014-05-23 01:43:58 UTC
Looks like the last year has been a waste of dev time, last year this month we were at 65k players online

Today we were at 37k WITH Dust players

This "refocus on rebalance" the playerbase wanted is really working out huh

DUST 514 player

Ingame name: Vin Vicious
Webvan
All Kill No Skill
#45 - 2014-05-23 01:48:03 UTC  |  Edited by: Webvan
Doreen Kaundur wrote:
Even CQ, with all it's redundant features and limited space adds to EVE's immersion.

meh, semi-stealth WiS thread...

James Amril-Kesh wrote:
Or maybe "what you asked for is stupid."

^pretty much. Not just that, but a necro topic long since abandoned by CCP and the player-base.

Suggest something original, maybe that conforms to the development direction CCP is in. Things outside of that, yes are a waste.


Ra'Shyne Viper wrote:
Looks like the last year has been a waste of dev time, last year this month we were at 65k players online

Today we were at 37k WITH Dust players

This "refocus on rebalance" the playerbase wanted is really working out huh

I don't recall ever seeing eve offline report 65k concurrent, more around 40k after a major update. Considering this game does not force you to be online and grinding a themepark, that's a pretty good number for EVE, and generally 20-30k being steady for ages.

I'm in it for the money

Ctrl+Alt+Shift+F12
CETA Elitist
The Prometheus Society
#46 - 2014-05-23 03:44:55 UTC
You humans are pathetic. Everything is a waste of time.

Go home.
Abrazzar
Vardaugas Family
#47 - 2014-05-23 03:48:20 UTC
I am a paying customer so the devs better do what I want them to or I will quit and then they go bankrupt!

Sovereignty and Population

New Mining Mechanics
Brooks Puuntai
Solar Nexus.
#48 - 2014-05-23 03:58:22 UTC
WiS, WoD, and Dust were all not a waste of dev time, but a failure of CCP to capitalize on them. Each in their own right could have been successful had CCP not spread their resources so thin which lead to each project being overly underdeveloped and at the same time allowing Eve to suffer. The scary part is CCP is once again going down that path with Legion and Valkyrie.

CCP's Motto: If it isn't broken, break it. If it is broken, ignore it. Improving NPE / Dynamic New Eden
James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#49 - 2014-05-23 09:15:54 UTC
"CCP should only develop one game ever it's not selfish it's just a coincidence that that happens to be the game I play."

Enjoying the rain today? ;)
Purity by Fire
Purity Tax Haven
#50 - 2014-05-23 11:40:28 UTC
CCP making a vid about a rifter flying through there office was a "waste of time"
Actually that was pretty funny.

This thread is wasting my time

So like after 76 petitions I still dont have a logical normal answer.   Fly safe and fly true and use your headset on the Loo
Reiisha
#51 - 2014-05-23 12:20:25 UTC  |  Edited by: Reiisha
Doreen Kaundur wrote:
This always makes me laugh:

You suggest or debate implementing a feature in EVE, and someone brings up how it "would be a waste of dev time."

Or how so called "fluff" features are a "waste of dev time."

Waste of dev time?

Just how do you define such a statement?

So if it doesn't cater to your little corner of this massive sandbox called EVE, it is a waste of dev time?

Personally I feel that anything that adds to this space sim simulation is never a waste of dev time.

Even CQ, with all it's redundant features and limited space adds to EVE's immersion.

So what is a waste of dev's time?

*Hilmar having the dev team over to paint his house on company time, is a waste of dev time.
*Showing up all stinky and hungover at work at CCP after kegger, is a waste of dev time.

Adding something nice to EVE ,however minor, is never a waste of dev time IMO.

My .02isk



The problem here is that most people think people working in IT or at game developers can do *everything*.

The artists, who were hired to design and build models and textures for avatars for example, should also be able to program a new physics engine and fix UI bugs in the minds of these people.

They also think that 'more is better' and that 10 people working on one line of code is better than just 1 guy working on it.

There's a distinct lack of perspective on how game development works, as well as the unwillingness to learn about it, yet they complain anyway claiming they know everything about it.

So what it comes down to: People who complain about such things are jerks.

Webvan wrote:

Ra'Shyne Viper wrote:
Looks like the last year has been a waste of dev time, last year this month we were at 65k players online

Today we were at 37k WITH Dust players

This "refocus on rebalance" the playerbase wanted is really working out huh

I don't recall ever seeing eve offline report 65k concurrent, more around 40k after a major update. Considering this game does not force you to be online and grinding a themepark, that's a pretty good number for EVE, and generally 20-30k being steady for ages.


Ra-Shyne forgot to mention that this was on EVE's 10th birthday, where people were explicitely rallied to show up in numbers on sunday evening. The PCU is about 67k from that evening i believe.

That said, the average and peak PCU has stagnated since a while now, that much is obvious. I blame activities which can be done AFK... Like PI for example ;p

If you do things right, people won't be sure you've done anything at all...
Liam Inkuras
Furnace
Thermodynamics
#52 - 2014-05-23 12:22:29 UTC
Reading this was a waste of my time.

I wear my goggles at night.

Any spelling/grammatical errors come complimentary with my typing on a phone
Doreen Kaundur
#53 - 2014-05-23 13:08:39 UTC
Liam Inkuras wrote:
Reading this was a waste of my time.


You breathing is a waste of time. Roll

[center]1. Minor navigation color change. 2. Show bookmarks in the overview.[/center]
Sibyyl
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#54 - 2014-05-23 18:48:28 UTC
Riyria Twinpeaks wrote:
Sibyyl wrote:
Well, ideally the devs are the puppets, CSM are the strings, and the players are controlling everything with their fingers. Of course the puppets end up being at pocket level so that they can fish out all the cash for subs and PLEXs.


I disagree. I think many players are terrible game designers who, as someone above already mentioned, don't think things through to the end. And often enough people want things which actually would make the game less fun for themselves.

EVE seems to have a player base where this is less so, as far as I can judge, but giving all the control over the development to the players is a bad thing, imo.
Devs/game designers should listen to the players and should take feedback seriously, which is why I think the CSM is good thing to have, but then they need to do their job and if necessary also decide against player wishes.

I apologize. I have a pretty dry sense of humor and it never comes across that well in writing. There was a show called Heroes which I enjoyed early in its Season 1, but there were characters on it (like Sylar who was meant to be an antihero) who started flip-flopping because the viewers were given an inordinate amount of power in their feedback. The show eventually destroyed its continuity and viewership tanked.

I think it's good to be mindful of what people want, but in the back of a game producer's mind they should also know that the customer really doesn't know what he wants.

Joffy Aulx-Gao for CSM. Fix links and OGB. Ban stabs from plexes. Fulfill karmic justice.
Alaric Faelen
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#55 - 2014-05-23 18:52:36 UTC
Incarna. Complete waste of time.

1) It wasn't internet spaceships. It did nothing to improve internet spaceships. (Eve is a game about internet spaceships)

2) It was abandoned. While most of us were only too happy to see Space Barbie die in it's crib, the fact remains it was a major investment by CCP into a total dead end.
Incarna was an entire expansion. One of only two we got per year (until this year when CCP decided we don't even deserve that anymore) and it was incomplete at launch, completely extraneous to the actual game of Eve Online, and remains little more than concept art some years later.

For all intents and purposes, Incarna was like CCP skipped an expansion. We got more actual content out of patches following Incarna than the expansion itself.

But, the silver lining to that debacle was CCP remembered that Eve is about internet spaceships and gave us Tiericide and several really strong expansions after that. Crucible was the expansion we all had wanted/been expecting all along, instead six months earlier we got Space Barbie and vanity items.

Jenn aSide
Worthless Carebears
The Initiative.
#56 - 2014-05-23 18:58:23 UTC
Sibyyl wrote:

I think it's good to be mindful of what people want, but in the back of a game producer's mind they should also know that the customer really doesn't know what he wants.


Myth #21

I should start linking that when i see people put forward some tired old idea in "you know what would be great for EVE" fashion.
Cpt Tirel
Institute For Continuous Glory
#57 - 2014-05-23 19:18:54 UTC
Alaric Faelen wrote:
Incarna. Complete waste of time.

1) It wasn't internet spaceships. It did nothing to improve internet spaceships. (Eve is a game about internet spaceships)

2) It was abandoned. While most of us were only too happy to see Space Barbie die in it's crib, the fact remains it was a major investment by CCP into a total dead end.
Incarna was an entire expansion. One of only two we got per year (until this year when CCP decided we don't even deserve that anymore) and it was incomplete at launch, completely extraneous to the actual game of Eve Online, and remains little more than concept art some years later.

For all intents and purposes, Incarna was like CCP skipped an expansion. We got more actual content out of patches following Incarna than the expansion itself.

But, the silver lining to that debacle was CCP remembered that Eve is about internet spaceships and gave us Tiericide and several really strong expansions after that. Crucible was the expansion we all had wanted/been expecting all along, instead six months earlier we got Space Barbie and vanity items.



Im so tired of hearing "EVE is about internet spaceships." as if it cannot be about anything else. Who cares as long as its is a good game??
This attitude reminds me of OLD politicians who refuse to let anything change untill they die of age. When you ask them for a reason, you get none because the only reason is their personal preference.

Barbies you say? Yes. Ill have you know that my nerd-barbie can rip a gizzly bear in half with her bionic arms. Oh yea!!
Little Dragon Khamez
Guardians of the Underworld
#58 - 2014-05-23 22:30:15 UTC
Jenn aSide wrote:
Doreen Kaundur wrote:
This always makes me laugh:

You suggest or debate implementing a feature in EVE, and someone brings up how it "would be a waste of dev time."

Or how so called "fluff" features are a "waste of dev time."

Waste of dev time?

Just how do you define such a statement?

So if it doesn't cater to your little corner of this massive sandbox called EVE, it is a waste of dev time?

Personally I feel that anything that adds to this space sim simulation is never a waste of dev time.

Even CQ, with all it's redundant features and limited space adds to EVE's immersion.

So what is a waste of dev's time?

*Hilmar having the dev team over to paint his house on company time, is a waste of dev time.
*Showing up all stinky and hungover at work at CCP after kegger, is a waste of dev time.

Adding something nice to EVE ,however minor, is never a waste of dev time IMO.

My .02isk


lol, this is the same kind of naive thinking that caused CCP a whole bunch of problems and led to them having to "re-focus" on certain things after a certain explosion of anger + monument shooting and bad press.

Every idea isn't a good idea, and sometimes Good ideas are actually impossible to implement, and even if you could, they are still subject to the same kinds of unintended consequences as bad ideas would be, The old saying that "the road to hell is paved with good intentions" is IMO true.

The best way to progress is through careful examination and is based on need, not "i have a brilliant idea that is totally going to work well for all the people who own the 400,000 EVE accounts and could not possibly go wrong" lol.


The odyssey expansion is a perfect example of good intentions found on the road to hell.

Dumbing down of Eve Online will result in it's destruction...
Gully Alex Foyle
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#59 - 2014-05-23 23:48:50 UTC
Cpt Tirel wrote:
Barbies you say? Yes. Ill have you know that my nerd-barbie can rip a gizzly bear in half with her bionic arms. Oh yea!!

The grizzly would just bounce off your nerd-barbie's gigantic boobs.

Seriously dude, did you hack the character creation tool???

Make space glamorous! Is EVE dying or not? Ask the EVE-O Death-o-meter!
Cygnet Lythanea
World Welfare Works Association
#60 - 2014-05-24 04:19:01 UTC
First lesson of posting on the forums:

If carebears like it, nullbears whine it's a waste of dev time.

If nullbears like it, carebears whine it's a waste of dev time.

This counts double in threads asking for the Jukebox back. Because that was a waste of dev time better suited for integrating TwitchTV, a feature even fewer people use.

Triple if if involves any eve related play that does not in some way generate immediate tears, because playing the long game is just plain beyond some people.